being beaten vs losing

[D-Sub]

OK, here it is:

I'm a f-----g choke artist. I lose way more games than I win, and it is not due to lack of knowledge, stroke, or skill level. I'm not saying I'm pro material or anything like it, but I play pretty damn sporty when I'm "on."

The problem is...I'm only "on" periodically, and for short periods of time. I've never had a two-day win streak, or a week, or a month, or anything like that. I might play well an entire night, but usually it's 2 or three hours.

Not only that, but I can be nailing it before the action starts (tournament, gambling, whatever) and then completely flop once the game is on.

I just lost 2 matches in a row in a double elimination 8 ball tournament that I have NO business losing. I should be in the money damn close to every time I play this place, but I come up short over and over. Unforced errors (like tonight, hooking myself behind the only ball that could get in the way) are my specialty like I wrote the book or something. Absolutely astounding how often I lose vs simply being outplayed

That's the problem: I come up short. Over, and over, and over, and over.

In all honesty, I want to quit playing pool. It's just too depressing, disheartening, heartbreaking. Sometimes it truly seems like there's some outside force ****ing with me. That sounds silly, I know, but it really does feel that way.

I have a lot on my mind right now, and that obviously plays into it. Self-confidence...something I was never taught (quite the obvious) is a huge factor, too. Even 15 years ago I remember having streaks of excellence and then just falling apart.

I've tried taking sedatives when I play to kill the nerves, but that feels like cheating. Alcohol is a bad idea for me, as well.

heck...rant over...I don't even know if I'm explaining myself here, and most likely people don't want to hear this crap anyway...so I hit submit.

 

[Fast Lenny]

I went 2 and out a week ago for the first time and it wasnt a good feeling but I learned from it and realize I need to practice more and play more.Going out once or twice a week and walking into a tourney stone cold is no good for me and Im not good enough to do that.

 

[D-Sub]

I went 2 and out a week ago for the first time and it wasnt a good feeling but I learned from it and realize I need to practice more and play more.Going out once or twice a week and walking into a tourney stone cold is no good for me and Im not good enough to do that.

forgot to add, this has nothing to do with lack of table time. I've been playing since I was about 19. I'm 36 now. I didn't play "serious" the majority of that time, but since I've been hanging out at the spot I'm at...I almost feel like I've gotten worse although I'll admit my knowledge has increased.

it really boils down to confidence, consistency, and being "on" which seems about as hit or miss as is humanly possible.

 

[Ed Simmons]

I went 2 and out a week ago for the first time and it wasnt a good feeling but I learned from it and realize I need to practice more and play more.Going out once or twice a week and walking into a tourney stone cold is no good for me and Im not good enough to do that.

In any double-elimination tournament a quarter of the field goes 2 and out. It is actually the largest block of players in the tournament. I find myself in that group far too often, but at least my misery has a lot of company!

 

[jamesroberts]

learning how to win is an important part of pool...
you are probably going to laugh but i would try a hynosis cd and see how that works

 

[D-Sub]

learning how to win is an important part of pool...
you are probably going to laugh but i would try a hynosis cd and see how that works

a year ago I'd have laughed, but...I am absolutely dead flat certain that this is a mental thing.

I have won plenty...never anything big, but a fair share of wins in 8 ball and 9 ball. Never won any one-pocket tournaments, but I've definitely won gambling. But even then...it's like...once the (for lack of a better term) fear creeps in, I'm doomed and it seems to creep in more and more often.

 

[D-Sub]

In any double-elimination tournament a quarter of the field goes 2 and out. It is actually the largest block of players in the tournament. I find myself in that group far too often, but at least my misery has a lot of company!

That's true. Somebody has to lose, but I am 100% certain that it shouldn't be me anywhere near as often as it is in these situations. I know if I walk into hard times or some place where high-level players call home, I'm gonna be done pretty quickly, but I lose to people I have no business losing to.

I'm really disappointed right now, and am just plain tired of this.

 

[ridewiththewind]

OK, here it is:

I'm a f-----g choke artist. I lose way more games than I win, and it is not due to lack of knowledge, stroke, or skill level. I'm not saying I'm pro material or anything like it, but I play pretty damn sporty when I'm "on."

The problem is...I'm only "on" periodically, and for short periods of time. I've never had a two-day win streak, or a week, or a month, or anything like that. I might play well an entire night, but usually it's 2 or three hours.

Not only that, but I can be nailing it before the action starts (tournament, gambling, whatever) and then completely flop once the game is on.

I just lost 2 matches in a row in a double elimination 8 ball tournament that I have NO business losing. I should be in the money damn close to every time I play this place, but I come up short over and over. Unforced errors (like tonight, hooking myself behind the only ball that could get in the way) are my specialty like I wrote the book or something. Absolutely astounding how often I lose vs simply being outplayed

That's the problem: I come up short. Over, and over, and over, and over.

In all honesty, I want to quit playing pool. It's just too depressing, disheartening, heartbreaking. Sometimes it truly seems like there's some outside force ****ing with me. That sounds silly, I know, but it really does feel that way.

I have a lot on my mind right now, and that obviously plays into it. Self-confidence...something I was never taught (quite the obvious) is a huge factor, too. Even 15 years ago I remember having streaks of excellence and then just falling apart.

I've tried taking sedatives when I play to kill the nerves, but that feels like cheating. Alcohol is a bad idea for me, as well.

heck...rant over...I don't even know if I'm explaining myself here, and most likely people don't want to hear this crap anyway...so I hit submit.

Been there, done that, own the shirt. In all seriousness, I think it's simply a matter of not knowing how to win....mentally. I suffer from it myself....I can get on the table in a game of 8 Ball, and run all 7 of my balls, and then hook myself on the 8 in the only place possible on the whole friggin' table. I cannot even get frustrated about it anymore...I just laugh it off.

BTW....you won't quit the game...you're chasing the win.

Lisa

 

[Roy Steffensen]

OK, here it is:

I'm a f-----g choke artist. I lose way more games than I win, and it is not due to lack of knowledge, stroke, or skill level. I'm not saying I'm pro material or anything like it, but I play pretty damn sporty when I'm "on."

The problem is...I'm only "on" periodically, and for short periods of time. I've never had a two-day win streak, or a week, or a month, or anything like that. I might play well an entire night, but usually it's 2 or three hours.

Not only that, but I can be nailing it before the action starts (tournament, gambling, whatever) and then completely flop once the game is on.

I just lost 2 matches in a row in a double elimination 8 ball tournament that I have NO business losing. I should be in the money damn close to every time I play this place, but I come up short over and over. Unforced errors (like tonight, hooking myself behind the only ball that could get in the way) are my specialty like I wrote the book or something. Absolutely astounding how often I lose vs simply being outplayed

That's the problem: I come up short. Over, and over, and over, and over.

In all honesty, I want to quit playing pool. It's just too depressing, disheartening, heartbreaking. Sometimes it truly seems like there's some outside force ****ing with me. That sounds silly, I know, but it really does feel that way.

I have a lot on my mind right now, and that obviously plays into it. Self-confidence...something I was never taught (quite the obvious) is a huge factor, too. Even 15 years ago I remember having streaks of excellence and then just falling apart.

I've tried taking sedatives when I play to kill the nerves, but that feels like cheating. Alcohol is a bad idea for me, as well.

heck...rant over...I don't even know if I'm explaining myself here, and most likely people don't want to hear this crap anyway...so I hit submit.

You say you should be in the money everytime, but over and over do not manage to get there.

Perhaps you are not good enough yet? Remember that you are not better than what your average game says you are. Don't judge your speed by the game you have when you're "on".

A lot of people do this mistake, especially in money games.

 

[D-Sub]

run all 7 of my balls, and then hook myself on the 8 in the only place possible on the whole friggin' table.

stealing my moves? I own that shit. In fact, I'm pretty sure I have it trademarked, copyrighted and patented which means in all likelihood you owe me money.

What about running the rack in 9 and dogging the 9? Or....say....needing ONE FCKING BALL in a race to 75 and missing a straight in shot?

I cannot even get frustrated about it anymore...I just laugh it off.

I can't laugh anymore.

BTW....you won't quit the game...you're chasing the win.

That's part of the problem...it feels like a compulsion anymore and it's not even fun

anyone think completely avoiding "competitive" situations is a good idea? I play just fine, quite well in fact, when it "doesn't matter."

Perhaps I just need to admit that I don't have the fighting spirit that's necessary? But if that were the case I would have never won, never succeeded in making it out of tight situations...

 

[D-Sub]

You say you should be in the money everytime, but over and over do not manage to get there.

Perhaps you are not good enough yet? Remember that you are not better than what your average game says you are. Don't judge your speed by the game you have when you're "on".

A lot of people do this mistake, especially in money games.

That's pretty common in golf, too. Thinking that because you made this shot or that shot once or twice, you're "that good."

I appreciate your perspective and you have a valid point, but I'm telling you it doesn't apply here. I am quite aware of what my true skill level is. In fact, I'd suggest that perhaps I haven't "allowed" myself to be as good as I can be?

 

[Russ Chewning]

D-Sub,

The key to playing your best pool in ALL situations is learning to play with a "quiet mind". That is, turning off the "thinking" part of your mind, and just letting the part that controls your stroke decide how to get the ball to a certain point, or make a certain shot.

NEVER think "don't go too far". ALWAYS visualize in your mind exactly where you want to end up.

NEVER think "this is a tough shot".

NEVER think "I have never beaten this guy." as you are preparing to play someone.

GET this book! The Inner Game of Tennis

It has little to do with Tennis, and EVERYTHING to do with why we "choke".

A short and simple explanation:

There are two "Minds". One of them "coaches" you on how to do things. It says things like "Don't hit this one too hard. Loosen up your stroke. Don't tense up. Let us call this Mind 1.

Mind 2 simply "does". It sees a tennis ball coming towards the baseline, and automatically moves your body into position to give a great forehand return.

Tell Mind 2 to draw the cue ball exactly two inches, and as long as Mind 1 does not interfere, and you've practiced enough, Mind 2 draws it exactly 2 inches.

Mind 2 deal with imagery, not words. If you hear "words" in your head as you are getting down on a shot, that is Mind 1 attempting to screw you up, although it thinks it is being helpful.

In so many words, you need to turn off conscious thought. Simply observe everything happening at the pool table, and do not make "judgements" about the quality of the shot. Simple visualize what you want to happen, and "quiet your mind", and just let it do it's job.

Get the book.

Russ

 

[powerlineman80]

I'm streaky too, but played pretty damn good in league play as a rookie. Went 8-3 including a playoff win in 9ball. I love it when I'm so nervous I'm shaking. I was the same on the mound, and loved the adrenaline rush. Like you D-Sub, I can be hard to beat if I'm on but I'm never "on" that much.....lol

You just have to quit being so hard on yourself. Go back to enjoying the game and maybe take a break from gambling. This is why I dont gamble (unless I got a stakehorse...hehe), so I can keep telling myself its just a game and no big deal.

 

[Roy Steffensen]

I think perhaps books that can help you with your mental game is something you should consider. Since you are having a high level of game when you're "on", you have the knowledge of how to play. The books can help you find this game more often.

It helped me a lot.

 

[mbippus]

self-fulfilling prophesy

I've been there many times. "I knew I was going to dog that" "THere's a gift for you" "I guess i just don't want to win"

Its all between the ears. Im no great player but if I know I can beat someone, I just go do it. Or at least I convince myself that I am going to.

In later days before I was a pool degenerate, i was quite familar with the bible. A verse says, "as a man thinks in his heart so is he." If I think I have nineball-i-tis (can't sink one), or that i always choke, even the bible says im right.

Fortuantly the opposite is true as well.

 

[ridewiththewind]

D-Sub,

The key to playing your best pool in ALL situations is learning to play with a "quiet mind". That is, turning off the "thinking" part of your mind, and just letting the part that controls your stroke decide how to get the ball to a certain point, or make a certain shot.

NEVER think "don't go too far". ALWAYS visualize in your mind exactly where you want to end up.

NEVER think "this is a tough shot".

NEVER think "I have never beaten this guy." as you are preparing to play someone.

GET this book! The Inner Game of Tennis

It has little to do with Tennis, and EVERYTHING to do with why we "choke".

A short and simple explanation:

There are two "Minds". One of them "coaches" you on how to do things. It says things like "Don't hit this one too hard. Loosen up your stroke. Don't tense up. Let us call this Mind 1.

Mind 2 simply "does". It sees a tennis ball coming towards the baseline, and automatically moves your body into position to give a great forehand return.

Tell Mind 2 to draw the cue ball exactly two inches, and as long as Mind 1 does not interfere, and you've practiced enough, Mind 2 draws it exactly 2 inches.

Mind 2 deal with imagery, not words. If you hear "words" in your head as you are getting down on a shot, that is Mind 1 attempting to screw you up, although it thinks it is being helpful.

In so many words, you need to turn off conscious thought. Simply observe everything happening at the pool table, and do not make "judgements" about the quality of the shot. Simple visualize what you want to happen, and "quiet your mind", and just let it do it's job.

Get the book.

Russ

Ah yes, I have read the same principle in 'The Pleasure of Small Motions"....I am ready to subscribe to "If I'm Drinkin' I'm Not Thinkin'"...LoL.

Lisa

 

[Fast Lenny]

In any double-elimination tournament a quarter of the field goes 2 and out. It is actually the largest block of players in the tournament. I find myself in that group far too often, but at least my misery has a lot of company!

Your correct about this,I am sure it will happen to me again down the road but this field was weak and I was a favorite against my opponents but as the great Earl says "Your never safe I dont care who your playing."

 

[D-Sub]

D-Sub,

The key to playing your best pool in ALL situations is learning to play with a "quiet mind". That is, turning off the "thinking" part of your mind, and just letting the part that controls your stroke decide how to get the ball to a certain point, or make a certain shot.

NAILED IT!

STFU, BRAIN! That's IT!!!!!!

this concept...quieting the brain = Zen. Sums up the concept of Zen completely. Don't think, just do. Of course, you need to learn the skill well enough to "just do" but I am dead certain that I have the skill required to play better than average.

excellent post, Russ. Thank you. Easier said than done in my current state, but...that's a damn fine point.

Tonight was a prime example. I played a perfect safety with two object balls left and my opp had one. He kicked his ball but missed and left me just shy of straight into the side pocket. I had several spots that I could get shape on my next OB to key up the 8 and what do I do? slide perfectly behind the 8 ball. Why? Because instead of picking a spot I wanted to be I was worried about the spot I didn't want to be!

bam.

 

[D-Sub]

I think perhaps books that can help you with your mental game is something you should consider. Since you are having a high level of game when you're "on", you have the knowledge of how to play. The books can help you find this game more often.

It helped me a lot.

I don't want to say "high level" because I am trying to be reasonable, but let's say I am 100% certain that I can play much better than I do in the situations in question.

yes, mental game.

 

[powerlineman80]

Because instead of picking a spot I wanted to be I was worried about the spot I didn't want to be!

bam.

That seems to be your problem. You are thinking too much. Just let loose and play ball man. Dont think about screwing up or you will most of the time. I used to be the same way but now I think I can beat anyone even when I cant, and I think I can get shape or sink any shot I want even when I cant But I've found out that I've shot better when my head was clear of everything, instead of worrying about losing or getting shape. I still slip sometimes and get mad and miss shots, etc. but I try to get away from that mindset.