Bring Back Hustling Culture

Biloxi Boy said:
Come on down. The water's fine.
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The local Biloxi boys are easy pickings on the pool tables. Countless airmen and tourists pass through every year and rob the locals blind and steal their women's hearts. Very easy to pluck the low hanging fruit in that paradise! 🤑

Just be careful of the stingrays, stinging nettles and mosquitos when they are in season. :oops:
 
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Minnesota Phat said:
Thank you.

I agree with some of what you say, but consider this:

Some billiards halls have pull-tab booths, but few if any provide an option to bet on the outcome of billiards games.

People still bet on horse races (even though it's arguably inhumane), and people bet a lot on football games, etc. Draftkings allows you to bet on NASCAR, Golf, and four different video games (five, if you include Madden NFL).

Just about the only thing that doesn't have sanctioned betting is billiards. Wouldn't it be cool for a gambler to be able to bet on games between players who are right there in front of them playing live in their favorite billiards hall?

At a local bar tournament in my small, boring town, the tournament filled up so fast that they denied me entry. There were four pool tables, and they had 48 players competing.

BINGO is absurdly popular here - it packs bars that otherwise see about 20 customers a day, and wouldn't even see that many if not for the allure of other types of gambling.

I'm new to taking a serious interest in the sport, so I have a lot to learn, but from what I've gathered, it seems like some people in the billiards world are hell-bent on preventing the chocolate of billiards competition to mix with the peanut butter of gambling, and I think that's a huge mistake that has been a big part of what has crippled billiards as a spectator sport. Meanwhile, the Mosconi-lovers have been so successful in cleaning up the "hustler" image of pool that almost every stranger I ask to play a friendly game of pool looks at me like I'm Minnesota Fats in a skinny-suit.
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Hey MF,
I like your idea. I think what you're saying is summed up by your comment, "The good of gambling without the bad."

On another note, here's a tournament flyer that may interest you. I'm on the committee for this event.
 

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it all boils down to gamblers and non gamblers. the gamblers are pieces of dirt in the mind of the others. and the others in the mind of the gamblers are just those that dont gamble.
 
JessEm said:
Hey MF,
I like your idea. I think what you're saying is summed up by your comment, "The good of gambling without the bad."

On another note, here's a tournament flyer that may interest you. I'm on the committee for this event.
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Fatboy said:
They had a keno board in the pool room in vegas. It sat there for years catching dust.

Then one day someone got it out and they were playing $1 a roll. In a few days $2000/roll.

Someone called the Gaming Division which is real serious biz in Nevada obviously.


They almost lost their restricted license for video poker. They didn’t because it was the first violation. But you can be sure there was never a keno board there again.

Pool action continued as normal. But that was discreet.

Fatboy<———anyone seen Bucktooth?
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It's funny you mentioned the keno board, weenie beanie used to carry a thing called an Amos and Andy board in the back of his car. It was basically the same thing. Even though it looks like a game that's absolutely all luck there was some skill involved cuz he would play it and win all the time.
 
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Minnesota Phat said:
Lots of great comments here - I especially love hearing you guys' stories.
A lot of you didn't read the post I wrote, but to reiterate, I'm not talking about running cons, cheating, or sharking. I defined "hustling" as playing for stakes, so call it "stake playing" if the word "hustling" has too many negative connotations for you.
What I'm proposing would eliminate many of the things that those of you who are anti-hustling dislike about hustling: I propose clear rules, clearly-marked "cash" tables, a referee, etc. Of course there is nuance, and the details would need to be worked out to accomplish the general aim, but the point would be to eliminate the negatives, and keep the positives. A system could be devised for how to offer to spot balls, ask for balls to be spotted, etc. - I'd suggest writing everything like that down on a chalkboard.
As far as the gambling component, opposed to putting money on oneself, people already gamble on everything, and 99% of people who gamble on pull-tabs, lottery, etc. come out behind. Betting on the outcome of billiards games would be more interesting, and give better odds.
For fish like me, it would be like stepping up to a carnival booth and spending money to try to win a stuffed animal. I'd most probably lose, but it would be fun to play a skilled player who I know is actually trying to win, and maybe I'd get lucky. Meanwhile when the big dogs were playing one another, I'd have a chance to watch how these guys play when stakes are on the line, and wouldn't be the one weirdo watching their game.
To be clear, I'm not talking about making hustling ubiquitous in every bowling alley and bar - I'm talking about setting up specific places where playing for stakes would be done out in the open, and would be well-regulated to eliminate fights, robbery, cons, cheating, etc.
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I'd argue that's exactly what's being done with streaming challenge matches.
 
Well the era of the Hustler, or Road player is history.

It is one of those thing that shrunk away as Pool rooms closed.

Thing change, but history I’d there to study.

First computer used in USA, took lot of room. Todays hand help smart phone is better computer.

JMHO.😁
 
middleofnowhere said:
It's funny you mentioned the keno board, weenie beanie used to carry a thing called an Amos and Andy board in the back of his car. It was basically the same thing. Even though it looks like a game that's absolutely all luck there was some skill involved cuz he would play it and win all the time.
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The skill component is keeping the ball on the board the highest % of the time.

For someone who never has played or rarely plays it they might stay on the board 85/100 rolls whereas beanie would probably stay on 95/100. Sometimes the ball just won’t catch a hole so 100/100 is unlikely.

But 85/100 vs 95/100 is a HUGE edge for the skilled player. The holes the ball finds will even out over time like dice and card distribution over large samples of trials.

I have a couple keno boards. They are fun, I haven’t used them in years. I really need to set up a table. It’s fun to play socially as well.

There’s a video I saw beanie in with the Miller Lite girls playing keno, was at a tourney in the late 80’s I’d guess.

Fun times
Fatboy 😀
 
JessEm said:
Hey MF,
I like your idea. I think what you're saying is summed up by your comment, "The good of gambling without the bad."

On another note, here's a tournament flyer that may interest you. I'm on the committee for this event.
Click to expand...
Yes, exactly. Personally, I dislike gambling, but since everyone is gambling anyway, they might as well gamble on something more interesting than slot machines, pull tabs, and lottery tickets. Wagering on the outcome of games happening in front of them would be more interesting than mindlessly wasting money on e-tabs.
I don't consider staking oneself to be gambling - if that's gambling, then entering a tournament is gambling, and starting a small business is gambling.
Thanks for sharing the flyer. Does it start at 9 A.M.?
Would it maybe be possible to record my participation in the event, if I can make it? I have an idea for a vlog/documentary that I might actually pull together one of these days, and I'm trying to get a feel for how camera-shy the pool world is.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
Yes, exactly. Personally, I dislike gambling, but since everyone is gambling anyway, they might as well gamble on something more interesting than slot machines, pull tabs, and lottery tickets. Wagering on the outcome of games happening in front of them would be more interesting than mindlessly wasting money on e-tabs.
I don't consider staking oneself to be gambling - if that's gambling, then entering a tournament is gambling, and starting a small business is gambling.
Thanks for sharing the flyer. Does it start at 9 A.M.?
Would it maybe be possible to record my participation in the event, if I can make it? I have an idea for a vlog/documentary that I might actually pull together one of these days, and I'm trying to get a feel for how camera-shy the pool world is.
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There is a world of problems with this post. I'm not saying pool players are not honest but pool is a very easy game to fix. You would not be able to trust any outcome. You might as well bet on wrestling.
 
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middleofnowhere said:
There is a world of problems with this post. I'm not saying pool players are not honest but pool is a very game to fix. You would not be able to trust any outcome. You might as well bet on wrestling.
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The fix is in pretty much anywhere

The most honest action is when there’s 2 birds on a power line. And you bet on which one flys away first. The birds won’t dump you. People will.

Gambol

Best
Fatboy
 
By the logic given so far, schools of fish pack in to every casino on the face of the planet all day, every day waiting to be hustled, and there is no shortage of business, despite people booking losers 99.999% of the time. Only the 'big scores' are discussed.

Are these casinos parasites as well? Are the people willingly handing over their cash despite knowing (or not) the odds of booking a winner are not in their favor victims in a similar regard? Many don't believe so. Most people call them dumbasses.

Discuss.
 
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rexus31 said:
Not true at all in my instance and most likely many who have contributed to this thread. I gamble regularly and rarely "have the nuts". People do not like being taken advantage of or seeing new players taken advantage of by someone who is not forthright about their skill level and is only interested in deception to make a score. I don't think anyone has an issue with gambling, per se.
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Would you expect people to play poker "only if no bluffing allowed?" Isn't that what bluffing is, misrepresenting your strength. It is also a very important and exciting part of poker. If you looked at pool with those same expectations, that someone might be trying to "bluff" you, then everything is fair, no?
 
jokrswylde said:
Would you expect people to play poker "only if no bluffing allowed?" Isn't that what bluffing is, misrepresenting your strength. It is also a very important and exciting part of poker. If you looked at pool with those same expectations, that someone might be trying to "bluff" you, then everything is fair, no?
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I'm not a poker player but feel there are too many variables involved in the game and neither player knows what the other is holding.

In pool, a hustler can observe a player without the other player knowing it so they can, more than likely, gauge said player's speed so the mark has already "shown his hand" so to speak with the hustler holding his cards (speed of play) close to the vest.
 
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