Careful Criticizing CSI Org

These are the pockets those tables are equipped with. I’d say they were probably a touch over the 4.5” at the mouth like the picture shows as two balls would easily fit through.

The pocket opening plus the pocket angle plus the very short shelf all added up to making the table play too easy in my opinion. Especially for something you’re describing as a national championship
 

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Scrunge19 said:
These are the pockets those tables are equipped with. I’d say they were probably a touch over the 4.5” at the mouth like the picture shows as two balls would easily fit through.

The pocket opening plus the pocket angle plus the very short shelf all added up to making the table play too easy in my opinion. Especially for something you’re describing as a national championship
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I've never seen a pocket like this outside of a Valley, where the facing angle opens up instead of funnels down. It does make sense for coin operated tables and lower skill levels. I'm a 570, and I wouldn't mind easy equipment like this at all. Its good for the ego:)
 
Scrunge19 said:
These are the pockets those tables are equipped with. I’d say they were probably a touch over the 4.5” at the mouth like the picture shows as two balls would easily fit through.

The pocket opening plus the pocket angle plus the very short shelf all added up to making the table play too easy in my opinion. Especially for something you’re describing as a national championship
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Its a 'league championship', these aren't pros and most league play is on buckets.
 
iusedtoberich said:
I still don't get why people criticize 5" pockets. Hardly anyone on a league level is good enough to run out on them on a consistent basis. Plus, Predator pockets are not cut like Valley (obtuse angle) with a non-existent slate shelf. They are cut more like a Gold Crown 5" factory pocket.

If everyone and there mother was running out the set from the lag, yes, too easy. But that's not the case anywhere on the planet.
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These tables typically get distributed to pool halls after the event. This means that there is going to be a flood of hundreds of bucket pocket bar tables hitting the private market shortly, which isn’t the best for improving the ability of the average shooter.
 
Crasher said:
These tables typically get distributed to pool halls after the event. This means that there is going to be a flood of hundreds of bucket pocket bar tables hitting the private market shortly, which isn’t the best for improving the ability of the average shooter.
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It makes zero difference. A player will improve the same on a bucket table or a tight table. I'd even venture to say they might improve faster on a bucket table because they can be more aggressive with shotmaking and position.
 
iusedtoberich said:
It makes zero difference. A player will improve the same on a bucket table or a tight table. I'd even venture to say they might improve faster on a bucket table because they can be more aggressive with shotmaking and position.
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I can’t understand the logic, here. How would a table that demands tighter position play and less margin for error actually make a player worse than a table with pockets that will accept any shot? Think about the two extremes, would it be harder for a pitcher to hit a milk jug or a minivan from 25 feet? Would it benefit the pitcher to train for a milk jug hitting competition by throwing at a minivan, or training for a minivan hitting competition by throwing at the milk jug?
 
Crasher said:
These tables typically get distributed to pool halls after the event. This means that there is going to be a flood of hundreds of bucket pocket bar tables hitting the private market shortly, which isn’t the best for improving the ability of the average shooter.
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The smart leaguer polishes his technicals.
 
Crasher said:
I can’t understand the logic, here. How would a table that demands tighter position play and less margin for error actually make a player worse than a table with pockets that will accept any shot? Think about the two extremes, would it be harder for a pitcher to hit a milk jug or a minivan from 25 feet? Would it benefit the pitcher to train for a milk jug hitting competition by throwing at a minivan, or training for a minivan hitting competition by throwing at the milk jug?
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Meanwhile, in the real world, casual players will have more fun and continue to play and improve their skills instead of quitting the game out of frustration since they can’t make a ball.

A 4.75 inch corner pocket is not a “milk jug” that will degrade the skills of an APA 3. When most of the posters here were learning how to play that would have been considered a tight pocket.
 
The pocket size discussion reminds me of McCorrie's on the Slough in Woodinville. The table mechanic sold them on the idea of larger pockets to get quarters faster. 🤷‍♂️ Their Friday night meat shoot always got a good turn out. They wanted to discourage "money" players. 🤷‍♂️ And vegetarians 😉. The bar table pockets were huge, I recall a player that was complaining about the huge pockets grabbing 3 balls in his hand and slamming all 3 at once into a pocket. I got 3rd place one night and never missed a ball. Break and runs by mid range players were common. Heck I worked real close and after work played 9 ball in there. The swings could be huge. Heck I could be down 10 games before I finished my first beer. After work it took 3 beers to get my muscles relaxed as I did lots of weight lifting as part of my job. 🤷‍♂️
 
CocoboloCowboy said:
Tried League one night, never experience so must disorganization by Business League Owner, I said NEVER AGAIN.
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I played in the early 80's and got tired of the petty bs. Gave it another shot in early 2000's and found out nothing had changed. No more. If you play league you have to know going in that the people that run them like being a dictator, they get off on the illusion of power. Fk 'em.
 
garczar said:
I played in the early 80's and got tired of the petty bs. Gave it another shot in early 2000's and found out nothing had changed. No more. If you play league you have to know going in that the people that run them like being a dictator, they get off on the illusion of power. Fk 'em.
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Plus make good money in many cases.
 
Crasher said:
I can’t understand the logic, here. How would a table that demands tighter position play and less margin for error actually make a player worse than a table with pockets that will accept any shot? Think about the two extremes, would it be harder for a pitcher to hit a milk jug or a minivan from 25 feet? Would it benefit the pitcher to train for a milk jug hitting competition by throwing at a minivan, or training for a minivan hitting competition by throwing at the milk jug?
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perfect example here. yes training to hit the milk jug will make him more accurate if he sticks to it for a long enough time thru the frustrations.

but if you also have to hit the milk jug and get the ball to go off it in a certain direction after the hit and control the speed. like in pool.
most will give up soon.

maybe learning and playing to hit the minivan for a long enough time to be able to do both things well first is a better method of training..

on a 5 inch pocket it is a bucket to a very good player. but to a newer one it is a lifesaver.

plus as he gets better he learns how to cheat the pocket to get position and the idea of just making the shot isn't the whole package.
 
I did not go to Vegas but many people complaining about the"buckets". I also was curious why they used 7ft tables instead of 9. I was told most letters are played on 7s.
 
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