Biloxi Boy
Man With A Golden Arm
Yeah, I am very confused. Why don't you educate me.
Bring Back Hustling Culture
- Thread starter Minnesota Phat
- Start date
Gambling: A player I know, of similar skillset and I match up and play a Race to 7 for $100 a set. Everything is above board. Reference: Fast Eddie matching up with Minnesota Fats.
Hustling: A player preys on a player of lessor skill while hiding his true speed in an attempt to steal. Reference: Fast Eddie playing 9B and getting his thumbs broken.
Two very different scenarios.
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
You're right. I guess personally as long as there is a place to play I don't really care. I probably have a bad attitude about it. I've just been really apathetic lately with scattered thoughts. The pool table is my sanctuary. I just don't care about the money aspect. Some things are too pure/beautiful to make into a cash venture.
If someone can eke out a living via the game I'm ok with that too but pool is an escape from all that stuff for me personally.
Wrong...take the old west for example... Does anyone know how it really was? Or do they think it was like Hollywood portrayed it in movies? Most people believe gunfights were common and were done in duel like fashion, when in fact they were not. There are many more examples.
Took a job one time, we were required to play 9 EVERY morning before work. Like you, I’d rather play pool.This is true in my business, and I hate it lol. Golf doesn’t interest me at all for some reason. Everyone I know that’s a serious pool player tells me I would love it.
I’ve played one time for a work thing and I was horrendous but I did have a little fun. I hit the golf ball about 70% of the time I swung at it which they all told me was good for never swinging a club before but the ball rarely went anywhere.
I think it’s just that I realize how much time and effort it will take to get competent and I’m not truly interested in it, I’d rather spend that time on my pool game. But all promotions come on the golf course. New client relationship building and all that. My boss wants all the project managers to be good at golf and I’m like ...Why can’t it be pool? It’s a better game and I’m good at it damnit! Lol
I get it. Pool is an escape for lots of folks, me included. But imagine a newbie who has the same passion for the game as you and I and also uses it as an escape but gets taken advantage of from a dirtbag and loses a fair amount of cash. That newbie may never venture into a pool room again.
Biloxi Boy
Man With A Golden Arm
Almost. You overlooked adjusting for dissimilar skillsets through weight. But you already knew that right?
Weight is usually implemented in an attempt to even the match. Hustlers will only give weight when they know they have the nuts. Again, big difference in how weight is used in an above board gambling session vs a hustler attempting to steal.
But you already knew that, right?
Biloxi Boy
Man With A Golden Arm
I know you forgot to mention a most critical aspect of gambling.
The people I shoot with: ONLY GIVE YA WEIGHT TO GET YOU TO PLAY IN ORDER TO TAKE YOUR MONEY!!! AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
TFT
p.s. thank God I do not gamble. I get my "lessons" in one pocket at the price of pool time, I am blessed.
Ever be looking for deals on the market sites and you come across a good score or two? And then by the time you can close the deal, you find them relisted at a far less palatable price? Any difference?
99% of the Hustlin , I have observed, was two or more ,loud mouthed idiots, that no one in their right mind would ever pay any attention to, holding the entire pool room hostage, to their stupidity.
Most "regulars" in pool circles are familiar with the 1972 Chicago News 5 video of a Johnston City tournament. The news anchor speaks about the man in the python shoes, none other than Minnesota Fats:
NEWS ANCHOR: Then there's the King of the Hustlers, Minnesota Fats, who helped put the Johnston City tournament together. Fats lives about 12 miles from the show bar, but he never plays in the tournament. He waits for someone to win the $20,000 prize money and then shoots them for the cash. That's his hustle, but according to Fats, everybody's got one.
Then comes Minnesota Fats with his gift of gab:
MINNESOTA FATS: Ain't Nixon hustling? Ain't he out shaking hands, 24 hours a day, trying to be the President? Hey, ain't everybody hustling? Yeah, everybody's scuffling. You see, there's two different—there's a scuffler and a hustler. A hustler is one that's always in action and gets it once in a while, see, and a good hustler gets it more often. Then there's a scuffler. He never gets it. Understand? All he ever does is waste his time, gets in everybody's way. You understand? He goes through life, and he's a failure.
The ending to this 3-minute video says it all: Hustling may have been the name of the game, but it was a way of life.
In the '80s era. I went on the road with a Maryland player named Geese. We mostly traveled down South, hoping to get in action. Yes, Geese was hustling, I guess you could say, because Geese had the best of it in most circumstances, but he didn't always win. We both had to call Western Union several times because we went busted. Back then, there were no one-trick ponies in pool. A road agent played all games, to include snooker, hoping to get in action, unlike today's players who specialize in straight pool, rotation pool, et cetera. It's usually the experienced players who emigrate to one-pocket because it encompasses the strategies of all pool games.
The thing about hustling on the road in the '80s, you never walked in with your own pool cue. You shot with a house cue, some of which were metal. Geese would never wear sneakers inside a pool room or pool bar because he said it was a "tell." Sometimes we'd get steered to a place where there was known action. There was the owner of a pool room in Tennessee that loved playing good players if they gave him a handicap, and you could win big there. Bakers pool room in Tampa, Florida, was another known action spot.
Fast forward to 2022. Because of the internet, the age of the road agents is gone. Everybody knows everybody and how well they play. Back in the '80s, players would sometimes step up to plate against total strangers. But make no mistake about it. Today's players who engage in action are hoping somebody's going to drop their wallet, so to speak, rather than play a fair competition match. This is why the matching-up barkfests take so long. Everybody's got a little larceny in them when it comes to games of stake. Pool with all its warts and flaws of gambling and hustling is fun to some, and to pool purists, those action players are treated like pariahs and are killing pool.
Enter center stage comes Matchroom. If they succeed in transforming pool to a professional tour with a ranking system, pool moves to the next frontier and thrives. If they fail, well, pool will sink into the abyss of other games like croquet being played at barbecues or in the pool bar for a brewskie or in a pool room for the cost of table time. And thanks to social media, gone are the days of the road warriors, what I still consider as pool's golden years.
NEWS ANCHOR: Then there's the King of the Hustlers, Minnesota Fats, who helped put the Johnston City tournament together. Fats lives about 12 miles from the show bar, but he never plays in the tournament. He waits for someone to win the $20,000 prize money and then shoots them for the cash. That's his hustle, but according to Fats, everybody's got one.
Then comes Minnesota Fats with his gift of gab:
MINNESOTA FATS: Ain't Nixon hustling? Ain't he out shaking hands, 24 hours a day, trying to be the President? Hey, ain't everybody hustling? Yeah, everybody's scuffling. You see, there's two different—there's a scuffler and a hustler. A hustler is one that's always in action and gets it once in a while, see, and a good hustler gets it more often. Then there's a scuffler. He never gets it. Understand? All he ever does is waste his time, gets in everybody's way. You understand? He goes through life, and he's a failure.
The ending to this 3-minute video says it all: Hustling may have been the name of the game, but it was a way of life.
In the '80s era. I went on the road with a Maryland player named Geese. We mostly traveled down South, hoping to get in action. Yes, Geese was hustling, I guess you could say, because Geese had the best of it in most circumstances, but he didn't always win. We both had to call Western Union several times because we went busted. Back then, there were no one-trick ponies in pool. A road agent played all games, to include snooker, hoping to get in action, unlike today's players who specialize in straight pool, rotation pool, et cetera. It's usually the experienced players who emigrate to one-pocket because it encompasses the strategies of all pool games.
The thing about hustling on the road in the '80s, you never walked in with your own pool cue. You shot with a house cue, some of which were metal. Geese would never wear sneakers inside a pool room or pool bar because he said it was a "tell." Sometimes we'd get steered to a place where there was known action. There was the owner of a pool room in Tennessee that loved playing good players if they gave him a handicap, and you could win big there. Bakers pool room in Tampa, Florida, was another known action spot.
Fast forward to 2022. Because of the internet, the age of the road agents is gone. Everybody knows everybody and how well they play. Back in the '80s, players would sometimes step up to plate against total strangers. But make no mistake about it. Today's players who engage in action are hoping somebody's going to drop their wallet, so to speak, rather than play a fair competition match. This is why the matching-up barkfests take so long. Everybody's got a little larceny in them when it comes to games of stake. Pool with all its warts and flaws of gambling and hustling is fun to some, and to pool purists, those action players are treated like pariahs and are killing pool.
Enter center stage comes Matchroom. If they succeed in transforming pool to a professional tour with a ranking system, pool moves to the next frontier and thrives. If they fail, well, pool will sink into the abyss of other games like croquet being played at barbecues or in the pool bar for a brewskie or in a pool room for the cost of table time. And thanks to social media, gone are the days of the road warriors, what I still consider as pool's golden years.
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I used to play guys I didn’t know in the 80’s and won. Guys trying to hustle me-got hustled themselves sometimes-I’d win. Other times I lost, got robbed. Didn’t have a chance. Hustling isn’t without the risk of losing.
Running a con there’s zero chance of losing-a dump, for example. Get the “confidence” of a backer and toss him off being the most common “con” in pool.
There’s the distinction between hustling and conning.
Confidence games can be hustled. By enticing people to play or stake you. When you have the mortal nuts or dumping the backer. That’s the con part, the enticement in the hustle part. 2 separate things.
Hustle-getting someone to do something
Con-robbing them
This is where the confusion is for most people. The art of persuasion is a hustle, but not necessarily a con.
Important to know a hustle and a con are 2 distinct different things. Until a person can make this differentiation they don’t understand the art of the hustle.
Nice post JAM-spot on!
Fatboy<——-just a old broken down telemarketer. Who hustled the con…..I never conned a hustle. There is a difference
Running a con there’s zero chance of losing-a dump, for example. Get the “confidence” of a backer and toss him off being the most common “con” in pool.
There’s the distinction between hustling and conning.
Confidence games can be hustled. By enticing people to play or stake you. When you have the mortal nuts or dumping the backer. That’s the con part, the enticement in the hustle part. 2 separate things.
Hustle-getting someone to do something
Con-robbing them
This is where the confusion is for most people. The art of persuasion is a hustle, but not necessarily a con.
Important to know a hustle and a con are 2 distinct different things. Until a person can make this differentiation they don’t understand the art of the hustle.
Nice post JAM-spot on!
Fatboy<——-just a old broken down telemarketer. Who hustled the con…..I never conned a hustle. There is a difference
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See post #94
It’s late, I’m pretty tired. Did my best to explain to you what I meant. If it’s not clear please let me know. It’s kinda complex-most things are when I’m this tired lol.
Also I gave you the like because I like the fact we can talk and exchange ideas. You have always been very nice to me and I’m not going to give you a dislike over a post-ever.
Your a good guy and great to have you here, I enjoy your posts. So if I’m gonna respond to one I like it! I think that’s courteous and shows respect.
Kindest regards
Fatboy
Biloxi Boy
Man With A Golden Arm
Pool is a wonderful game, by itself, with nothing more. In the first instance, one must love the game itself. Then come the different environments in which we play the game. By and large, we are most comfortable with the familiar, and what we came up in is usually where we would remain if given the choice. The problem is that our choices are limited because this ever evolving world does not stand still, and any one of us who lives too long will die in an alien world devoid of the familiar.
I keep thinking of the photos of crowded pool halls from the 20's and 30's, a hundred years ago. There was a time when pool was every man's game, and the places where pool was played were places of refuge where one could for a time escape the world and all its hassles. This is what I feel pool is losing. It is a wonderful thing to be among friends and just relax while enjoying a common interest. Too, there is a comfort in just knowing that such sanctuary is available, in the neighborhood or across town, if one determines to seek it.
Several things are certain. I am of pool's past, and pool has no future unless there are pool tables available and young folks want, really burn, to play on them. When I was young, I played pool everywhere I found a table, there were quite a few to be found, and I was always searching. It just does not seem that there are as many tables available today. (Pool tables are burdens. Unlike a croquet set, you cannot put it in a closet and set it up only for play.) Further, computers, electronic games, and the internet have captured so many generations of potential pool players that I am afraid our depleted population cannot recover. Recruitment is the lifeblood of every group.
Having said all of this, I really want pool to have a future, and if tournament play and antiseptic pool rooms are its future, so be it. I hope all future pool players have half as much entertainment, and education, as I found.
I keep thinking of the photos of crowded pool halls from the 20's and 30's, a hundred years ago. There was a time when pool was every man's game, and the places where pool was played were places of refuge where one could for a time escape the world and all its hassles. This is what I feel pool is losing. It is a wonderful thing to be among friends and just relax while enjoying a common interest. Too, there is a comfort in just knowing that such sanctuary is available, in the neighborhood or across town, if one determines to seek it.
Several things are certain. I am of pool's past, and pool has no future unless there are pool tables available and young folks want, really burn, to play on them. When I was young, I played pool everywhere I found a table, there were quite a few to be found, and I was always searching. It just does not seem that there are as many tables available today. (Pool tables are burdens. Unlike a croquet set, you cannot put it in a closet and set it up only for play.) Further, computers, electronic games, and the internet have captured so many generations of potential pool players that I am afraid our depleted population cannot recover. Recruitment is the lifeblood of every group.
Having said all of this, I really want pool to have a future, and if tournament play and antiseptic pool rooms are its future, so be it. I hope all future pool players have half as much entertainment, and education, as I found.
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I just never broke it down into two stages before. I can see it.See post #94
It’s late, I’m pretty tired. Did my best to explain to you what I meant. If it’s not clear please let me know. It’s kinda complex-most things are when I’m this tired lol.
Also I gave you the like because I like the fact we can talk and exchange ideas. You have always been very nice to me and I’m not going to give you a dislike over a post-ever.
Your a good guy and great to have you here, I enjoy your posts. So if I’m gonna respond to one I like it! I think that’s courteous and shows respect.
Kindest regards
Fatboy
Tap, tap, tap.
Playing pool should never feel like going to the library.
Nothing better than attaining skills and elevating your game, except waking up with the cash.