billiardcue.com

photoshop

Dick,

I am a sporting kind of guy. Would you buy a cue from me as represented in a picture I unabashedly admit to having used PhotoShop CS to manipulate? I won't tell you a thing about the cue, just present you with the image that I have taken of a cue and used PhotoShop CS to enhance the image. I want a fair appraisal of the stick and an offer. I'll post both here on this board.

You may be a fair cue dealer, you may not be, that I don't know. I do know that you are trying to totally misrepresent what can be done with PhotoShop after you have admitted using it which leaves me feeling skeptical.

There is no reason to not use PhotoShop properly to better represent the true condition of a pool cue. However as fellow photographers and PhotoShop users we both know that there is tremendous potential for abuse if the PhotoShop user chooses to do so.

(Dick)
"For sake of argument, what could I do with Photoshop to unfaithfully represent a cue?"

Just for starters, remove any scratches, cracks, warpage, or finish blemishes that show in the image. If you really want to be imaginative you can add or remove inlays, change buttcaps, wraps, colors, anything that you choose. There are very few limits to what can be done with PhotoShop. Almost impossible to tell these changes have been made after the image is reduced to 72 PPI to display in an ad. When a photographer with your training and experience takes the pictures to begin with the original shots can be set up to make deceptive photoshopping even easier and more difficult to detect. With your training and experience and the obvious effort put into your photographs I am left to wonder why do you even need to change backgrounds?

I am not saying that you have engaged in any deceptive practices other than the rhetorical question you asked here. That did seem intended to mislead or deceive however and I won't be buying anything from you.

Hu


billiardcue said:
Thank you Fred.
I do use Adobe Photoshop to put my images together and create background colors. For sake of argument, what could I do with Photoshop to unfaithfully represent a cue?
High quality, very expensive equipment, eight years of trial and error photographing cues, 37 years of photographic experience to include two years of university classes, a studio dedicated solely for the purpose of cue photography, an investment of many thousands of dollars in cameras, computer monitors, software, studio lighting, etc. Those are the reasons my photos look like they do.
Any purchase from billiardcue.com is fully refundable if you are not satisfied, see my policy on returns for full details.

Dick Abbott
www.billiardcue.com
866 500 CUES
 
Dang!

iconcue said:
billiardcue.com's avatar alone shows how the cue can be manipulated. i don't think that particular barry szamboti comes in six sections :)


I was hunting one like that so I could tuck it into the pocket of my bib overalls when I went to the pool room, didn't want to be too conspicuous. Guess I'll have to try plan "B". :D ;) :D

Hu
 
iam sorry

iconcue said:
he wasnt straight or fair in the one deal i did with him.
it was one mistake after another. and he also didnt offer my money back. and even though the cue purchased hasnt been touched since i've had it he wanted me take a $3000 loss on trade for another cue against retail (a cue that he had offered a $2500 cash discount on making it a $5500 bath).
when asked for an explanation as to how that could possibly be fair - he doesnt even have the courtesy to reply!
and this was the second time i tried to trade it back! the first time he wouldnt even consider it as a trade. a cue he sold as new that hasnt been used!
if he is a straight dealer i'd hate to see what a crooked dealer would do!

jeff s willings
I was just commenting on the couple cue deals (I) have had with him and he was straight with
me , Iam sorr you had a bad deal.I can just acct. for my personal dealings! I wish you both the best in hashing them out , maybee you can come to a compramise! best wishes Bill
 
iconcue said:
thanks bill!
he doesnt seem to want to do anything tough! :(


I am waiting for this thread to disappear because Biliardcue.com is an advertiser.
 
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there's nothing in billiardcue's photos that require photoshop other than stitching the various images together and smoothening out the backgrounds. iconcue's images are way better, and i can get mine just as clean with a 4 megapixel canon.

other than mentioned above, there's no need for photoshop if the cues are shot right, and both icon and myself understand how to light a cylindrical object WITH NO REFLECTIONS, which, btw, i can spot in some of billiardcue's photos.. which leads me to conclude what another poster has already mentioned,,,,that the only other purpose of photoshop would be to "clean up the cues".

but i wouldn't consider the photos terribly misleading if billiardcue guarantees your money back.. and it''s something he must abide by if he states so on his website.

if someone buys a cue with ivory and it's not as clean as shown on the site, then return it. dick is only trying to show the cue in its best light. however, if a cue has a dent, dick should note it, post it, and show it. otherwise everyone has to go through the trouble of returns, and what a nuisance THAT is.
 
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bruin70 said:
there's nothing in billiardcue's photos that require photoshop other than stitching the various images together and smoothening out the backgrounds. iconcue's images are way better, and i can get mine just as clean with a 4 megapixel canon.

other than mentioned above, there's no need for photoshop if the cues are shot right, and both icon and myself understand how to light a cylindrical object WITH NO REFLECTIONS, which, btw, i can spot in some of billiardcue's photos.. which leads me to conclude what another poster has already mentioned,,,,that the only other purpose of photoshop would be to "clean up the cues".

but i wouldn't consider the photos terribly misleading if billiardcue guarantees your money back.. and it''s something he must abide by if he states so on his website.

if someone buys a cue with ivory and it's not as clean as shown on the site, then return it. dick is only trying to show the cue in its best light. however, if a cue has a dent, dick should note it, post it, and show it. otherwise everyone has to go through the trouble of returns, and what a nuisance THAT is.
If you would allow me to go off topic here for a minute, I would really like to know how to take the reflection off. I use a 5 Megapixel camera with 3 optical zoom. It is not a fancy camera.
Thank you very much.
Richard
 
Mr. Accott is a fine businessman and you can take his word. I bought a case from him and it was as described and he made internet business a pleasure. I often refer to his site to gauge what a cue is worth.
 
I meant Abbot,,,,,pardon me for not having the superior typing skills that you must have

prices are between buyer and seller and not an issue here

I dont believe Ill post photos of my cue,,,,,,,,,someone might think they are for sale
 
Im the guy who offered to buy the rosewood Gus.

You see , when you publish photos of cues on your site where you sell cues, then you ought to expect people to ask,,,,,,,,,,,,,how much ?
 
nipponbilliards said:
If you would allow me to go off topic here for a minute, I would really like to know how to take the reflection off. I use a 5 Megapixel camera with 3 optical zoom. It is not a fancy camera.
Thank you very much.
Richard

here's a sample of mine. iconcue takes waayyyy better pics. if you look closely, you will see a bit of reflection in one of my shots. this is because the wall behind me is light, and i forgot to used my black backdrop to eliminate the wall reflection. some of the reflection is also from the obi sash,,,,becaue it's light.
http://azbilliards.com/vbulletin/upload/showthread.php?t=16544

here's how you can light your cue. i use a canon g3 which is a 4mp camera, with one closeup in macro-mode.
http://azbilliards.com/vbulletin/upload/showthread.php?t=15136&page=3

scroll to the second set of pics in the middle of the page http://azbilliards.com/vbulletin/upload/showthread.php?t=14415
 
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Wow, if I had known this was somewhat of a sore subject for some I wouldnt have brought it up. I guess it is good to see the different opinions about one of the many cue vendors out there.
 
NOSAJ03 said:
Wow, if I had known this was somewhat of a sore subject for some I wouldnt have brought it up. I guess it is good to see the different opinions about one of the many cue vendors out there.

Why not bring it up? This is what you were asking for. I assume you wanted to know both the good and bad. A lot of people are forthcoming when the experience is good, but few are willing to take the heat to say that they had a bad experience.

Fortunately, Iconcue is willing to take the heat. I would like to see the story come out, and I too would also like to see Billiardcue respond.

I narrowly missed a misidentification myself recently involving this dealer.

Chris
 
TATE said:
Why not bring it up? This is what you were asking for. I assume you wanted to know both the good and bad. A lot of people are forthcoming when the experience is good, but few are willing to take the heat to say that they had a bad experience.

Fortunately, Iconcue is willing to take the heat. I would like to see the story come out, and I too would also like to see Billiardcue respond.

I narrowly missed a misidentification myself recently involving this dealer.

Chris
Yeah but I also kinda feel bad for Dick. Granted I dont know the circumstances fully and Im sure Icon is just in what he's saying. I just feel like I started a small flame thread. I guess its good we can get both sides of the story.... somewhat.
 
I have never had anything but good dealings with Dick Abbot.

John
 
NOSAJ03 said:
Yeah but I also kinda feel bad for Dick. Granted I dont know the circumstances fully and Im sure Icon is just in what he's saying. I just feel like I started a small flame thread. I guess its good we can get both sides of the story.... somewhat.

it's not a "flame". it benefits everyone to know everything.
 
Is this going to be "War and Peace" in entirety or Cliff Note version?

iconcue said:
billiardcue.com's dick abbott came online at azb again monday but still no reply.

problem no. 1 - payed by bank transfer on feb 7, fund were recvd in his account feb 8!
when did i received the cue? feb 15! 7 days after he had my money. and even though it was shipped out this late - it wasnt shipped over night but was shipped fedex two day! and this expensive cue wasnt shipped from billiardcue.com but from the bellagio hotel in las vegas where it was on display in a retail shop. it also wasnt received in a custom whitten case with the cue makers name but a standard whitten case that looked to be used. during the time period between receiving the funds and shipping the cue despite many attempts to communicate with dick abbott i received one response that said the hotel did not have a case for the cue so he had to ship them one for them to use to ship the cue to me.

and this is just problem no. 1
 
iconcue said:
it's a long story! i was hoping to get a response before going into every detail.
but i will definitely try to keep it to cliff note version.
but i will also try to keep it current until resovled.
so if you have a problem with that don't click on the thread.

i've had one experience with abbott, and it was very good.

nonetheless, i think all high end items shouild be delivered overnight standard or priority.
 
Don't get me wrong ... I have empathy for your situation and hope that all turns out well for you.

In fact, if I were you, I'd start my own thread about it (kind of like IDcues story) rather than continuing on another person's thread. You'd get more visibility to your own story. Here, on someone else's thread about gathering info on certain person/website, as others post, your story may get lost, get confusing and etc.

Up to you!!!

iconcue said:
it's a long story! i was hoping to get a response before going into every detail.
but i will definitely try to keep it to cliff note version.
but i will also try to keep it current until resovled.
so if you have a problem with that don't click on the thread.
 
iconcue said:
"he wasnt straight or fair in the one deal i did with him.
it was one mistake after another. and he also didnt offer my money back. and even though the cue purchased hasnt been touched since i've had it he wanted me take a $3000 loss on trade for another cue against retail (a cue that he had offered a $2500 cash discount on making it a $5500 bath).
when asked for an explanation as to how that could possibly be fair - he doesnt even have the courtesy to reply!"

i was wrong when i posted the above earlier in this thread. i just looked at the email dick abbott had sent and he wanted me to take a $5000.00 loss against retail on a cue he had quoted a $2500 cash discount. so he wanted me to take a $7500.00 bath on trading the unplayed cue he sold me.
also thought it was interesting that when i saw "billiardcue" / dick abbott online sunday i clicked his user name and it showed he was reading this thread. yet, no response to any of it! speaks volumes to me! he has no response and he doesnt give a flip!

jeff s willings

It could just show that he's on to you and doesn't want to waste anymore time on a clueless crybaby who thinks just because he has a little bit of cash that everyone should bow down to him. Of course this is just a guess Jeff, you know I don't feel this way about you, I'm just taking a guess at what could have happened. Hope you don't get as mad as you have been in other posts.

Jim <---Your pal
 
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