Bad Tournaments, Tournament Directors and Promoters

[Fast Lenny]

In some states you have to a charitable gaming license to do a Calcutta, when you do this a percentage of the Calcutta has to go to the charitable organization. On top of that you may be responsible for taxes on that money also. So don't complain about things unless you know the laws that are involved.

If these TDs announce they are donating 10% or whatever to charity that is wonderful but I have a feeling they put it in their pockets. If a calcutta has $5000 and $500 in being pocketed from players for someone holding the cash or whatever that is a bit extreme to me and even more extreme when I have heard numbers of 20-30%!

 

[Fast Lenny]

Well I just saw this and I am the Pool hall owner that indeed had this $1500 not $2000 entry event scheduled...KINDA....the issue was a new tour was starting up called the eastern ohio tour etc....I was to be the 2nd or 3rd stop...that director had a huge falling out with players and that was his text that threw Mike Janis under the bus etc...I eliminated him from the event at my location because I run many successful tournaments yearly and I do believe I pay out more money than any tournament in the country. I also run the regional bcapl championships where I have paid out over $40K and $44k the last 2 years.

I tried to save this event for the ONE pocket and had 15 spots filled until the original tour director was removed...I contacted everyone involved and we had 12 confirmed with many posting the $500 deposit to secure their spot. Unfortunately TODAY...and this week 7 players backed out for numerous reasons of pure bullshit...so players that paid up front- Cory Deuel, darren appleton, scott frost, shannon murphy, ellis elliot, ike runnels - end up getting the worst of the entire situation...we had many players supposedly playing that either their backer stepped down or decided not to put them in...then we had players decide not to play and play each other instead...regardless it didn't end up happening and it hurts me, the players that paid, the fans that want to come see them and pool in general...this is why Billiards WILL NEVER be a world class sport like it should be...

I will be trying this event again in November at Mountaineer Casino in Chester WV...

Players that were signed up and then either backed out or their backer took them off the list include

Larry Nevel
Dee Atkins
Brian White
Chris Bartrum
Brandon Shuff
Chip Compton
Joey Gray
Adam Smith
Danny Smith
Dennis Orcullo

I tried to fill it with other players but it was too spur of the moment...so we will try again in November..

I just wanted to clear it up so you know the truth...next time the money WILL BE COLLECTED ahead of time and if not then the event will not happen with plenty of time to not hurt any of the players, fans, or myself...thank you for your time.

I have heard that you are a good room owner and I hope you can pull the event off. Getting the money collected ahead of time is key and I believe seasoned guys like Jay Helfert do so with the 10 ball event at Derby. If you had 6 guys paid in full and 6 others who paid a $500 deposit then why not have the 6 who paid in full play round robin for it all with maybe top 2 being paid? I think giving those guys a chance to still play and win money when they have already paid expenses would make sense.

 

[PETROBOY]

Why don't the players ask when they sign up? It's no secret that it happens. These guys need to be paid too. No one is going to do that for nothing, same with a Calcutta if he's not making anything off it, lots won't do it. I think it's unfair to blame a td because the players don't know. They have to ask.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BasementDweller]

If these TDs announce they are donating 10% or whatever to charity that is wonderful but I have a feeling they put it in their pockets. If a calcutta has $5000 and $500 in being pocketed from players for someone holding the cash or whatever that is a bit extreme to me and even more extreme when I have heard numbers of 20-30%!

In fairness -- a good calcutta guy is worth way more than 10%. We have all been in rooms where the guy running the calcutta had zero charisma and couldn't hype the players at all. Those calcuttas DO NOT generate the same interest as do those ran by someone that knows what they're doing. It really does make a big difference. 10% seems reasonable but I'm with you when it comes to being upfront about how much they take out.

"Come on now!!! I was watching this guy play last night and he didn't miss a ball for 3 hours! You've got to be kidding me thinking he's only going to go for 20 dollars. I'll take him myself for 30. Do I hear 35?"

"I got 35!"

 

[watchez]

Lenny - how is this any different from say Bonus Ball being unorganized, getting players to change their lives and not just for a weekend, move to Vega$, stopping and starting the season several times and not coming thru with the money that was expected?

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

IMHO if all Pool in the USA, be it Amateur, or Professional was governed & run by a single organization, a lot of this non sense would stop once and for all.

When was the last time you heard a Pro Bowler was not paid at the end of an event, or say a Pro Golfer was not paid for winning a PGA Governed Event.

Yes I know that some of the Pool Organization would cease to exist, and only One would survive, BIMO until all Pool in the USA is Governed, & Run by One Organization, that GOVERNS EVENTS.

Pool Player will endure the like of what happen again, and again by fly by night operators, and promoters who take money, and run. Or write Rubber Check for Prices, that Bounce higher than a Pool BALL can be jumped.

Again JMHO One Organization work in other sports, why not pool?

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

IMHO if all Pool in the USA, be it Amateur, or Professional was governed & run by a single organization, a lot of this non sense would stop once and for all.

When was the last time you heard a Pro Bowler was not paid at the end of an event, or say a Pro Golfer was not paid for winning a PGA Governed Event.

Yes I know that some of the Pool Organization would cease to exist, and only One would survive, BIMO until all Pool in the USA is Governed, & Run by One Organization, that GOVERNS EVENTS.

Pool Player will endure the like of what happen again, and again by fly by night operators, and promoters who take money, and run. Or write Rubber Check for Prices, that Bounce higher than a Pool BALL can be jumped.

Again JMHO One Organization work in other sports, why not pool?

 

[Fast Lenny]

Lenny - how is this any different from say Bonus Ball being unorganized, getting players to change their lives and not just for a weekend, move to Vega$, stopping and starting the season several times and not coming thru with the money that was expected?

I have stated my case there, it was disorganized, understaffed and had lots of troubles but many of us involved had the best intentions from staff, players and investors. Nothing like it was ever done before so there was bound to be growing pains and issues. In the end though the players did okay and still will be back if season 2 happens.

 

[david(tx)]

IMHO if all Pool in the USA, be it Amateur, or Professional was governed & run by a single organization, a lot of this non sense would stop once and for all.

When was the last time you heard a Pro Bowler was not paid at the end of an event, or say a Pro Golfer was not paid for winning a PGA Governed Event.

Yes I know that some of the Pool Organization would cease to exist, and only One would survive, BIMO until all Pool in the USA is Governed, & Run by One Organization, that GOVERNS EVENTS.

Pool Player will endure the like of what happen again, and again by fly by night operators, and promoters who take money, and run. Or write Rubber Check for Prices, that Bounce higher than a Pool BALL can be jumped.

Again JMHO One Organization work in other sports, why not pool?

Because of competing events , anyone can stage a pool event . This organization would have to pay far and above others to hold players to keep them from defecting to another event/tour.

 

[robsnotes4u]

ND Calcuttas

In fairness -- a good calcutta guy is worth way more than 10%. We have all been in rooms where the guy running the calcutta had zero charisma and couldn't hype the players at all. Those calcuttas DO NOT generate the same interest as do those ran by someone that knows what they're doing. It really does make a big difference. 10% seems reasonable but I'm with you when it comes to being upfront about how much they take out.

"Come on now!!! I was watching this guy play last night and he didn't miss a ball for 3 hours! You've got to be kidding me thinking he's only going to go for 20 dollars. I'll take him myself for 30. Do I hear 35?"

"I got 35!"

53-06.1-07.3. Calcuttas.

A calcutta may only be conducted for a professional or amateur sporting event held in this state but not for elementary, secondary, or postsecondary education sports events. Only one wager per competitor may be allowed in a calcutta pool. The amount of prizes may not exceed ninety percent of the gross proceeds. A player may not place a wager on a competitor in a calcutta sporting event unless the competitor is eighteen years of age or older.


And the above statement is may not include allowable expenses and taxes. And I would assume we are not the only state that has laws as such.

 

[jgdwvu11]

I tried to get the 6 to play something but they didnt feel it was worth their time etc...as for money out of a calcutta, I have never done that in any of my 100+ tournaments I have run. I always post what is paid and taken in etc....I usually have the greens fee that is used for our expenses....obviously if you have a big event like i do for the regional you have to pay for the tables...I also hold the charity event with the regional and state that some of the entry goes to the charity...this year $2660 went to ohio valley breast cancer...I have had MANY people tell me 10% is typical fee taken out of a calcutta...I just don't and won't do it...that's me.