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APA Gene said:
Most of the time I quietly follow the forums because I love pool and like to hear the stories from all over. This time I just have to speak up. The reason the APA is not going to change the rules to call pocket (IMHO) is it gives the advantage to the higher skill player. This takes away from in some respect the possibility that "everyone can play, anyone can win."

I am not a great player by any means but I play decent yet in my 12 years in the APA I can not ever recall losing a match because someone slopped a ball in. Especially 8-ball. Now in 9-ball a player can slop a ball in and go on to run the rack but hey that's 9-ball, right? I have had the same thing happen playing 9-ball pro tournaments where a player (myself included) have slopped a ball in and continued to run out the rack. Sometimes that can be a big momentum shifter and change the eventual outcome of the race.

Truth is APA league play (or any league play) is not intended to determine who is the best player since the races are to short to determine that. League play is meant to be a fun social setting where we can compete against players of various skill levels and help bring new people into our sport. If we as the better players are constantly complaining about the rules not being in our favor we will never see our sport grow to the masses the way it should. We can't always have the nutz. Just accept it and do your best. On the other hand if you are gambling and you make a bad game that is your own problem, right?:wink:
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I totally understand the business of the APA.... I was only commenting on the part about the rules were set by well-traveled professional players choosing luck over skill...There is no way a professional would ever choose luck over skill....
As far as slopping balls in playing 8-ball in your 12 years of play never happening....I would like for you to give me 6 numbers from 1-45 and a powerball number from 1-45....=)
 
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APA Gene said:
Most of the time I quietly follow the forums because I love pool and like to hear the stories from all over. This time I just have to speak up. The reason the APA is not going to change the rules to call pocket (IMHO) is it gives the advantage to the higher skill player. This takes away from in some respect the possibility that "everyone can play, anyone can win."

I am not a great player by any means but I play decent yet in my 12 years in the APA I can not ever recall losing a match because someone slopped a ball in. Especially 8-ball. Now in 9-ball a player can slop a ball in and go on to run the rack but hey that's 9-ball, right? I have had the same thing happen playing 9-ball pro tournaments where a player (myself included) have slopped a ball in and continued to run out the rack. Sometimes that can be a big momentum shifter and change the eventual outcome of the race.

Truth is APA league play (or any league play) is not intended to determine who is the best player since the races are to short to determine that. League play is meant to be a fun social setting where we can compete against players of various skill levels and help bring new people into our sport. If we as the better players are constantly complaining about the rules not being in our favor we will never see our sport grow to the masses the way it should. We can't always have the nutz. Just accept it and do your best. On the other hand if you are gambling and you make a bad game that is your own problem, right?:wink:
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I'm sorry, but in the few short years that I have been playing in the APA (which are about to end), I have been on both sides of slop. I have gotten lucky and made a ball that directly led me to winning a game and a match. As well as having it happen to me. I'm not saying it's not possible, but I do find it hard to believe that in 12 years of playing, you have not done it or had it happen to you, or even seen it happen to someone else. It happens ALL THE TIME!!

Do you agree that in time players with a positive attitude and outlook on the game eventually improve? Well you have players in league play, that aren't interested in improving their game. They love that slop counts. So they hit the ball as hard as possible and hope something goes in. To me that takes the skill and learning factor out of the game. I can easily learn from missing a shot if i shoot it normally, but if I blast a shot and it kisses off of 3 rails and 5 balls and goes in, what did I learn? (I know, if I hit this hard enough it might go in somehow) lol

Let's face it, anyone that plays any type of pool, whether it's APA, or pro 9-ball tournaments, has had slop come into play. Sometimes it's for and sometimes it's against. The least we can all do, is that when it happens in your favor, raise your hand as a gesture, to let the other player know that you got lucky. It's a way to say sorry, that most players take for granted. It's just good practice.

My friend tells me that I shouldn't do that because luck is just part of the game. I understand that, but nobody likes to lose a match because someone got lucky. I can't help but feel my opponents pain when I do it to them. All I can say is "Sorry friend, I got a bit of luck there" and hope that in some way he sees that I'm not a total "A-hole". Cause let's face it, that's what you call the person that gets lucky to beat you. You say, that "lucky A$$-hole"!
 
Ha Ha ! Slop 8-Ball

Slop 8-Ball is for beginners to begin with!

I play a MAN's Game of 8-Ball,.....

If you slop a ball on me in 8-Ball you Can't win, because your turn/inning at the table is over PERIOD!.....the slop ball is spotted, if I lose then, it's because I got out played!

Call pocket 8-Ball is the best way to go to keep the squabbles down between the average pool players.

If you start playing call shot 8-Ball, you better Not be an average pool player, better be a very Accomplished pool player or you'll soon find out that your Game is no where Near, where you thought it was!

9-Ball luck counts, that's the game, always was and always will...it makes the game so appealing!


David Harcrow
 
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tigerseye said:
I totally understand the business of the APA.... I was only commenting on the part about the rules were set by well-traveled professional players choosing luck over skill...There is no way a professional would ever choose luck over skill....
As far as slopping balls in playing 8-ball in your 12 years of play never happening....I would like for you to give me 6 numbers from 1-45 and a powerball number from 1-45....=)
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Tigerseye- I never said it didn't happen. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't. I just don't remember, honestly. I know one thing they had to make the 8 in the called/ marked pocket.

My most memorable moments in pool?
1) Losing hill-hill in Single Regionals when I lost a game because I didn't mark my pocket (and I was giving a game in the match! Ughhh!
2) Losing hill hill in the semi-finals at Singles Regionals when I should have played safe and tried to be the hero after my opponent jarred the 8-ball.
3) On the hill and missing the 6-ball on an easy out against a very good player at the US Amateur. (He was the clear favorite and I was up 6-4 at the time in a race to 7). I lost that rack. He broke and ran the next rack to knot it up and then won a long battle in the last rack with his superior safety and kicking game.


I don't remember too many times people getting lucky too beat me. Mostly I screwed up or they just out played me. That simple. Example-
I played a little race to one 8-ball tourney the other night. I was in the hotseat against a good skl7 whom I had beaten earlier. He gets ugly on the ball before the 8 and I run out to 2 balls before the 8. I jar the one trying to get to the 4 ball and he wins. Next rack he breaks and almost runs out. He ties up my balls and we get into a safety ball back and forth for 4 or so innings. I play safe again and nudge the balls a little too hard and he makes a nice shot and gets a leave on the 8 and wins. I remember how I misplayed that safe....can't forget it. Those are the things I remember about the loses I have had. Not people lucking in balls.

Maybe I have selective memory? :D
 
Sam Waltz said:
I never thought I'd say this....but these "well-traveled professional players" have got action!!! :grin-square:
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Those Pros would be Larry Hubbard and Terry Bell and I've been told they both played at a very high level back in the 70's. I wonder if any of our more in the know members could shed some light on how well these gentlemen played?

The responses may make you want to reconsider your action;)
 
Nope.

George,

I'd be happy to match up with 'em. I'm in Springfield, MO and they're more than welcome to join me for a game any night of the week. I'm not barkin' at anyone and I have definately heard of Mr. Hubbart's reputation, but I'm not going to run and hide if he or Mr. Bell shows up tomorrow to play some. Oh and thanks for your assumption that I'm not "in the know" as well. I might get some more action now!

As far as Larry and Terry are concerned pertaining to this thread though, I'd love to hear about some of those wonderful "slop counts" 8-ball tournaments they supposedly played back in the day! Any info on that from the "in the know" circle of knowledge?

Sorry about the attitude, but as my buddy says...nobody throws me my gun and tells me to run!

If your scared, go wait in the truck! :)

George, I hope you are takin' this with a grain of salt buddy, it's not an attack on you whatsoever so please don't take offense on a personal level. We can all have a good time here and still talk a little trash every once in a while.
 
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Tryin 2 slop

I used to coach the lower skilled players on a nine ball team to attempt to slop if they had no other shot. Just hit the object ball hard and stop the cue ball and see what the hell happens.. It was amazing how many times they would make a ball!!! Funny too BTW they would always laugh and shoot away. APA is just a fun night out and if you approach it that way it can be a good time. I agree with you Kenny, I'd rather see called shots and remove all slop in pool.
TTYL,
Dan
 
SpiderWebComm said:
Someone jump in and correct me at any time, but has there ever been a pro 8-ball event that wasn't call ball and pocket?????? WTF are they talking about? Start listing all the pro 8-ball events that are full-on slop....
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After reading the reply I am sure that there were more things that he complained or suggested changing.

Their response is a quote from the rule book. Its a foreword to how the rules are different than bar rules. ie Ball in Hand, rail after contact etc.

While the "any pocket rule" changes some games I think 85% are not effected. Probably higher % than that one.

I have always thought it was odd that so many objected to Any Pocket in 8ball yet very few want to play call pocket nine ball.
 
Sam Waltz said:
George,

I'd be happy to match up with 'em. I'm in Springfield, MO and they're more than welcome to join me for a game any night of the week. I'm not barkin' at anyone and I have definately heard of Mr. Hubbart's reputation, but I'm not going to run and hide if he or Mr. Bell shows up tomorrow to play some. Oh and thanks for your assumption that I'm not "in the know" as well. I might get some more action now!

Actually I made no assumptions at all.....I meant more "in the know" than me.:thumbup: The written word is tough sometimes:D

As far as Larry and Terry are concerned pertaining to this thread though, I'd love to hear about some of those wonderful "slop counts" 8-ball tournaments they supposedly played back in the day! Any info on that from the "in the know" circle of knowledge?

Sorry about the attitude, but as my buddy says...nobody throws me my gun and tells me to run!

If your scared, go wait in the truck! :)

George, I hope you are takin' this with a grain of salt buddy, it's not an attack on you whatsoever so please don't take offense on a personal level. We can all have a good time here and still talk a little trash every once in a while.
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No offense taken Sam,

Now go get your shine box :slap: :grin-devilish:
 
Can't believe you have never lost a game in APA 8-ball because shit/slopped a ball in, instead of the intended pocket. Keep playing and eventually you wish you had $100 for everytime it happens to you because you can get rich.

APA = Any Pocket Anywhere

APA is not geared for better players it's that simple. They want low level players, so the APA can run the rating's up in 1-2 yrs. split the teams up and in hopes of generating more teams = More $$$$$$ for the APA it's all about the money people.


If you enjoy playing in Pool League's IMO the best is................
 
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I really don't see what the big hang-up is with everybody and the APA. The first "A" stands for Amateur. That's what it is. It's designed to get people to get off their butts at home and out to play some pool. Nobody who plays in the APA is expecting to become a pro, but if they are, it does let them see some improvement. If they want to get really serious then they can move on to a more serious league. It got me out of the house and I have seen myself improve, I've got some great new friends and I even bought a table for my home. All the raggin' on this league gets tiresome. Why not compare high school baseball players to the pros? Jeez! What losers! You see what I'm saying?
 
Nice one!

George said:
No offense taken Sam,

Now go get your shine box :slap: :grin-devilish:
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Nice one indeed! ...now we can be friends again!

Both Larry and Terry made there mark in the pool world in a big way and they have my respect most certainly. I'd take it as very honorable if I ever got the chance to play either of them.

Didn't that dude who used that shine box line get shot right afterwards? Just jokin' George, I like your style allready sir! :)
 
Good point, Scott! Now don't I look like a shmuck for going off without thinking about it first. But....I think my argument stands. :grin:
 
Their mistake was referencing the term pro players.

If the league was based on what the pros wanted there would be 9 ft tables, tighter pockets, fast cloth, jump cues, no slop ( call ball and pocket ), and choice of ball group after a break, plus pushouts in 9 ball.

The only thing copied from the pros is the payout from the IPT. The advertised $1,000,000 that nobody gets.
 
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