BCA Hall of Fame discussion

Who do you think?

  • David Howard

    Votes: 6 16.2%

  • Jimmy Mataya

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Jimmy Reid

    Votes: 3 8.1%

  • Keith MCcready

    Votes: 8 21.6%

  • Jack Breit

    Votes: 4 10.8%

  • Mieko Harada

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • John Fitzpatrick

    Votes: 1 2.7%

  • CJ Wiley

    Votes: 2 5.4%

  • Grady Mathews

    Votes: 12 32.4%

  • Wade Crane

    Votes: 1 2.7%
  • Total voters
    37
sjm said:
If I'm a betting man, I'd say Ga Young Kim and Niels Feijen are the next two BCA Hall of Fame inductees.

I'd put Ga Young as the sixth best ever woman player behind Jean Balukas, Allison Fisher, Kelly Fisher, Karen Corr and Ruth McGinnis.

Feijen was probably among the world's ten best players for more than a decade, has a very long list of titles, and he is on the very short list of those who have won a WPA sanctioned World Championship in both 14.1 and 9-ball. The others that come to mind who have accomplished this are Ortmann, Hohmann, Sigel, Varner, and all of them are rightly in the hall of fame.

Niels and Ga Young should be no brainers.
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What about SVB? Isn't he eligible when he turns 40 in July?
 
Clusterbuster said:
Your post illustrates the problem of assessing the relative merits of the “action oriented” type player such as Keith vs. the more “tournament oriented” type players. Tournament players have well documented results that enable observers to assess their career by looking at their number of tournament titles, number of times they won or lost against particular opponents, quality of fields they played, strength over several years, etc. With the action oriented player, they may have beaten all comers every day for years, but their historical record becomes largely anecdotal. It consists of stories that they beat so-and-so in some obscure venue in the wee hours of the morning and the only record of it, while possibly completely accurate, becomes someone’s memory, often years after the fact. The tournament players are in an inherently better position to get the kind of recognition that factors into the HOF. It’s an unfortunate reality that probably keeps a number of players from getting the recognition they deserve. Best wishes to Keith.
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It's interesting to read thoughts of who should be good candidates for the BCA Hall of Fame. It is important to remember that there was no digital technology back in the prime days of Keith et al. It's a lot more than "anecdotal," though.

It seems like many on this thread are results pickers, and that's okay, I guess. Minnesota Fats didn't win many tournaments, yet he's in the BCA Hall of Fame. Go figure. Where are his results?

Earl Strickland didn't get in until, I think, 2006, subject to check. Poor guy just missed pocketing $30,000 for being a Hall of Famer at the IPT King of the Hill in Orlando, December 2005. He made it the next year. Those admitted before him, in my opinion, should have been admitted after Earl.

If results pickers are the ones choosing the BCA Hall of Fame candidates and that's exactly what the pool purists want, then, by golly, let them be happy, I say. :cool:
 
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rexus31 said:
What about SVB? Isn't he eligible when he turns 40 in July?
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He will probably be inducted in 2024. Might need to be 40 for the entire calendar year you're inducted?

I could see it going something like:

2023 - Feijen
2024 - Biado/SVB
2025 - Biado/SVB

After those three are in, there will be a small gap in time before the next crop of elite players are eligible at age 40. Which is when guys like Corey Deuel and Jeremy Jones could get in. John Schmidt would have had a better chance if Shaw hadn't shattered his straight pool record.
 
JAM said:
It's interesting to read thoughts of who should be good candidates for the BCA Hall of Fame. It is important to remember that there was no digital technology back in the prime days of Keith et al. It's a lot more than "anecdotal," though.

It seems like many on this thread are results pickers, and that's okay, I guess. Minnesota Fats didn't win many tournaments, yet he's in the BCA Hall of Fame. Go figure. Where are his results?

Earl Strickland didn't get in until, I think, 2006, subject to check. Poor guy just missed pocketing $30,000 for being a Hall of Famer at the IPT King of the Hill in Orlando, December 2005. He made it the next year. Those admitted before him, in my opinion, should have been admitted after Earl.

If results pickers are the ones choosing the BCA Hall of Fame candidates and that's exactly what the pool purists want, then, by golly, let them be happy, I say. :cool:
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Wanderone is in for Meritorious Service and not in the Greatest Players category.

I think the ones to compare based on this thread’s discussion are:

Shorty Johnson
Harold Worst
Babe Cranfield
 
sjm said:
Yes, except this thread is about whether the indicated players qualify on the basis of their competitive accomplishments. This thread is not about who might qualify on the basis of meritorious service in the future, so Mark Griffin is not relevant.

David Howard is not anything close to obvious, as he has been eligible for about twenty years and has not gained entry.
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Stu,
My obvious comment was based on the 4 listed. I could make an argument for others (Neils etc). MG was just a plug to keep his memory top of mind.
 
Cornerman said:
Wanderone is in for Meritorious Service and not in the Greatest Players category.

I think the ones to compare based on this thread’s discussion are:

Shorty Johnson
Harold Worst
Babe Cranfield
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I would like to see McCready and Mataya get in the HOF like Fatty did….they could both turn a pool hall upside down with their presence.
and Jimmy Mataya has at least one world title also.
 
Here are my pics for this years ballot
Neil's Feijen
Mark Griffin Both should have already been picked.

Grady Matthew's
Jimmy Mataya
Keith McCredy Also should be there. The problem is the BCA has always put the biggest gamblers to the side for H.O.F.
Look at how long it was for Parica and Hopkins to get in.

Next year of course SVB is the obvious choice.
 
sjm said:
If I'm a betting man, I'd say Ga Young Kim and Niels Feijen are the next two BCA Hall of Fame inductees.

I'd put Ga Young as the sixth best ever woman player behind Jean Balukas, Allison Fisher, Kelly Fisher, Karen Corr and Ruth McGinnis.

Feijen was probably among the world's ten best players for more than a decade, has a very long list of titles, and he is on the very short list of those who have won a WPA sanctioned World Championship in both 14.1 and 9-ball. The others that come to mind who have accomplished this are Ortmann, Hohmann, Sigel, Varner, and all of them are rightly in the hall of fame.

Niels and Ga Young should be no brainers.
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I've added the first women's world champion Mieko Harada, a very unknown player, did you ever get to watch her play?
 
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raphcleary said:
I've added the first women's world champion Mieko Harada, a very unknown player, did you ever get to watch her play?
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Yes, I saw her play straight pool a few times in the 1975-80 period. She is not hall of fame worthy. FYI, in the early days of the Women's World 14.1 Championships, the typical field size was eight.

Things started picking up on the women' side when Ewa and Loree Jon hit the scene (my best guess is 1981). Belinda Bearden joined them soon after, and Robin Bell (later known as Robin Dodson) joined soon after that. By the mid 1980's the women's tour counted five future BCA hall of famers among its members (Balukas, Loree Jon, Ewa, Belinda and Robin).
 
sjm said:
Yes, I saw her play straight pool a few times in the 1975-80 period. She is not hall of fame worthy. FYI, in the early days of the Women's World 14.1 Championships, the typical field size was eight.

Things started picking up on the women' side when Ewa and Loree Jon hit the scene (my best guess is 1981). Belinda Bearden joined them soon after, and Robin Bell (later known as Robin Dodson) joined soon after that. By the mid 1980's the women's tour counted five future BCA hall of famers among its members (Balukas, Loree Jon, Ewa, Belinda and Robin).
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Thank you, I know now.
 
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Hey, John "Rags" Fitzpatrick is on the list. That's a guy who probably belongs in the BCA Hall of Fame.

Many on this forum have called him the best player in the world of the 1940's. Eddie Taylor thought the world of him, as did Lassiter. John Ervolino talked of how he hoped that when he died he'd get to play one-pocket with Fitzpatrick in the hereafter. Ervo was in awe of him.

Of course, to have seen him play, one would have to be very old, and that's why he probably draws little to no attention.

I seem to recall that he died not long before the very first edition of Johnston City.
 
sjm said:
Hey, John "Rags" Fitzpatrick is on the list. That's a guy who probably belongs in the BCA Hall of Fame.

Many on this forum have called him the best player in the world of the 1940's. Eddie Taylor thought the world of him, as did Lassiter. John Ervolino talked of how he hoped that when he died he'd get to play one-pocket with Fitzpatrick in the hereafter. Ervo was in awe of him.

Of course, to have seen him play, one would have to be very old, and that's why he probably draws little to no attention.

I seem to recall that he died not long before the very first edition of Johnston City.
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Yes finally, Stu approved one :) I added Fitzpatrick because I heard Jay Helfert talk about him. He died at 41 years old and like Harold Worst wasn't able to fulfil his full potential. I believe he could have with the Johnston City tournaments just beginning and like Lassiter didn't stat playing in tournaments until his late 30s.
 
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raphcleary said:
I'm curious, when was the over 40 years of age rule put in place? Mizerak got in at 36 in 1980, Balukas at 25 in 1985 and Sigel at 35 in 1989.
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I want to say in the 1990’s. But, the rule may have changed a couple of times. I know that since I’ve been a voting member (2008), it’s been 40. I’ve had a few discussions with Mike Panozzo on the age. It doesnt look to be changing any time soon.
 
Cornerman said:
I want to say in the 1990’s. But, the rule may have changed a couple of times. I know that since I’ve been a voting member (2008), it’s been 40. I’ve had a few discussions with Mike Panozzo on the age. It doesnt look to be changing any time soon.
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Thank you. Do you know how long a player has to be an active professional for them to be inducted, a lot of websites say different things, 10, 15, 20 years?
 
I for one would be interested in hearing the opinions of some the past great players on this question. The closest I've come to this is remembering Sigel saying something (when talking about Bustamonte being inducted) like "You know he didn't win THAT many tournaments or something very close to that. Please note that he didn't say specifically that he shouldn't be in just the quote that I referenced above.

I also remember a personal letter of recommendation by Mosconi in support of Jimmy Moore's induction.
I'd also like to hear what Jay thinks about this.
 
L.S. Dennis said:
I for one would be interested in hearing the opinions of some the past great players on this question. The closest I've come to this is remembering Sigel saying something (when talking about Bustamonte being inducted) like "You know he didn't win THAT many tournaments or something very close to that. Please note that he didn't say specifically that he shouldn't be in just the quote that I referenced above.

I also remember a personal letter of recommendation by Mosconi in support of Jimmy Moore's induction.
I'd also like to hear what Jay thinks about this.
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A personal letter of recommendation by Sigel in support of a players induction, would be hard to argue against too. I wonder who, if any player he would want to see in the Hall of Fame.
 
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