Back To Elbow Dropping..........

[Cornerman]

"They do" is the answer to the wrong question. Should it be minimized is the right question, to which I think the answer is yes.

pj
chgo

I think you're right, but I think a good starting point is to simply admit that "they do." Then maybe coherent and logical conversation can happen. If people are stuck on "they don't," then future discussion becomes pretty fruitless.

And that's how this thread started. The OP finally noticed that "they do."

Fred

 

[Patrick Johnson]

I think you're right, but I think a good starting point is to simply admit that "they do." Then maybe coherent and logical conversation can happen. If people are stuck on "they don't," then future discussion becomes pretty fruitless.

And that's how this thread started. The OP finally noticed that "they do."

Fred

I think a good starting point is to simply admit that "they do."

Yes, and you've shown convincingly that they do. In my usual bumbling way, I'm trying to stand on your shoulders and advance the conversation to the "but..." stage.

Sorry if I seemed to imply your answer was off point or something.

Coincidentally, I was noticing last night while videoing my stroke that my elbow drops *less* than I expected (but I have a swoop in my finish -damn!).

pj
chgo

 

[Boro Nut]

"They do" is the answer to the wrong question. Should it be minimized is the right question, to which I think the answer is yes.

pj
chgo

So the answer is "Yes they do"

Boro Nut

 

[seymore15074]

So the answer is "Yes they do"

Boro Nut

That is soooooooooooooooooooooooo hilarious, read that last post carefully.

 

[GADawg]

I was playing 9 ball tonight in Shanghai and Chao Fong Pang was playing on the table beside us.

I watched him carefully and he dropped his elbow on almost every shot and on long power shots the drop was severe.

I started to go over and explain to him that I could help him with his mechanics, but decided just to let him suffer.

 

[DrCue'sProtege]

that was big of you GADawg. i think the next time i am down in Owensboro i am going to look up Nick Varner and tell him he drops his elbow too much, and that he's lucky to have ever won anything............

DCP

 

[Bob Jewett]

that was big of you GADawg. i think the next time i am down in Owensboro i am going to look up Nick Varner and tell him he drops his elbow too much, and that he's lucky to have ever won anything............

DCP

Actually, the last time I watched Nick carefully, I saw that he is like a lot of players. On soft shots, his elbow does not move. On firm/power shots, his upper arm drops about its own thickness at the end of the shot.

About watching Nick.... He used to play regularly in the pool hall in my town since that is where his in-laws live. He was shooting one-pocket shootout over several days. That's where you break the balls and run as many as you can into one pocket and see how many you can make in five racks. So here was one of the best one pocket players in the world in a game that taxed him to his limit and most of the time I was the only person watching. I thought of it as 16 hours of free lessons.

If you do go to Owensboro, say hello to Nick for me.

 

[JoeyA]

Not according to the top snooker coach in the UK - See bottom of page

http://www.fcsnooker.co.uk/intermediate/cue_action/cue_action.htm

or the top of this page

http://www.fcsnooker.co.uk/basics/the_grip/the_grip.htm

On the other hand I have also found an Irish coach now working in Qatar who insists that the elbow must be dropped. See page 7

http://www.ribsa.net/Coaching/PJ Nolan Coaching Guide.pdf

Another thread with Hendry

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=71088

Scaramouche, I really have to give it to you man. You bring up some of the most interesting and valuable links to improve your game that I have ever seen. Have to see about sending you some more REP.

Thanks,
JoeyA

 

[Craig Fales]

uh, what???

Only allow your elbow to drop on delivery.

Allowing your elbow to drop, creates the
natural drive which gives you the power.

As the cue arm drops, it enhances the grip
to shut and close on the cue.

^ ^ ^ From PJ Nolans snooker coaching...this is why I can shoot a ball from 8 feet away and draw the CB straight back over 9 feet...no rails involved...

 

[Patrick Johnson]

I have also found an Irish coach now working in Qatar who insists that the elbow must be dropped.

I believe both "schools of thought" are right: you shouldn't drop your elbow before contacting the cue ball, but you must drop it for the follow through, especially if you're hitting harder. The big myth in this topic is that there's a real contradiction or disagreement.

pj
chgo

 

[Scott Lee]

you must drop it for the follow through, especially if you're hitting harder.

pj
chgo

Pat...One HAS to drop their elbow for followthrough, especially if you're hitting harder??? I think not! Perhaps you'd like to place a wager on this ridiculous statement?

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Pat...One HAS to drop their elbow for followthrough, especially if you're hitting harder??? I think not! Perhaps you'd like to place a wager on this ridiculous statement?

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Well, that sounds satisfyingly mano a mano, but it would take less time for me to learn something if you just explain what you mean instead. I suspect you're misinterpreting my comment, since I think we mostly agree on things like this.

(And sorry if I was careless in how I spoke to you in another thread, although I don't remember it. Was it the aiming thing?)

pj
chgo

 

[kildegirl]

Piston Stroke

Bet a part of you was just dying inside, wanting to get out and make another post after about a week of being held in check, wasn't there! LOL

A good question, but as has been mentioned , this topic has been beat to death recently. You MUST have read that thread(s), so how 'bout coming up with a new question?

[The same old post by regular posters, (not new posters that probably haven't seen them), is one of the things that irritate people. (hint, hint)]

USE THE PISTON STROKE

 

[CaptiveBred]

Pat...One HAS to drop their elbow for followthrough, especially if you're hitting harder??? I think not! Perhaps you'd like to place a wager on this ridiculous statement?

Scott Lee

I'd consider placing a wager that my elbow drop will empty your wallet Then you will know what I know...

 

[BlindWizard]

An elbow drop only becomes a fatal stroke flaw if the drop happens before the start of the forward swing. Many great players have an elbow drop on the forward swing either before or after contact. All great players initiate the forward swing at the high elbow position.

 

[Scott Lee]

Pat...What I mean is that it is NOT necessary to drop the elbow, regardless of how hard you shoot. Sure, plenty of players do it...but to say that you have to is just not true.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Well, that sounds satisfyingly mano a mano, but it would take less time for me to learn something if you just explain what you mean instead. I suspect you're misinterpreting my comment, since I think we mostly agree on things like this.

(And sorry if I was careless in how I spoke to you in another thread, although I don't remember it. Was it the aiming thing?)

pj
chgo

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Pat...What I mean is that it is NOT necessary to drop the elbow, regardless of how hard you shoot. Sure, plenty of players do it...but to say that you have to is just not true.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I think we're probably talking about a difference of magnitude, Scott. I get the impression that people in this thread are considering any slight elbow movement to be a "drop", so I'm trying to speak the same language. I see a slight elbow drop (an inch or two) after contact with the cue ball just about every time anybody shoots a firm to hard shot. I don't think it's a requirement for harder shots, but it seems inevitable that the momentum of the forearm pulls the elbow down a little at the finish when it can't bend any more.

pj
chgo
chgo

 

[klockdoc]

I think we're probably talking about a difference of magnitude, Scott. I get the impression that people in this thread are considering any slight elbow movement to be a "drop", so I'm trying to speak the same language. I see a slight elbow drop (an inch or two) after contact with the cue ball just about every time anybody shoots a firm to hard shot. I don't think it's a requirement for harder shots, but it seems inevitable that the momentum of the forearm pulls the elbow down a little at the finish when it can't bend any more.

pj
chgo
chgo

Here, analyze this. Doesn't appear that Efren is shooting the ball that hard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5FUKbamtSE&mode=related&search=

 

[Purdman]

i've been watching some of my Accu-Stats tapes over this past weekend of the 1994 U.S. Open Final between Efren and Nick Varner. also been watching the 2002 Hasseroder World Pool Championship Final between Earl and Francisco Bustamante.

one thing is very clear to me...........they are dropping their elbows. and at times its a very noticeable drop. there was a shot by Varner where he dropped his elbow so much it just sort of leaped out at me it was so noticeable.

what to make of this, i just dont know............

DCP

DCP, it is OK to drop your elbow after you stroke the ball. As long as your tip is traveling thru the cue ball in a linear motion, not up or down, you can drop all you want.
Purdman

 

[Scott Lee]

Don...The reason for not dropping the elbow is to keep the stroke moving in a linear (straight line) movement. This is much more easily done with no elbow drop, as the elbow, as a hinge, only opens and closes one way. The shoulder, which becomes involved with dropping the elbow, is a ball & socket, which allows the cue to be moved many different ways, and makes it very difficult to keep the stroke linear.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

DCP, it is OK to drop your elbow after you stroke the ball. As long as your tip is traveling thru the cue ball in a linear motion, not up or down, you can drop all you want.
Purdman