Birth of the Jump Cue?

[shinyballs]

Who was the first to make a jump cue or use one during competition?

For the record, I'm sort of a purist and think jumping is okay, but jump cues should be illegal. Jumping with your playing cue is cool though. I do own a jump cue, but haven't pulled it out in probably six months.

 

[Snapshot9]

Several threads on this

been discussed at length before, several times. Sammy Jones, Lori Jon's husband, is given much credit for the first jump cue, especially in competition. Earl was known for jumping with a regular cue before the jump cue came along.

Just why do you think they should be illegal? Because you are not profficient with one? Because you are getting beat with them? I seriously doubt that baseball players today would like to play by the regulations of the 1930's, so it is with Pool too. There are some players that can jump almost as well and as close with a regular cue as you and I can with a jump cue, should they be then banned from doing this? What about just using their shaft to jump?

Then, we would have to discuss Masse' shots! Shouldn't they then be illegal too?

Are we to make all the regulations just so they suit you, and you can then excel under them where you can not otherwise?

Do you start to see just how ridiculous I can make this sound. The sport evolves, jump cues are part of the evolution, get over it. Learn to use it or not, I don't care, but you will have to deal with them in a match. If you don't want to deal with them in a match, I suggest you practice on your safeties a lot more, to where you can freeze the cue ball behind a ball to where your opponent can not jump, or to play safeties that it will not be feasable for an opponent to try to jump.

We don't live in a 2 dimensional world, so why should we limit our sports to 2 dimensions, think about that in relation to other sports?

 

[poolmouse]

Just why do you think they should be illegal?

If I owned a poolroom, I'm sure I'd want to disallow them. Doing so would kill business. So I guess it's a catch-22.

Poolmouse

 

[softshot]

I suggest you practice on your safeties a lot more, to where you can freeze the cue ball behind a ball to where your opponent can not jump, or to play safeties that it will not be feasable for an opponent to try to jump.

you could always work on your position play.. and ball pocketing ability..then you won't need a jump cue at all... and the opponent will never get a chance to use his...

 

[BPG24]

It's hilarious to me that everytime someone suggets that jump cues should be banned, the people who disagree immediately say "you only feel that way because you can't use one"..

What a joke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can jump balls just fine with them, and still believe they should be banned.
They take away from the strategy of the game and make knowledge of the diamond system for kicking almost useless unless you are frozen to a ball

 

[shinyballs]

Jeez, just because I don't think they should be a part of the game doesn't mean that I can't use one. I DO own one and CAN use it. I choose not to in most cases. I am a good kicker and play pretty good safeties. I'm as entitled to my opinion as anyone else.

Snapshot9, I'm not getting beat much lately.

 

[JLW]

been discussed at length before, several times. Sammy Jones, Lori Jon's husband, is given much credit for the first jump cue, especially in competition. Earl was known for jumping with a regular cue before the jump cue came along.

Just why do you think they should be illegal? Because you are not profficient with one? Because you are getting beat with them? I seriously doubt that baseball players today would like to play by the regulations of the 1930's, so it is with Pool too. There are some players that can jump almost as well and as close with a regular cue as you and I can with a jump cue, should they be then banned from doing this? What about just using their shaft to jump?

Then, we would have to discuss Masse' shots! Shouldn't they then be illegal too?

Are we to make all the regulations just so they suit you, and you can then excel under them where you can not otherwise?

Do you start to see just how ridiculous I can make this sound. The sport evolves, jump cues are part of the evolution, get over it. Learn to use it or not, I don't care, but you will have to deal with them in a match. If you don't want to deal with them in a match, I suggest you practice on your safeties a lot more, to where you can freeze the cue ball behind a ball to where your opponent can not jump, or to play safeties that it will not be feasable for an opponent to try to jump.

We don't live in a 2 dimensional world, so why should we limit our sports to 2 dimensions, think about that in relation to other sports?

I have nothing against jumping balls, I just feel that it should be done (especially at the professional level) with a pool cue. It doesn't have anything to do with my proficiency at pool. It's just that, IMHO, the game is more pure when it's played that way. If you're a recreational player who likes playing with a jump cue, go for it! More power to ya.

 

[worriedbeef]

my one problem with the anti-jump cue crowd is they make out like using one is easy. it's easy to jump a ball 40cm's away and make a hanger in the pocket yes, but an equivalent kick to this would be a small unmissable one rail kick as well.

plus as much as i respect anybody immensely who can jump with a full length cue, it helps if you are tall a big deal too. look at earl, and shane.

 

[JimS]

That's my take on them also. I'd vote for the ban... if I had a vote.

 

[hang-the-9]

The dedicated jump sticks are too easy to use. We had a guy try one, never used it before and he jumped a full ball very near the cue ball. How does that help to advance the game? Jumping with your play cue takes skill, that should be as legal in tournaments as a kick. While it's true that technology of the game advances, it should do so to make things more consistent instead of easier. I'd rather have rubber and cloth that reacts the same way all the time than have a "auto-bank" rubber that lights up in the spot you need to hit for a bank. Same for tips, shafts, etc... more consistency but not gimmicks to make the game easier.

 

[Snapshot9]

added notes.

I wasn't enamoured with jump cues when they came along, I jumped with a full cue, and can do so pretty darn good, and I am only 5'7".

I kick better than I jump, up through 5 rails. Anything above that, which there never is, and I would have to think a minute or so on it.

When left hooked, I evaluate what would be the best result for me to win the game. If I do not feel I can jump and make the ball, I then evaluate whether I would get a better leave by kicking or jumping and just hitting the ball. I don't jump just to be jumping or because I have a jump cue. That's just an example of one of my sayings for years, "Play for the game, not the shot".

But, I started getting beat with jump cues by guys that couldn't beat me otherwise (a ball or 2 below me), so I caved in, bought one, and learned how to use it. I still have problems at times because of my height.

There is a big difference between someone just being able to hit the ball and being able to make them on a regular basis.
Do you really think a 1 rail kick to knock in a hanger is any harder than jumping a ball to make the hanger? But, when the ball is in the middle of the table, that is the test for either a jump shot or a kick. Most players, especially below a 7 level, don't make about 96% of their jumps, and as a result, they probably sell out the majority of the time.

People have always, since day 1, been beating other people in Pool by doing something that noone else could do, in many aspects of the sport. The things they learned to do allowed them a level of excellence that others didn't have. Jumping is no different.

I like to know your thoughts about 3D Chess to regular Chess?

There are 'tricks' for knowing how to kick? tricks for knowing how to break? tricks for knowing how to rack? When all it is in the end, is just the knowledge to be able to do it, no matter what it is.

 

[hfelsh]

I have nothing against jumping balls, I just feel that it should be done (especially at the professional level) with a pool cue.

Ummm...isn't a jump cue technically a "pool cue"? I mean, what else do you use it for, besides playing pool?

It doesn't have anything to do with my proficiency at pool.

Uh, of course it does. If you use one, and you're good at using it, your proficiency is better. Duh. :idea2:

It's just that, IMHO, the game is more pure when it's played that way. If you're a recreational player who likes playing with a jump cue, go for it! More power to ya.

"More pure"?

Give me a break!

What about jump/break cues that unscrew at the wrap area? Are those "more" or "less pure"? Should we "vote to outlaw" those too? What exactly the heck is "more pure", anyway? :scratchhead: 9-ball "ball in hand" was added to speed the game up for TV matches. Didn't that make it "less pure"? Are you in favor of voting to ban that, too?

They take away from the strategy of the game and make knowledge of the diamond system for kicking almost useless unless you are frozen to a ball

That's my take on them also. I'd vote for the ban... if I had a vote.

Odd, I don't see the post by BPG24 that you quoted? Anyway, how does it "take away from the strategy" or "make knowledge of the diamond system for kicking almost useless unless you are frozen to a ball"? If you can jump and make the hit and/or drop the ball, that's what matters.

The dedicated jump sticks are too easy to use. We had a guy try one, never used it before and he jumped a full ball very near the cue ball. How does that help to advance the game?

Ummm....by allowing him to play better?

...Jumping with your play cue takes skill, that should be as legal in tournaments as a kick. While it's true that technology of the game advances, it should do so to make things more consistent instead of easier.

Well, we should probably vote for a ban on low-deflection shafts, too, shouldn't we? Those don't make things "more consistent", they make them EASIER. (Of course, that's probably a different debate for a different time, but still...) Gee, if we want to be "more pure", I guess we should not allow phenolic tips...or gloves. I mean, no one wore a glove back in the day, when it was still a "pure" game, right? :banghead: Heck, maybe we should require that all "professional" players use Ivory ferrules. That's "pure", right?

...I'd rather have rubber and cloth that reacts the same way all the time than have a "auto-bank" rubber that lights up in the spot you need to hit for a bank. Same for tips, shafts, etc... more consistency but not gimmicks to make the game easier.

So I take it you don't use laminated tips, and instead stick to solid one-piece leather tips?

I mean, they're also something "new" that evolved, and don't make things "more consistent", but instead make things (tip maintenance, et. al) easier (again, probably a different debate for another time.)

Eh...most of the comments in this thread are some of the most ridiculous ones I've seen in a long time. "More pure".... :rotflmao1:

 

[Ironman317]

you cant teach anyone with any kind of coordination to jump a ball with todays jump cues...it takes literally years to learn how to kick properly.

 

[TheBook]

I just read in a article that Pat Fleming was instrumental in the development of the jump cue. This was in a article in "Inside English" about him and Allen Hopkins being inducted into the Hall of Fame.

http://www.insideenglish.net/index.htm

 

[tjlmbklr]

If I owned a poolroom, I'm sure I'd want to disallow them. Doing so would kill business. So I guess it's a catch-22.

Poolmouse

I have thought about this many times. I would have a "Pool room advanced player card" this would have to be earned by the player from the owner/staff. You would then be allowed to do masses, jumps and any other fancy things poolhall owners don't like seeing amateurs doing.

I know Romines here in Milwaukee doesn't allow jump cues but does allow jumping with a full cue....makes no sense to me. I think the full cue has more potential to tear cloth (said reason for not allowing jump cues) then a standard jump cue.

IMO