Blaze Tour ban

[BPG24]

This is true, and I agree.

I think why this poll was a little revealing, though, is that it captured an audience from many backgrounds around the States. One voter was a gal who plays on a league, and so she knew who Earl was.

What Softspot was getting at is that if you were to walk down the street in ANYWHERE, USA, and ask 100 people who Earl Strickland was, I think you would be lucky to get one correct answer.

If you were to walk down the street in ANYWHERE, PHILIPPINES, and ask 100 people who Efren Reyes was, I think you would get almost a perfect score of 100 correct answers. Efren Reyes is to Philippines what Michael Jordan and Tiger Woods is to the States.

JAM

Ya, i agree with you there.... No doubt...
it's a shame that pool is what it is... I love the game and wish there was something I could do, but it will take some real $ and a lot of commitment to bring the game back to where it once was

 

[ShootingArts]

TV and corporate sponsorship

Notice that even many years later the two names most known are the ones that spent some real time on major TV networks when there were only a few and had major endorsement deals where their names and images were seen in stores by almost everyone sooner or later.

As always, it comes down to live audience and TV audience and pool lacks both in the US. A shame that Jeanette Lee wasn't included in your poll. My bet is that she would have outpolled everyone but Fats, not sure how she would have compared with him. From what was real and for the movie "The Hustler" which he forever claimed credit for, he entered the American culture in a way that no other pool player of my time ever has. I happened to turn on the TV yesterday and Paul Newman's first game with Jackie Gleason was just starting. Jackie was fantastic! Fats may owe more to Jackie Gleason's performance than anything he ever did himself.

Hu

I think Softshot is right about this fact. I did a poll on another forum, an industry forum to my profession consisting of mainly American women. I labeled it as "Have you ever heard of any of these people?"

Earl Strickland (4.2%)
Efren Reyes (2.1%)
Steve Mizerak (4.2%)
Alex Higgins (4.2%)
Cliff Thorburn (2.1%)
Rudolph Wanderone, Jr., a/k/a "Minnesota Fats" (35.4%)
Willie Mosconi (12.5%)
None (35.4%)

Notice that "None" category tied with "Minnesota Fats" category.

JAM

 

[9 Ball Girl]

Well this is perplexing. So Tony is banned because he decided to start a tour or because some of his tour dates will conflict with some of the Blaze dates? If so, isn't that the always the case with tours? There'll always be conflicts, it can't be that all of Tony's dates conflict with the Blaze's dates, no? And what if some players decide to go to Tony's tour on one of those conflicting dates? Will they be banned?

It's too early in the morning for me so you'll have to forgive my ignorance. I have to admit that when I saw the thread title I thought "who was unsportsmanlike now?" and when I opened the thread and saw Tony's name, I was like WTF?! (no pun intended for Double G's team)

 

[lodini]

and when I opened the thread and saw Tony's name, I was like WTF?! (no pun intended for Double G's team)

My thoughts exactly when I heard Tony's name!

 

[GG11]

Well this is perplexing. So Tony is banned because he decided to start a tour or because some of his tour dates will conflict with some of the Blaze dates? If so, isn't that the always the case with tours? There'll always be conflicts, it can't be that all of Tony's dates conflict with the Blaze's dates, no? And what if some players decide to go to Tony's tour on one of those conflicting dates? Will they be banned?

It's too early in the morning for me so you'll have to forgive my ignorance. I have to admit that when I saw the thread title I thought "who was unsportsmanlike now?" and when I opened the thread and saw Tony's name, I was like WTF?! (no pun intended for Double G's team)

The whole story is really quite sad. IMO, people are so used to lies and backstabbing in this sport that they simply assume that is always the underlying intent. Even from a man like Tony Robles.

Tony is banned b/c Jose believes the lies and hearsay surrounding Tony's intentions which are completely and totally false. Tony has tried to reason with the Jose in hopes of not conflicting with them OR the Joss Tour and hoping they all could work together. Unfortunately Jose assumes that Tony MUST be starting this tour as a personal attack on Jose and the Blaze Tour. Reality Check ... the world does not revolve around either. Tony has wanted to start a tour for a long time and has finally decided to do it.

The Blaze Tour has had many accusations thrown their way about the way the tour is handled. None of this concerns Tony's new tour.

 

[MikeJanis]

The whole story is really quite sad. IMO, people are so used to lies and backstabbing in this sport that they simply assume that is always the underlying intent. Even from a man like Tony Robles.

Tony is banned b/c Jose believes the lies and hearsay surrounding Tony's intentions which are completely and totally false. Tony has tried to reason with the Jose in hopes of not conflicting with them OR the Joss Tour and hoping they all could work together. Unfortunately Jose assumes that Tony MUST be starting this tour as a personal attack on Jose and the Blaze Tour. Reality Check ... the world does not revolve around either. Tony has wanted to start a tour for a long time and has finally decided to do it.

The Blaze Tour has had many accusations thrown their way about the way the tour is handled. None of this concerns Tony's new tour.

One of the biggest problems is this. A new tour starts and schedules 10 dates. That same new tour then expects the existing tours in that region to just lay down and not work that weekend. This is a joke. We have been busting our butts to get regions going and the trust of the room owners, sponsors and players alike then somebody thinks they can just walk in and take a third of the business.

AND THAT IS HOW IT IS PERCIEVED FROM MANY REGIONAL TOUR PROMOTERS.

 

[GG11]

One of the biggest problems is this. A new tour starts and schedules 10 dates. That same new tour then expects the existing tours in that region to just lay down and not work that weekend. This is a joke. We have been busting our butts to get regions going and the trust of the room owners, sponsors and players alike then somebody thinks they can just walk in and take a third of the business.

AND THAT IS HOW IT IS PERCIEVED FROM MANY REGIONAL TOUR PROMOTERS.

Tony was aware of this perception. This is why he personally called and spoke to Mike and Jose BEFORE setting up dates AROUND these two tours. This way it would be a unified front, not a divided one.

 

[JAM]

Me personally, I like seeing a variety of regional tours out there. The more, the merrier!

I don't know all the details about why Blaze TD Jose would ban Tony Robles from his tour. The three-sides-to-the-story rule applies here.

The fact that Tony Robles spoke to Mike Zuglan (Joss Tour TD) speaks volumes to me. Mike Zuglan's tour is a long-standing tour in the Northeast Region and enjoys loyal supporters, to include pool room owners and players.

Blaze Tour is usually a one-day tournament which takes place on Sunday. I know of several players who like this event because if they are shooting in a two-day weekend tournament and get knocked out of it on a Saturday, then they can just travel to Jose's Blaze Tour and enter the Sunday event!

The other thing cool about the Blaze Tour is the fact that it is usually only one day. This saves on tournament expenses for many, not having to get a hotel room.

I think this thread is a little misleading because nobody knows Tony's or Jose's side of the story. In my world, we call it "hearsay."

JAM

 

[MikeJanis]

Tony was aware of this perception. This is why he personally called and spoke to Mike and Jose BEFORE setting up dates AROUND these two tours. This way it would be a unified front, not a divided one.

As I stated earlier. I have NO clue what is going on with that situation. My only source of info on this subject is what I read here on AZ.

With that said, the only true way for Tony to live up to what you say that he sais is for him to only schedule events after Zuglan and Jose have released their dates (and they must not be conflicting dates). Otherwise it's just words.

I hope this will be forwarded to him as sound advice.

Mj

 

[lodini]

As I stated earlier. I have NO clue what is going on with that situation. My only source of info on this subject is what I read here on AZ.

With that said, the only true way for Tony to live up to what you say that he sais is for him to only schedule events after Zuglan and Jose have released their dates (and they must not be conflicting dates). Otherwise it's just words.

I hope this will be forwarded to him as sound advice.

Mj

I am 100% sure that Tony would have been more than willing to work with the other tours, as opposed to against them. I just feel like the imposed "ban" on him is a personal attack, and that's what will prevent this from being a peaceful development. (though knowing Tony, he probably still will be the bigger person on this!)

 

[GG11]

As I stated earlier. I have NO clue what is going on with that situation. My only source of info on this subject is what I read here on AZ.

With that said, the only true way for Tony to live up to what you say that he sais is for him to only schedule events after Zuglan and Jose have released their dates (and they must not be conflicting dates). Otherwise it's just words.

I hope this will be forwarded to him as sound advice.

Mj

With Mike and the Joss Tour, he's fully on board. After Jose's actions toward Tony and the terrible way he has treated him and bad-mouthed him ... well, only time will tell.

Mike, thank you for you advice. I have forwarded the information to Tony and it is very much appreciated. Congratulations on your candidacy for the BCA. I wish you all the best! I have never played in any of your tours as they are not in my vicinity, but I hear wonderful things about them. Good luck!!

 

[ShootingArts]

impact

Mike Janis said it well in his posts. Any competition in the same area will impact existing tours negatively in a tight market. The market is very tight now and Blaze is acting defensively. They may find that the negative publicity does them more harm than letting Tony play on their tour while promoting his own ever could but it is easy to see their motivations. Fear and a struggle for survival.

Hu

Well this is perplexing. So Tony is banned because he decided to start a tour or because some of his tour dates will conflict with some of the Blaze dates? If so, isn't that the always the case with tours? There'll always be conflicts, it can't be that all of Tony's dates conflict with the Blaze's dates, no? And what if some players decide to go to Tony's tour on one of those conflicting dates? Will they be banned?

It's too early in the morning for me so you'll have to forgive my ignorance. I have to admit that when I saw the thread title I thought "who was unsportsmanlike now?" and when I opened the thread and saw Tony's name, I was like WTF?! (no pun intended for Double G's team)

 

[Tom M]

Hmmmmmm, interesting story. Toney Robles starts a tour, Tommy Kennedy, Shannon Daulton, Ron Wiseman is promoting events, Shawn Putnam is directing events ...............

I have no clue about the Blaze Tour and the Toney Robles story but to me it sounds like the same sad story all over again.

Boy oh boy do I wish I could tell the whole story on how bad this is for the sport.

I'm just wondering what players will be left to compete in tournaments beside their own?
.

Yep. The Pro Waterski Tour NEVER and I mean NEVER recovered from a competing tour that cropped up in the early 1990's...

 

[Njhustler1]

Somebody mentioned it earlier. I think soliciting beer sponsors would be the wisest move. Granted it would be very difficult to get the attention of a major beer producer like budweiser. which could be why nobody seems to be persuing or landing any deals like that. but there's still tons and tons of smaller beer companies that have lots of money to spend, and are still looking to make a name for themselves. Companies such as Brooklyn Lager or Yeungling, which are regionally known might be more willing to throw some bucks towards a tour in their area to help build their brand by putting their name on the tour.

 

[frankwhite]

Me personally, I like seeing a variety of regional tours out there. The more, the merrier!

I don't know all the details about why Blaze TD Jose would ban Tony Robles from his tour. The three-sides-to-the-story rule applies here.

The fact that Tony Robles spoke to Mike Zuglan (Joss Tour TD) speaks volumes to me. Mike Zuglan's tour is a long-standing tour in the Northeast Region and enjoys loyal supporters, to include pool room owners and players.

Blaze Tour is usually a one-day tournament which takes place on Sunday. I know of several players who like this event because if they are shooting in a two-day weekend tournament and get knocked out of it on a Saturday, then they can just travel to Jose's Blaze Tour and enter the Sunday event!

The other thing cool about the Blaze Tour is the fact that it is usually only one day. This saves on tournament expenses for many, not having to get a hotel room.

I think this thread is a little misleading because nobody knows Tony's or Jose's side of the story. In my world, we call it "hearsay."

JAM

This story goes wayyyyyy beyond what everyone is talking about. This is just terrible for the players and just mens pool in general. Anything said by myself further will not be gentlemen like at all..........so w/ that being said I hope it just dies out....

 

[frankwhite]

I am 100% sure that Tony would have been more than willing to work with the other tours, as opposed to against them. I just feel like the imposed "ban" on him is a personal attack, and that's what will prevent this from being a peaceful development. (though knowing Tony, he probably still will be the bigger person on this!)

You could not have hit the nail on the head any better then your reply......
Frankie

 

[lodini]

I think this thread is a little misleading because nobody knows Tony's or Jose's side of the story. In my world, we call it "hearsay."

JAM

I don't think the thread is "misleading" because it is a fact that Tony has been banned... the thread was started because I was asking if this sort of thing is unusual. Then people who are privy to insider information have responded with their take on what happened and why. I haven't heard any speculation, yet... only people that know what they are talking about.

 

[JAM]

I don't think the thread is "misleading" because it is a fact that Tony has been banned... the thread was started because I was asking if this sort of thing is unusual. Then people who are privy to insider information have responded with their take on what happened and why. I haven't heard any speculation, yet... only people that know what they are talking about.

I was not meaning to demean you in any way.

However, neither Jose or Tony are here to reveal their side of the story.

I am on the phone right now with Frankie White. Tony just left his house, and I am learning a little more about the situation -- "insider information," I guess as you term it.

I like Tony Robles very much, and I hope he ignores the rumor mill and gossip.

JAM

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

Wow, I seriously think we're all giving the Blaze Tour more credit than it deserves. First place has seen as little as $475 and rarely does it eclipse $1k. Banning Tony Robles from walking my dog will probably have as much impact on his life.

 

[DaveK]

We have been busting our butts to get regions going and the trust of the room owners, sponsors and players alike then somebody thinks they can just walk in and take a third of the business.

That's the 'trouble' with free competition, someone develops a market then has to defend it against newcomers. The only way to prevent that from happening is to fail with the market development, which of course is never the goal. Note that this 'trouble' is only 'trouble' to the incumbent. To the newcomer it is 'opportunity'.

Dave