Can old dogs learn new tricks?

CaptainJR

CaptainJR

Shiver me timbers.
Silver Member
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
 
CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
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I just turned 53 and can comment on this...

First off, Capt JR, you posted this at 6:59 am. Real pool players don't even know that hour--except when it is the LAST part of the "day." Your getting up this early means you weren't out playing your heart out until closing time, right? :rolleyes:

And, besides the getting up early thingy, you have other hobbies, like your piano playing. And I bet you're committed to some family things, and you have a job, etc. These all interfere with getting better.

All that aside, I'd say ANYONE can get better at any age. The problem is the NET increase in better. While I'm getting better at strategy, for example, my physical limitations are growing: bad back, eyes, muscle twitches, etc. Now add boredom, lack of desire, been-there-done-that paradigm, other thoughts, etc. and getting better requires much more work than when younger. But, to me, that is the fun in pool: overcoming NEW problems as they arise. This makes the game infinite to me, something I like.

My best days are ahead of me.

Jeff Livingston
 
CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen.
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Yes, it's called rigor mortis. :eek:

Tracy
 
An very experienced Pool Player once said to me ...

"When ever you stop learning, you stop gettin`a master in Pool Billard"

So you can grow with every age ;)
 
After you have played seriously five years

After you have seriously devoted yourself to the game for five years you should be very near your peak using the approach you have been taking. On the other hand there is no age limit on when you can learn something new or approach the game from a different angle and make a major improvement.

This old dog is learning new tricks and I have had other old dogs demonstrate to me just what is possible so I am sure I will achieve my personal goals. You quit learning and peak when you choose to.

Hu



CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
Click to expand...
 
chefjeff said:
I just turned 53 and can comment on this...

First off, Capt JR, you posted this at 6:59 am. Real pool players don't even know that hour--except when it is the LAST part of the "day." Your getting up this early means you weren't out playing your heart out until closing time, right? :rolleyes:

And, besides the getting up early thingy, you have other hobbies, like your piano playing. And I bet you're committed to some family things, and you have a job, etc. These all interfere with getting better.

All that aside, I'd say ANYONE can get better at any age. The problem is the NET increase in better. While I'm getting better at strategy, for example, my physical limitations are growing: bad back, eyes, muscle twitches, etc. Now add boredom, lack of desire, been-there-done-that paradigm, other thoughts, etc. and getting better requires much more work than when younger. But, to me, that is the fun in pool: overcoming NEW problems as they arise. This makes the game infinite to me, something I like.

My best days are ahead of me.

Jeff Livingston
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TAP TAP TAP.
 
Move into a gated community with pool tables. You will think you are getting better because everyone else is so bad.

The law of diminishing returns comes into fact after age 29.

If you don't make it by then then you will have to come up with a new idea. Sorta like what Mike did. LOL

Jake
 
What fun would the game be if you had no hope of improving? It's a question of desire, determination, and a willingness to put forth the effort to improve. None of those are limited by age.
The day I stop improving, all of my friends will be gathered around to throw flowers at me and say nice things about me...'cause they will be burying me.
Steve
 
I took lessons with a guy who learned the game at age 50 (or thereabouts) and went on to become an A player in something like 5 years or so. Of course, he dropped his job, women, children, etc. and spent his entire day rubbing shoulders with the likes of Jimmy Fusco up in the poolroom in Philadelphia. And then he went on the road.

His eyes are no good, but he still plays at A level.
 
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CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
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I know that some people continue to improve their game into their late 50's. Don't know anyone who continues to improve in their 60's but don't doubt that this too is possible.

But to improve your game, to the level I think you are referring to requires that you have an unquenchenable thirst for improvement regardless of your age. As people age, this UT diminishes in most people and they are happy to coast on into their silver years relying on memories of the past to satisfy most of their needs. Most are not willing to pay the price for improvement and yes it is harder for you to learn as you age and harder to hold on to what you already know. Just ask the old geezers in the pool hall and they will tell ya. :-)
JoeyA
 
CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
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Great Question IMO if you are Physically Fit, Mentally Stable, and Have the Time to Work on your Game it will get better. Hard Part is Breaking BAD HABITS...;) IMO
 
JoeyA said:
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I know that some people continue to improve their game into their late 50's. Don't know anyone who continues to improve in their 60's but don't doubt that this too is possible.

But to improve your game, to the level I think you are referring to requires that you have an unquenchenable thirst for improvement regardless of your age. As people age, this UT diminishes in most people and they are happy to coast on into their silver years relying on memories of the past to satisfy most of their needs. Most are not willing to pay the price for improvement and yes it is harder for you to learn as you age and harder to hold on to what you already know. Just ask the old geezers in the pool hall and they will tell ya. :-)
JoeyA
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Joey,
I like your ideas, I've only been playing seriously for 4 years, but have made good progress - only through desire and self discipline. I will say, though, that I have found that learning is no harder at this age (53) than when younger - the physical parts may be a little harder, but the mental parts are easier to develop after a lifetime of sports.
 
jjinfla said:
The law of diminishing returns comes into fact after age 29.
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Speaking only for yourself, eh Jake ? How long you been diminishing now ?

I am fn 48 and started trying to get better at pool at about 38. I improve every year, based on my competitive record against better players. My stroke gets better, I know more shots, and am getting better at playing 9 Ball and 8 Ball. I simply continue to work on my stroke and control, learn more shots, and learn more about how to play 8 and 9 ball in various situations. I also find the better I get the more fun I have at the table. I see no reason why this would change over the next 10 years. Life is GREAT !

Dave

PS Women are always looking for the fountain of youth, some of us men know the secret to never-ending youth is immaturity :p :p :D :p :p
 
Capt. JR, I know who you are just as you know me. We have played each other at Finley's, the Hanover Eagles, and the Yankee Club in tournaments together. You play a fine game as it is, and I think having the hunger to get better makes a difference at any age. I'm only 36 but after 20 years of competetive play I feel the need to kick start my motivation sometimes. I have resently gotten contacts for when I shoot to improve my vision and ware a glove if my had sweats too much. The biggest difference for me has been going the the gym and getting into a regular workout routine. I am in much better physical shape and that helps with my endurance and maintaining my fundamentals during long periods of play. I have also found that working out seems to make me think more clearly and feel younger. I physically feel like I did when I first started playing. I have had more energy and motivation, and find my game continueing to improve. These are just a few ideas to try to make playing the game more enjoyable and hopefully for a long time to come.
Hope this helps, R. Wise
 
CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
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Age makes no difference unless there are special physical limitations that would keep you from improving REGARDLESS of age. I had a student that, at age 70, had a stroke. He had a lot of physical problems on his right side after the stroke... mild paralysis, mostly, but still functional. At age 72 he came to me for lessons. He played so bad he couldn't even get on a pool league. 6 months after his three day session, he had secured a spot on league team and was their #2 shooter. A year after that, he was competing for top shooter in the league, which was mostly made up of players in the 25 to 45 year old range. He had another stroke last year, and I can't tell you where he is now, but his age, and even in his case, his physical condition had NOTHING to do with his ability to improve his game.

I guess there is an age limit. When a player has a birthday and decides to close his mind to new ideas, concepts and options, then he's too old to improve his game... I've seen it happen at 18!

Later,
Bob
 
Williebetmore said:
Joey,
I like your ideas, I've only been playing seriously for 4 years, but have made good progress - only through desire and self discipline. I will say, though, that I have found that learning is no harder at this age (53) than when younger - the physical parts may be a little harder, but the mental parts are easier to develop after a lifetime of sports.
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Williebetmore:
MOST old guys like yourself have trouble remembering where they were yesterday let alone remembering how to shoot a particular shot that comes up once every blue moon. You obviously are an exception or you could just be one of those latent natural talents, just coming into his own.

Anyways, glad you still have it in you, old boy. Keep taking the Centrum Silver. Older friends tell me it is quite the ride, luckily, that ride is a long time off for me.
JoeyA
 
JoeyA said:
Williebetmore:
MOST old guys like yourself have trouble remembering where they were yesterday let alone remembering how to shoot a particular shot that comes up once every blue moon. You obviously are an exception... JoeyA
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JoeyA,
Yes, I'm surely an exception; why just yesterday I was at....err, I mean I went to the......I think I was at the.......I'm sure I went to the.....oh well, nevermind. Old people can't play pool.
 
At 53, I would whip my 25 year old self's ass all over the pool room, on or off the table. Except maybe not in the sack, that's about it.

Chris
 
CaptainJR said:
What is the approximate age where thinking you can really improve your game is a pipe dream? Excluding the vision issue. For this thread lets assume that this old dog has good eyes. Is there a point where trying to get better at the game is probably not going to happen. Let's also talk about say a B player. Of course a D player can probably improve to a C player at any age. But is there a time when a B player can figure that is as good as it is going to get?
Click to expand...

OK, I will be serious. Age alone has very little to do with it as long as a player is physically sound.

Regardless of age, I think a player will improve as long as their aptitude, physical ability to play, and mental capacity to compete (take the heat) allows it, providing the player is willing to compete regularly and practice consistently.

I've noticed that if someone is stuck at B level for years, and they've put in the practice and the competition, the chances are they have just reached their level of competence. They've maxed out and simply aren't going to get a lot better. I'm 53 and I play much better now than I did 20 years ago, but it's mostly due to hard practice over the last 3 - 4 years that I wasn't willing to put in at age 25.

What often is lost as age advances is the desire to put in long hours practicing and competing - we wonder "is it really worth it?".

Chris
 
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