Call foul or not?

[Monstermash]

So while playing in my league match last night, there was a foul committed but the opposing team. The foul was just a simple case of a member of the other team coaching during their player's inning. My opponent was about to shoot at the 10 ball and one of his teammates suggested he look to see if the 14 would go by another ball and into the side pocket. My opponent checked, saw that it would go and proceeded to shoot the 14 and then the 10 and then the 8 to win the match as we were both on the hill. Had he shot the 10 first it was doubtful he would have had a leave on the 14.

My question is, is this "one of those rules" where it's not that big of deal or do you call the foul for coaching without a time out? The kicker is that the league director had left for the night so we were left to figure it out on our own. I've always been of the opinion that if there is a foul committed, you should call it otherwise you have to start picking and choosing which foul is ok to call. I think if it's a rule, it should be enforced. What do you guys think?

 

[Winston846]

So while playing in my league match last night, there was a foul committed but the opposing team. The foul was just a simple case of a member of the other team coaching during their player's inning. My opponent was about to shoot at the 10 ball and one of his teammates suggested he look to see if the 14 would go by another ball and into the side pocket. My opponent checked, saw that it would go and proceeded to shoot the 14 and then the 10 and then the 8 to win the match as we were both on the hill. Had he shot the 10 first it was doubtful he would have had a leave on the 14.

My question is, is this "one of those rules" where it's not that big of deal or do you call the foul for coaching without a time out? The kicker is that the league director had left for the night so we were left to figure it out on our own. I've always been of the opinion that if there is a foul committed, you should call it otherwise you have to start picking and choosing which foul is ok to call. I think if it's a rule, it should be enforced. What do you guys think?

Depends on the league and what the rule is. I know in APA, there is no coaching unless you call a timeout, and in BCA there is no coaching. But in the independent, unsanctioned, unhandicapped league I play in, you can say whatever you want.

But if your league rules dictate that in-match coaching is a foul, then it should have been called.

 

[Maniac]

So while playing in my league match last night, there was a foul committed but the opposing team. The foul was just a simple case of a member of the other team coaching during their player's inning. My opponent was about to shoot at the 10 ball and one of his teammates suggested he look to see if the 14 would go by another ball and into the side pocket. My opponent checked, saw that it would go and proceeded to shoot the 14 and then the 10 and then the 8 to win the match as we were both on the hill. Had he shot the 10 first it was doubtful he would have had a leave on the 14.

My question is, is this "one of those rules" where it's not that big of deal or do you call the foul for coaching without a time out? The kicker is that the league director had left for the night so we were left to figure it out on our own. I've always been of the opinion that if there is a foul committed, you should call it otherwise you have to start picking and choosing which foul is ok to call. I think if it's a rule, it should be enforced. What do you guys think?

You didn't mention what league it was. 1.) If it was one where there are no timeouts/coaching allowed, then it was most definitely a foul and should have been called. 2.) If it was APA and the opposing player still had a timeout left for that game, then I would have charged him with it right then and there. 3.) If it was APA and he had already used his timeout, then all you can do is call "bad sportsmanship" on his team. There is no provision I have ever found in the APA rulebook for actually calling a foul for excessive timeouts (at least no in regular league play). Have you since found out what recourse you had according to your league rules/rulebook???

It may or may not have been a foul. Possibly not even bad sportsmanship if #2 above applies.

Maniac

 

[Monstermash]

I can only speak for the APA League. If this is the league you play in then the only thing you can do is mark a time out down on the score sheet. If they have already used up there time outs then its a sportsman violation which has no effect on the game. It only shows the league operators what kind of players he/she has in their league.

But yes I feel about it just like you rules are there to be enforced if its a foul call it.

Thanks for the response Billy. I should have clarified, this is an "in house" money league. Additionally, my opponents handicap is a 6 so he's only allowed one timeout per game and he then took his timeout on the very next shot on the 10 ball as he needed help to figure out how to get on the 8.

 

[Maniac]

Thanks for the response Billy. I should have clarified, this is an "in house" money league. Additionally, my opponents handicap is a 6 so he's only allowed one timeout per game and he then took his timeout on the very next shot on the 10 ball as he needed help to figure out how to get on the 8.

Knowing this, he should have been charged with his one timeout when he received his sideline coaching on the first shot. He then would not have had the timeout he used when shooting the 10-ball. You should have voiced this when he received his initial help so he would not have gotten virtually 2 timeouts in that game. So, it's kinda your/your Captains fault for not addressing this when the help was first given to your opponent.

Maniac

Maniac

 

[BrokeStroke]

If roles were reversed, would the other team call a foul on your team?

Im inclined to weigh that option alot of the time, considering the leagues that I belong to dont mean anything (to me and my team, we are just in them to get some competitive practice). Not to mention the fact that most of the time, you will get a couple guys talking about shooting in such bad patterns that it only helps their opponent when they get/give advice on shots.

If you (and your team) take your league play seriously, then the rules should be enforced as they are written. A foul is a foul.

 

[TX Poolnut]

I tend to let things like this slide. League pool is suppose to be fun.

However, I think you would have been well within your rights to call the foul if it broke the rules.

What would have happened if your League Operator was there?

 

[JolietJames]

I almost had this smae problem recently. I was playing and my drunk apa 3 teamate kept talking from the rail about which ball I should shoot next. This guy has no idea how to play pool and I don't even hear the guy anymore because I try to tune him out. I was warned once by my opponent because he could hear the guy yapping. Not once did I shoot the ball he suggested because his patterns are terrible but I told my opponent to feel free to call the foul next time he did it. After that rack I had a talk with my 3 and managed to get him to keep his trap shut for the rest of the match. I appreciated the way my opponent handled it. He let it slide for a while and then felt enough was enough. I would have done the same for him. I'm grateful he took the high road. Granted, none of the "advice" I was getting from the egg helped me win a game so it's not quite the same thing.

 

[justadub]

In our APA league, depending on the people we were playing and how they are usually about things (do they do this stuff often, was it just an innocent slip up) I would probably pull the other captain adise and tell him that I could have counted that for his timeout, but I wnat to keep things light. Just a heads up kind of thing.

Then there are other teams in our league that wouldn't hesititate to call it on us, so they'd receive equal treatment from me.

 

[TX Poolnut]

In our APA league, depending on the people we were playing and how they are usually about things (do they do this stuff often, was it just an innocent slip up) I would probably pull the other captain adise and tell him that I could have counted that for his timeout, but I wnat to keep things light. Just a heads up kind of thing.

Then there are other teams in our league that wouldn't hesititate to call it on us, so they'd receive equal treatment from me.

sounds reasonable. good post

 

[Monstermash]

I tend to let things like this slide. League pool is suppose to be fun.

However, I think you would have been well within your rights to call the foul if it broke the rules.

What would have happened if your League Operator was there?

If the LO was there I would have stopped play and asked him to enforce the rule. Unfortunately he isn't always there and leaves it up to us to enforce the rules which is why this upset me so much.
As another had suggested, I did mention this to the other teams captain (who was the one who offered the advice) and he got pretty pissed. I ended up letting it go until he called the timeout on the next shot and then I called the foul because it is a foul to call a timeout if you do not have any left.

 

[master9baller]

Thanks for the response Billy. I should have clarified, this is an "in house" money league. Additionally, my opponents handicap is a 6 so he's only allowed one timeout per game and he then took his timeout on the very next shot on the 10 ball as he needed help to figure out how to get on the 8.

You mean to say the player can stop shooting, and ask for specific instructions on how to get postion on the next shot? So why handicap anybody of they can just ask for advice from better players?

If you call fould and there's no referee can't they just deny it? Then the "call" goes to the shooter anyway right?

That sounds like no fun at all. I'd say, drop the league, get a bankroll and challenge these guys to some $100 sets. Oh and let them ask for advice whenever they feel the need to. But that's just me.