Banks- Extend it to Race to Four?

bud green

bud green

Dolley and Django
Silver Member
After watching poor Piggy Banks get drilled in about 10 minutes by Jason Miller in the banks event a couple years ago, I have to feel that a race to three in short rack banks is really too short. Maybe they're just hoping someone will run out the whole set and create a buzz - T. Hogue made 13 in a row and Miller made 10 already.

Any chance they can take a vote and make the later rounds (semi-finals, finals) a race to four? I can't imagine even a safety game would take that long in short rack banks with the top bankers playing. I think the accu-stats tape dvd from last year's semi's included TWO hill-hill matches and is still only 120 minutes.

Hell, I'd like to see the one pocket extended to four in the last rounds, too, but at least a good argument can be made that one pocket games can last over an hour.
 
bud green said:
After watching poor Piggy Banks get drilled in about 10 minutes by Jason Miller in the banks event a couple years ago, I have to feel that a race to three in short rack banks is really too short. Maybe they're just hoping someone will run out the whole set and create a buzz - T. Hogue made 13 in a row and Miller made 10 already.

Any chance they can take a vote and make the later rounds (semi-finals, finals) a race to four? I can't imagine even a safety game would take that long in short rack banks with the top bankers playing. I think the accu-stats tape dvd from last year's semi's included TWO hill-hill matches and is still only 120 minutes.

Hell, I'd like to see the one pocket extended to four in the last rounds, too, but at least a good argument can be made that one pocket games can last over an hour.
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I agree. I don't think it would take much longer and by this point of the tourney all the players are great bankers. Would just give us a little more for our money.
 
I agree...

Other sports make later rounds a longer race to legitimize the winner. I think all the DCC events would benefit from this. Longer rounds may mean that more DVD get sold of the matches. More beer gets sold at the event, reduces the luck-out factor dramatically. Good for the "sport" of pool. I dont think Efren will object to a longer race in One Pocket. The short races are the only ones that anyone has a chance at. The Nine Ball DEFINITELY should be raised for the Finals. Too easy for those champions to run racks.
 
Maybe the most amazing thing you can say about Efren is the fact that he has won the DCC one pocket every year he has entered with a field of 200-400 players in a freakin' race to three event.

Race to 7 is too short for top pros in nine ball, too. Screw tv, make it a real championship. Could you imagine them telling pro golfers the final round is going to be 14 holes from now on?

My main problem is still with the banks though. Piggy mainly goes down to play in the banks and is match is over in less than 10 minutes. I guess even a race to four might of only taken 12 minutes the way Jason was shooting but at least its a little better.
 
I drew Truman several years ago. 2 games were 2 inning games. The other was about 4 innings. total time for the match was about 20 minutes only because I went into a stall trying to slow him down. End reasult was he speared a long rail and runs 4 and out. I don't think that his beer bottle had time to sweat...
 
Extend to four game finals

bud green said:
After watching poor Piggy Banks get drilled in about 10 minutes by Jason Miller in the banks event a couple years ago, I have to feel that a race to three in short rack banks is really too short. Maybe they're just hoping someone will run out the whole set and create a buzz - T. Hogue made 13 in a row and Miller made 10 already.

Any chance they can take a vote and make the later rounds (semi-finals, finals) a race to four? I can't imagine even a safety game would take that long in short rack banks with the top bankers playing. I think the accu-stats tape dvd from last year's semi's included TWO hill-hill matches and is still only 120 minutes.

Hell, I'd like to see the one pocket extended to four in the last rounds, too, but at least a good argument can be made that one pocket games can last over an hour.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with you. Short rack banks finals should be in my opinion a race to five. Brumbach, Miller, Daulton are just too strong. Piggy, Truman,
Greg, Marco are just as strong. Hell, there must be at leat 20 bank players at DCC annually that can bank five and out!

Cross Side Larry

"Learn from the best, and beat the rest"
 
CrossSideLarry said:
I totally agree with you. Short rack banks finals should be in my opinion a race to five. Brumbach, Miller, Daulton are just too strong. Piggy, Truman,
Greg, Marco are just as strong. Hell, there must be at leat 20 bank players at DCC annually that can bank five and out!

Cross Side Larry

"Learn from the best, and beat the rest"
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Twenty, try 100!
 
I think the whole reason behind the shorter races is exactly because it does allow for a "luck" factor. It allows the weaker players the ability to compete and often times cause an upset.

I imagine if you start lengthening the races you're going to find you'll lose a lot of players and therefore money. Besides, even with the shorter races in all the events you still pretty much always end up with one of the top shooters coming out on top, but you also get quite a few good short-stops among the final 16.

Just an observation.
 
Sheesh!

jwilliams said:
I think the whole reason behind the shorter races is exactly because it does allow for a "luck" factor. It allows the weaker players the ability to compete and often times cause an upset.
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I hope so! Here I am a possible wavering first-time DCC player, thinking banks may be my strongest point as a player, knowing 9-ball and 1-pocket odds are too rough to contemplate, and you guys are talking 20 or 100 5-and-out players... 10-minute matches, etc.

You know interest in this event is picking up when I pick up a month-old dead thread... :) See most of you there!
 
Banks

jwilliams said:
I think the whole reason behind the shorter races is exactly because it does allow for a "luck" factor. It allows the weaker players the ability to compete and often times cause an upset.

I imagine if you start lengthening the races you're going to find you'll lose a lot of players and therefore money. Besides, even with the shorter races in all the events you still pretty much always end up with one of the top shooters coming out on top, but you also get quite a few good short-stops among the final 16.

Just an observation.
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Excellent observation and a very strong point for keeping it as is. I know that any strong player in any game can catch a gear at anytime and upset the favorite. You convinced me!

Cross Side Larry

"Learn from the best, and beat the rest"
 
Larry, you coming this year??

CrossSideLarry said:
Excellent observation and a very strong point for keeping it as is. I know that any strong player in any game can catch a gear at anytime and upset the favorite. You convinced me!

Cross Side Larry

"Learn from the best, and beat the rest"
Click to expand...


Hey Larry, Am I going to see you in your Derby hat again this year. Hope we can knock a few games around.
Talk to you soon,

Joe
 
The biggest problem they have at Derby City in all three divisions is too many players and not enough time. They have to keep the races short consequently. Might be nice to lengthen them a little when you get down to the final rounds. Like Race to Four in Banks and One Hole and Race to Nine in 9-Ball.
 
jay helfert said:
The biggest problem they have at Derby City in all three divisions is too many players and not enough time. They have to keep the races short consequently. Might be nice to lengthen them a little when you get down to the final rounds. Like Race to Four in Banks and One Hole and Race to Nine in 9-Ball.
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I think in the end, even with the short race, the best have risen to the top.

To the original post, if it had been a race to 4, it would have been only 12 minutes instead of 10. Jason was just on fuego. I was watching it on webcast and missed almost the entire thing because I stepped away "for a few minutes."

Fred
 
Cornerman said:
I think in the end, even with the short race, the best have risen to the top.

To the original post, if it had been a race to 4, it would have been only 12 minutes instead of 10. Jason was just on fuego. I was watching it on webcast and missed almost the entire thing because I stepped away "for a few minutes."

Fred
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Fred,
I have to agree with jwilliams that, while I dislike the short format as a way of deciding who the better player is, it ABSOLUTELY encourages the participation of the lesser players (like me). It's a great idea (not all events have to be the same), and I hope they continue the format.

Your other comment is also very true. A year ago I decided to see the George Breedlove-Eric Hjorleifson 9 ball match. I went to get a sandwich and drink just before the match started. When I returned about 13 minutes later, there was no one at the table. I asked a friend if one of the players forfeited, and he said, "Naw, George just ran 7 racks in about 12 minutes." I MISSED THE ENTIRE MATCH. Ahh, the wonders of short race 9-ball.

P.S. - maybe it was 18 minutes, I can't remember exactly; this Alzheimer's is a problem.
 
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jwilliams said:
I think the whole reason behind the shorter races is exactly because it does allow for a "luck" factor. It allows the weaker players the ability to compete and often times cause an upset.

I imagine if you start lengthening the races you're going to find you'll lose a lot of players and therefore money. Besides, even with the shorter races in all the events you still pretty much always end up with one of the top shooters coming out on top, but you also get quite a few good short-stops among the final 16.

Just an observation.
Click to expand...

That's my experience too. In local tournaments we have tried 9-ball race to 5, handicap 0 - 3 alternate breaks, and the top 4 are ALWAYS the best players. The difference is that the "bad" players feel that they have a reasonable chance, so they put their money in.
 
I played a match with Dave Matlock in 2005 and it lasted about 6 minutes. I did get 1 inning each game. I scored a 2, a 2, and a 3 for my 3 turns at the table. But I've seen even a short rack game of banks last about 45 minutes, and it was 2 decent players. It happens in those safety games. Leave it alone until it gets down to the last 10 players or so, and then raise the raise just a tad. Sam
 
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