Calling all pro speed players

What I don't understand about this whole discussion: everyone has the right to waste their money, don't they? Some waste it on cars, some on shady women, some on expensive clothing and whatever. So why would they not be allowed to waste THEIR money on an apparently mismatched pool game?

How would this hurt pool? Who would care? I just remember Dippy Dave. The stiffing part was bad for pool but would him wasting money to play the "Greats" have hurt pool in any way? Who would even watch games like that apart from people who are into money games and pool anyway?

And no, I am not a money player. I played some many moons ago for small amounts. Today I don't think it is worth my time to play for more than a beer or table time. But I don't mind if others feel differently about it. Or if they consider a "lesson" by Efren or some other pro worth the money to play them. Who would have a business judging that?

On the plus side this may be entertainment for all who can watch it for free. It may also be a boring game where someone gets slaughtered. So what. My computer has an "off" button.

But the Fargo-Rate Fuhrer has given a Fuhrer order. The dude sounds like a knit to me.
 
If I wanted to play any pro for a couple stacks I definitely wouldn’t need the interwebs to set it up.
Just show up to an event your player frequents or call the houseman in their area. If you were older and unknown there should be no shortage of people to call your action. So to come here to stir it up is odd, but ok.

Guy wants to test his game and put up his money.
This is pool.

Not good for pool or bad for pool.
This is pool.

I think that you got this right. The guy wants attention and probably not a game.

If this match happens, it's not necessarily good or bad for pool.

If it does happen and it is streamed for free, I probably will watch it. But not because I think I'm going to see a good match.




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I think any match driven by a low-rated man challenging a high-rated woman because he thinks he has a gender-driven edge or because he doubts the women’s ratings is good for the male pool community to re-examine their biases and female pool community to feel inspired when that man loses.


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I think any match driven by a low-rated man challenging a high-rated woman because he thinks he has a gender-driven edge or because he doubts the women’s ratings is good for the male pool community to re-examine their biases and female pool community to feel inspired when that man loses.


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With the caveat that Siming Chen is a product of the communist party and is no “ free range “ player.

So maybe you should check the bias talk. Will she undergo a drug test?
 
With the caveat that Siming Chen is a product of the communist party and is no “ free range “ player.

So maybe you should check the bias talk. Will she undergo a drug test?

Not to mention that this is also a very rare case...she is certainly the exception.

Anyone denying that men and women are generally genetically wired differently
each with different strengths, weaknesses, and inherent predispositions, is purely delusional.
 
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Not to mention that this is also a very rare case...



Anyone denying that men and women are generally genetically wired differently

each with different strengths, weaknesses, and inherent predispositions, is purely delusional.


Of course. There’s a lot of reasons for disparity between men and women. On the average men take more interest in pool than women and produce significantly more top level players.

But when a top level woman does emerge for whatever reason, like Siming, the people denying she is top level or thinking an average man can beat her is even more delusional. And that’s what matches like this demonstrate. And I’d like more matches like this to prove it out for the doubters.


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When I first started traveling to mainland China in the mid-1980's, I was very surprised by the extreme lack of any gender bias in all aspects of their Chinese work culture. It was so different from the USA. I'm wondering why Chen SiMing even considers playing only in womens' tournaments. That approach is completely foreign to their culture.
 
Thanks for your measured response and I hear you loud and clear! Boogey did go public with his request to make a money game with Siming and he did it anonymously. Those two things alone are ripe for criticism and he definitely got his share on here. I guess I was looking at it from a more pragmatic point of view. I couldn't see the harm in letting Siming get a nice payday from an obviously weaker player who wants to gamble with her.

FYI, well known players like Nick Varner and yes, even Efren Reyes, paid their expenses by making games with local players just to give them a chance to get in the box with a top name player. They would hand out spots like candy, while betting anywhere from $50-200 a game in One Pocket. It was considered a smart move back then, but today in the age of the internet they would probably get criticized for it. I'm sure Nick and Efren didn't consider it a waste of time.
Other than DO the rest of Roy's crew jump in the box for basically the same amount , , I started the thread it hopes of seeing others take a crack at her and Donny on a Fargo thread mentioned he'd match up any day with her ,

I really didn't see 7400 views and 240 and counting comments when I started it that in its self is a good thing and should aide in getting more viewers as the last match flew under the radar ,,


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If you had been paying attention to my posts over the course of the last few years, you would know that I'm all in favor of Pool tournaments that feature the top men competing on equal terms with the top women. THAT might really make a difference in the furtherance of Pool as a professional sport! It would create a buzz in the sports world, unlike anything in any other sport. The publicity value alone would be huge! Put some of that on TV and see what happens!

Yes, I know Jay. You are one of the good guys in a lot of ways.

There have already been many notable single matches between men and women, where the woman has come out on top. The most recent money game between Siming and Donny was just one more, and perhaps not as noteworthy as Karen Corr's demolition of Ko Pin Yi in the U.S. Open a couple of years back.

I agree except for the "just one more" part. No doubt many examples of a woman beating a top male player in a tournament. The Karen-Ko Pin Yi match was amazing. And the fact Karen went to the hill 10-11 later in the same tournament against Jayson Shaw made it that much more amazing.

And then there is Karen beating both Donny Mills and Earl Strickland less than a year later at Turning Stone.

So now Donny has lost to Chezka, to Karen, and to Siming ;-)

And Siming beat Daryl Peach recently in Austria. And Allison once beat Oscar 9-4. And Melissa Herndon beat Brian Parks 8-3. And Vivian beat Max Eberle and Hunter Lombardo. And Monica Webb beat Stevie Moore. And the list goes on.

But what makes the recent Siming/Donny match different is it is not just something we noticed after the fact. In all these other cases, the response to noting the match would be.. yeah, sure, that can happen in a tournament match now and again. But if we switch to 10-ball, lengthen the race, put some serious cash on it, etc, she has no chance...

This time, the female responded to the kind of stuff with a quiet, confident, ....yeah, OK. And we were paying attention before the match started; it isn't something that came about by a random draw and that we noticed after it happened.

Whether Siming played a previously unknown player without a Fargo Rating is insignificant in the overall scheme of things, regardless of how you personally feel about it. Somehow I suspect his lack of a Fargo Rating is underneath some of your contempt for this match.

I don't agree. If some male with a well established but modest Fargo Rating--let's say John Barton for instance-- wanted to match up with Siming on this trip, I wouldn't like that. I think it is way more interesting to find horses for whom many people around them find it inconceivable they would lose a serious, i.e., long enough, match to a woman.

If Siming lived in the US, and the John Barton match or this guy's match was just like a reality show episode that could happen in addition to the other things, then fine. But here there is only so much oxygen.

If you are sincere and really want to make a difference in professional Pool, then why don't you put some money into producing a tournament like I just described above. I will match whatever money you put into it! How about a 64 player Invitational event with $50,000 added. I got 25K to help produce that event. How about you? We could hold it at the greatest pool room in America. I think you know the one I'm talking about.

The ball is in your court.

That's a generous offer. And I know you have committed resources in the past to make things like DCC Bigfoot and other events happen. I will contact you offline.
 
When I first started traveling to mainland China in the mid-1980's, I was very surprised by the extreme lack of any gender bias in all aspects of their Chinese work culture. It was so different from the USA. I'm wondering why Chen SiMing even considers playing only in womens' tournaments. That approach is completely foreign to their culture.

What you are describing is communism.
 
Of course. There’s a lot of reasons for disparity between men and women. On the average men take more interest in pool than women and produce significantly more top level players.

But when a top level woman does emerge for whatever reason, like Siming, the people denying she is top level or thinking an average man can beat her is even more delusional. And that’s what matches like this demonstrate. And I’d like more matches like this to prove it out for the doubters.


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Again if she passes a lab test that confirms there is no monkey business going on. If memory serves there was a link on this forum about six months ago, that took me to the, I believe to the semi-finals, of the Women's Amateur National Championship and there was a transsexual playing a women in that match.
 
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Who is bogey man? He wants to play siming a long race even? Longer the race the more he is taking the worst of it.
 
He may “knit” very strong. The odds are we will probably never know for sure though.

Dude its all just slang as the definition for " nit " concerns head lice. Do you have any confirmation that your opponent in the recent match is not on steroids?
 
Is there a big line? Like at the barber shop?

Maybe he is willing to take a number and wait his turn.

Why don't you find out her lineup and then tell us when his "turn" is?

My interest is nothing more than seeing an average person play her. Nothing more, nothing less.

When I played pool decades ago, I thought I could beat any woman and had no problem saying it. I never played any female pros because hardly any existed way back then and I never ran across any of them anywhere I was at. If a woman ever were to have came up to me back then and wanted to gamble, they could have had all my money.

I've watched all the women pros and I think there are probably lots of non-pro men who can beat them. That's not to say everybody can. I'm just saying that they are way easier to beat than a top man pro.

If we were to go back 35 or so years ago, I'd have been willing to give any female pro a challenge bet and give them 2 to 1 odds on their money. I wouldn't give this challenge to a good man player. We play a race to 100. We play the race in one session...start to finish. No breaks except bathroom breaks. No eating. You drink a beer every time I drink a beer. You finish your beer within 15 minutes of me finishing mine and start another one when I decide to start one.

First one to 100 wins or first one to fall out loses.

I've never played a race like that with a woman, but I've played for several days without stopping when gambling with men.

How about Jean?
Jason
 
Dude its all just slang as the definition for " nit " concerns head lice. Do you have any confirmation that your opponent in the recent match is not on steroids?


Who
Do you think is on steroids? I’m oblivious to certain things.
 
Yes, I know Jay. You are one of the good guys in a lot of ways.



I agree except for the "just one more" part. No doubt many examples of a woman beating a top male player in a tournament. The Karen-Ko Pin Yi match was amazing. And the fact Karen went to the hill 10-11 later in the same tournament against Jayson Shaw made it that much more amazing.

And then there is Karen beating both Donny Mills and Earl Strickland less than a year later at Turning Stone.

So now Donny has lost to Chezka, to Karen, and to Siming ;-)

And Siming beat Daryl Peach recently in Austria. And Allison once beat Oscar 9-4. And Melissa Herndon beat Brian Parks 8-3. And Vivian beat Max Eberle and Hunter Lombardo. And Monica Webb beat Stevie Moore. And the list goes on.

But what makes the recent Siming/Donny match different is it is not just something we noticed after the fact. In all these other cases, the response to noting the match would be.. yeah, sure, that can happen in a tournament match now and again. But if we switch to 10-ball, lengthen the race, put some serious cash on it, etc, she has no chance...

This time, the female responded to the kind of stuff with a quiet, confident, ....yeah, OK. And we were paying attention before the match started; it isn't something that came about by a random draw and that we noticed after it happened.



I don't agree. If some male with a well established but modest Fargo Rating--let's say John Barton for instance-- wanted to match up with Siming on this trip, I wouldn't like that. I think it is way more interesting to find horses for whom many people around them find it inconceivable they would lose a serious, i.e., long enough, match to a woman.

If Siming lived in the US, and the John Barton match or this guy's match was just like a reality show episode that could happen in addition to the other things, then fine. But here there is only so much oxygen.



That's a generous offer. And I know you have committed resources in the past to make things like DCC Bigfoot and other events happen. I will contact you offline.

Mike, if this little match comes off, you will see that Boogey is in fact an interesting character, kind of like when Andy Kaufmann wrestled some girls. Maybe not that silly, but it should be a fun and entertaining match to watch. He plays just good enough to make it competitive and win some games (better than Rogan anyway). She better not take him too lightly, because I doubt he will get nervous.
 
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