Attention WPBA....How is this fair?

1

1on1pooltournys

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It was recently brought to my attention that Karen Corr and Julie Kelley were playing in a WPBA women's regional qualifying event in Evansville, Indiana this weekend. The event is for women who are mostly of an amateur status and are trying to put their skills to the test and hopefully win a spot to play in a WPBA event. So, my question to the WPBA is how is it fair to have two former world champions, that play in every WPBA event and have no reason (other than monetary value) to play in this regional qualifying event? I mean, they have a huge amount of significance on who actually wins the qualifying spot! Depending on the draw, they could easily knock out women that have the best chance at winning in an event, and allow a weaker player to end up with the qualifying spot. This particular tournament, as I understand, was 1500 added and had an entry fee of 200 dollars. They should just hand Karen and Julie 1st and 2nd place prize money, and say thanks for coming. Anything would be better than allowing them to manipulate the entire field and be deciding factors in who wins this qualifying spot that all these girls want!! So, these girls traveled, payed expenses and had visions of having a nice chance at winning the tournament and a WPBA qualifying spot, only to show up and find two WPBA champions waiting for them when they arrived. The $200 entry fee is kind of high, but most girls will pay it in order to compete with other women of their skill level and earn a spot in a pro event. How in the world do you expect the amount of participants to rise if they know they have to beat Karen Corr and pay $200 entry fees? I'm sorry, but in my opinion, this is simply not fair to these girls. I could understand top WPBA pros playing in State Tournaments, but regional events is really not right. I mean the idea is to compete with people of your skill level on a regional level, step your game up and play in a State event, and eventually get a shot at competing with WPBA pros. I really think this is a quirk in the qualifying system that needs fixed in order to see your number of participants increase, and to see the sport grow for the WPBA.

Sorry for the long post, but I felt that this needed addressed. Any explanations, thoughts, or am I just overreacting?
 
It's always been that way. Pros have always played in these kind of regional qualifiers. Not saying it's fair, just the way it's always been.
 
1on1pooltournys said:
It was recently brought to my attention that Karen Corr and Julie Kelley were playing in a WPBA women's regional qualifying event in Evansville, Indiana this weekend. The event is for women who are mostly of an amateur status and are trying to put their skills to the test and hopefully win a spot to play in a WPBA event. So, my question to the WPBA is how is it fair to have two former world champions, that play in every WPBA event and have no reason (other than monetary value) to play in this regional qualifying event? I mean, they have a huge amount of significance on who actually wins the qualifying spot! Depending on the draw, they could easily knock out women that have the best chance at winning in an event, and allow a weaker player to end up with the qualifying spot. This particular tournament, as I understand, was 1500 added and had an entry fee of 200 dollars. They should just hand Karen and Julie 1st and 2nd place prize money, and say thanks for coming. Anything would be better than allowing them to manipulate the entire field and be deciding factors in who wins this qualifying spot that all these girls want!! So, these girls traveled, payed expenses and had visions of having a nice chance at winning the tournament and a WPBA qualifying spot, only to show up and find two WPBA champions waiting for them when they arrived. The $200 entry fee is kind of high, but most girls will pay it in order to compete with other women of their skill level and earn a spot in a pro event. How in the world do you expect the amount of participants to rise if they know they have to beat Karen Corr and pay $200 entry fees? I'm sorry, but in my opinion, this is simply not fair to these girls. I could understand top WPBA pros playing in State Tournaments, but regional events is really not right. I mean the idea is to compete with people of your skill level on a regional level, step your game up and play in a State event, and eventually get a shot at competing with WPBA pros. I really think this is a quirk in the qualifying system that needs fixed in order to see your number of participants increase, and to see the sport grow for the WPBA.

Sorry for the long post, but I felt that this needed addressed. Any explanations, thoughts, or am I just overreacting?
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You do have a point. The entry fee is too steep, and it definitely takes away opportunities for the non-pro's.

There will always be arguments in favor or against Pro participation. Venue owners sometimes believe that announcing Pro's in the event will atract more participation but that is not necesarilly the case. I would have made the event non-pro but then whom am I to decide what the WPA does in their events.?
 
I have brought this up before on here and got flamed for it. I don't believe any por should play in a WPBA qualifier. One tour (Spirit in FL.) had a pro win just about every tour stop for years. They have no more tour. It's not fair for the pros to take more than half the purse eah stop, leaving peanuts for the rest.

Some will say the girls want to play the pros to get them ready for the big tour. If the few (and believe me it's only a few) want to play better players let them play in some open regionals...they'll get to play plenty of players better than them. One of the reasons that the OB Cue Tour in Texas is #1 is because ne pros are allowed to play. Johnnyt
 
Johnnyt said:
I have brought this up before on here and got flamed for it. I don't believe any por should play in a WPBA qualifier. One tour (Spirit in FL.) had a pro win just about every tour stop for years. They have no more tour. It's not fair for the pros to take more than half the purse eah stop, leaving peanuts for the rest.

Some will say the girls want to play the pros to get them ready for the big tour. If the few (and believe me it's only a few) want to play better players let them play in some open regionals...they'll get to play plenty of players better than them. One of the reasons that the OB Cue Tour in Texas is #1 is because ne pros are allowed to play. Johnnyt
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I don't see why people would flame somebody for it, as it is a very valid argument, and something should be done. They should set some type of ruling that no top 32 women can play in regional tournaments, at least.
 
1on1pooltournys said:
I don't see why people would flame somebody for it, as it is a very valid argument, and something should be done. They should set some type of ruling that no top 32 women can play in regional tournaments, at least.
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That is how the tournament for the Fast Eddie's Tour is ran in Texas...They have 2 tournaments for the weekend, an Open and the womens tourney...No top 32 pro women can play in the womens tournament they have to play in the Open... Even then, they would have a hard time winning the open, with the likes of the usual crowd, Hillbilly Bryant, Shane VB, David G, Sylver O, etc..etc..
 
Johnnyt said:
I have brought this up before on here and got flamed for it. I don't believe any por should play in a WPBA qualifier. One tour (Spirit in FL.) had a pro win just about every tour stop for years. They have no more tour. It's not fair for the pros to take more than half the purse eah stop, leaving peanuts for the rest.

Some will say the girls want to play the pros to get them ready for the big tour. If the few (and believe me it's only a few) want to play better players let them play in some open regionals...they'll get to play plenty of players better than them. One of the reasons that the OB Cue Tour in Texas is #1 is because ne pros are allowed to play. Johnnyt
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It doesn't make sense to me for Karen Corr to be allowed to play in a WPBA Qualifier. I don't know a lot about Julie Kelly's game other than she's a good player, but Karen is on TV often and one of the top female players. I don't think they should be allowed to play in a qualifier and take away the chance for an up and coming player.

James
 
The tournaments are really just tournaments with the added bonus that the winner or top finishing person who needs it is given a spot in an upcoming WPBA event. The money to pay for the entry fee comes from all the participants.

I agree with no pros in these events. If you have reached Touring Pro status, meaning that you no longer have to qualify then you should stay away from such events where women are there trying for that coveted spot. Because it IS true that the draw could knock out the best amateur player because she comes up against the pros early.

You don't see professionals entering lower level golf or tennis events.

I also agree that it's unfair for the pros to rob these tournaments and take all the prize money. The women who are trying to qualify for the WPBA also need to make their nut on the road and the extra $500 or $1000 that they can win helps to pay the bills. If the pros want to make money then show up and rent a table and do $10 challenge matches all weekend, give clinics, do whatever but don't effectively steal the money from the aspiring players.
 
JB Cases said:
The tournaments are really just tournaments with the added bonus that the winner or top finishing person who needs it is given a spot in an upcoming WPBA event. The money to pay for the entry fee comes from all the participants.

I agree with no pros in these events. If you have reached Touring Pro status, meaning that you no longer have to qualify then you should stay away from such events where women are there trying for that coveted spot. Because it IS true that the draw could knock out the best amateur player because she comes up against the pros early.

You don't see professionals entering lower level golf or tennis events.

I also agree that it's unfair for the pros to rob these tournaments and take all the prize money. The women who are trying to qualify for the WPBA also need to make their nut on the road and the extra $500 or $1000 that they can win helps to pay the bills. If the pros want to make money then show up and rent a table and do $10 challenge matches all weekend, give clinics, do whatever but don't effectively steal the money from the aspiring players.
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Great post and I agree. It's a hold-up w/o a gun when pros play amatuers. Johnnyt
 
JB Cases said:
The tournaments are really just tournaments with the added bonus that the winner or top finishing person who needs it is given a spot in an upcoming WPBA event. The money to pay for the entry fee comes from all the participants.

I agree with no pros in these events. If you have reached Touring Pro status, meaning that you no longer have to qualify then you should stay away from such events where women are there trying for that coveted spot. Because it IS true that the draw could knock out the best amateur player because she comes up against the pros early.

You don't see professionals entering lower level golf or tennis events.

I also agree that it's unfair for the pros to rob these tournaments and take all the prize money. The women who are trying to qualify for the WPBA also need to make their nut on the road and the extra $500 or $1000 that they can win helps to pay the bills. If the pros want to make money then show up and rent a table and do $10 challenge matches all weekend, give clinics, do whatever but don't effectively steal the money from the aspiring players.
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Very nice insight. I especially like the part of the challenge matches. I think the top pros would make a much better impression if they went to these tournaments with the attitude of supporting the other girls, and trying to market themselves and the WPBA, and not just showing up to steal the prize money. Karen has won Joss tournaments with very good male players, she really has no business in these events.
 
JB Cases said:
You don't see professionals entering lower level golf or tennis events.
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PGA Tour pros make enough money that they do not need to play in lower level events. But when you make your living as a pro pool player you have to do what you have to do. Not saying it is right, I'm just saying...
 
Was this a qualifier, to play in the WPBA Open?
If so, wouldn't that be the forum to play the pros. If not, maybe this was that opportunity.
 
Worminator said:
PGA Tour pros make enough money that they do not need to play in lower level events. But when you make your living as a pro pool player you have to do what you have to do. Not saying it is right, I'm just saying...
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I fully understand the financial aspect. I think that sometimes you have to take the high road though even though that may not be the best thing for your pocketbook.

I am 100% certain that if I were a top pro I could make a decent living giving exhibitions and clinics without the need to rob amateur tournaments.

I would first make deals with all the local pool rooms and set up dates that I would be there. Then I'd print flyers and put them out everywhere I could and in the free community papers as well.

Then on exhibition night I'd play a feature challenge match, then take on all comers for a $10 game with pictures.

This is the set up I did at the shows that worked GREAT.

I had a printer setup to print on 4x6 photo paper. I had a template set up on the computer with a frame that listed the event and date and the Fury logo on it. I had the camera set up to take only 4x6 pics and had the distance and spot taped off to insure that people were perfectly in frame.

I would snap a pic - pop into the template and hit print and a minute later there was a custom souvenir for Kelly to sign for the fan. Worked like a charm and we had a line out the door of people wanting to play a challenge game and get a picture.

This is a SUPER EASY thing to do with nothing more than commonly available and cheap equipment.

Now, maybe the pros can't be bothered to do this type of work. Maybe they need someone like me to do it - fine figure out the money and hire someone. The world is full of pool groupies who would love the chance to hang with the pros and make a little money on top of it.

The point being that doing what you "have" to do doesn't always mean that you have to rob people. You can make money off of your skills in other ways that makes everyone happy about you being there.
 
Karen, Julie, Kim, Val, Jen, Miyuki, Xpan, GYK, myself and 10's more all qualified and stayed on tour through these regional tours all over the USA and it cost us $$$$$$.

Without sounding funny here, it was fine to play against me and the other girls I've mentioned when we were qualifing because we were not Pro ???? If there are girls out there who are good enough to be on the WPBA, and stay on the WPBA then if they win a spot whilst there are Pro's in the event, then they fully deserve it.

How many girls have come and gone after one event after going 2&out after winning a soft regional tour event, and feeling "Am I really good enough for this?" Beat a pro on the way, and yes you do belong there.

Being on the WPBA is still very costly unless we cash high in each event, and also we have only had one event since last Nov. I personally don't think you can knock us for wanting to make some money and getting in some match practice. Most of the tours love having Pro's show up on there tours, it's great for the room owners and makes it easier for sponsorship negotiations for the events if the room are having a Pro or two show up.

Last thing on thing on this subject for me is, most of the RT's only allow Pro's in the State Championships, of course all are different, but if we are allowed in the event, then yes if we are available, then why not play?
 
Pro players playing in regional WPBA qualifer events are not elligible to win the qualifier. It goes to the highest finishing non-pro. The pros are only elligible to win the money.

As someone said, pro pool players make so little money, they need to enter regional events to meet their expenses. Anyone who thinks a WPBA pro can earn a living in the six classic events, and the one satellite event, currently on their schedule is sadly mistaken. They have to finish high in every event, just to meet their expenses. Even the likes of Karen Corr and Julie Kelley have not been finishing high in every event recently.

IMHO, pros should be allowed to play in all regional events. It serves several purposes.
Room owners can draw more business by advertising the pros.
It allows regional players to measure themselves against the pros.
Playing in competition helps the pros get ready for the big tournaments.

The bottom line is, if the regional players want to win a WPBA qualifier, they have to be ready to play the pros when they get to the WPBA event. By playing against them in the regional events, they won't be so much in awe of the pros, if and when they get to a WPBA event.

BTW, a number of pros and former pros play in JPNEWT regional tournaments on a regular basis. They don't always win, as some may think. The main result has been a number of JPNEWT players making it to the WPBA. I just scanned the WPBA rankings quickly and I counted at least 24 ranked players who I believe have played in JPNEWT events, or other regional events in my area.
 
I have been fortunate enough to play in some tournaments that a couple of pros played in. I gotta tell you, it was a great experience. It really gave me an insight to how the game can be played better. It also opened up my eyes to the weak areas of my game and what I want to work on to be more competitive. I welcome the challenge. I welcome the growth that my game gets after playing a pro. What a great opportunity to gauge where one's game is really at. So...keep on coming pros.....I will get to where I need to be because of you guys!!
 
Kelly Fisher said:
Karen, Julie, Kim, Val, Jen, Miyuki, Xpan, GYK, myself and 10's more all qualified and stayed on tour through these regional tours all over the USA and it cost us $$$$$$.

Without sounding funny here, it was fine to play against me and the other girls I've mentioned when we were qualifing because we were not Pro ???? If there are girls out there who are good enough to be on the WPBA, and stay on the WPBA then if they win a spot whilst there are Pro's in the event, then they fully deserve it.

How many girls have come and gone after one event after going 2&out after winning a soft regional tour event, and feeling "Am I really good enough for this?" Beat a pro on the way, and yes you do belong there.

Being on the WPBA is still very costly unless we cash high in each event, and also we have only had one event since last Nov. I personally don't think you can knock us for wanting to make some money and getting in some match practice. Most of the tours love having Pro's show up on there tours, it's great for the room owners and makes it easier for sponsorship negotiations for the events if the room are having a Pro or two show up.

Last thing on thing on this subject for me is, most of the RT's only allow Pro's in the State Championships, of course all are different, but if we are allowed in the event, then yes if we are available, then why not play?
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I do not blame the players, at all. I just think that once somebody, like yourself, becomes a touring pro and is ranked in the top 32 they should not be allowed to compete in regional tour events. Of course if they allow you to play, you are supposed to play. I just think the sponsors and/or room owners should give you guys the prize money so that you do not interfere with the outcome of those wishing to win a qualifying spot.
 
1on1pooltournys said:
I do not blame the players, at all. I just think that once somebody, like yourself, becomes a touring pro and is ranked in the top 32 they should not be allowed to compete in regional tour events. Of course if they allow you to play, you are supposed to play. I just think the sponsors and/or room owners should give you guys the prize money so that you do not interfere with the outcome of those wishing to win a qualifying spot.
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so these women are trying to win a spot to play with the pros but are complaining because pros are playing in the qualifying tourney? how does this make sense?
 
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