Thanks Billyards and Perk,
Lovely graphics Billyards...lol
I'll take a closer look and make my specious judgement soon.
Colin
Lovely graphics Billyards...lol
I'll take a closer look and make my specious judgement soon.
Colin
CueTable Tournament - Who's in?
- Thread starter Colin Colenso
- Start date
Semi Final 2 Judgement
Semi Final 2
Perk v BillYards
Perk
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
No serious problem balls on stripes, though the 15, 11 and 10 could present problems.
The line you chose from the 10 to the 15 could be a little tricky, but you could run through to the rail for the 15 if you got an akward angle after playing the 13. If you finished too straight on the 15 to stun across for the 9 ball, you could run through for the 12 ball and probably manage a way out from there.
I might have played 14, 15, 10, 13, 9 to begin but I think your choice of order is pretty safe for a decent player. Not much to fault.
: 18 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Paths look ok but you went a bit close to the 5 ball playing 2 rails for the 8-ball. I might have gone one rail only: 9 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Pretty good except maybe the stun across table for the 9-ball, and I think spots would have afforded a simpler sequence of paths: 8 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Goo use of 13 to 10 to 15 and 9 to 11 ball to deal with potential problem balls: 9 points
Total: 44 Points.
BillYards
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
You chose spots and I think this pattern looks a bit easier that stripes. 4 seems the only ball that could be called a problem ball, but it is not that hard, so no need to rush to deal with it.
I like the way you moved around the balls. You could have gone 1,3, 2, 6 which might have tempted others but instead you went 1,3 and then down for the 7, which offered a safe path to 2 and 6 balls which could have been played in various ways depending on the position you ended up with. If you finished short you could have played the 6 in the bottom left and finished with the same patter of 2, 4 and 5.
3 to 7 and 7 to 6 are probably the game shots here, but should give too much problem. Good solution: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Paths look realistic. I especially like the shoot lines v position lines contrast. I'd like to see cuetable incorporate this feature for clarity: 10 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Looks as simple as I can at least imagine, though maybe there is a simpler path that I haven't noticed that could simplyfy the shape to 7 and 6 balls: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Nice way of using the 2 to the 4 ball: 10 points
Total: 48 points
Result to Billyards, as I think he chose the more simple balls and came up with pretty nifty out plan to manage them, combined with pretty safe routes.
Thanks Perk and better luck next time. Your solution was also high standard imho.
The FINAL will be jsp v BillYards
I'll post the table challenge shortly.
Colin
Semi Final 2
Perk v BillYards
Perk
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
No serious problem balls on stripes, though the 15, 11 and 10 could present problems.
The line you chose from the 10 to the 15 could be a little tricky, but you could run through to the rail for the 15 if you got an akward angle after playing the 13. If you finished too straight on the 15 to stun across for the 9 ball, you could run through for the 12 ball and probably manage a way out from there.
I might have played 14, 15, 10, 13, 9 to begin but I think your choice of order is pretty safe for a decent player. Not much to fault.
: 18 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Paths look ok but you went a bit close to the 5 ball playing 2 rails for the 8-ball. I might have gone one rail only: 9 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Pretty good except maybe the stun across table for the 9-ball, and I think spots would have afforded a simpler sequence of paths: 8 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Goo use of 13 to 10 to 15 and 9 to 11 ball to deal with potential problem balls: 9 points
Total: 44 Points.
BillYards
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
You chose spots and I think this pattern looks a bit easier that stripes. 4 seems the only ball that could be called a problem ball, but it is not that hard, so no need to rush to deal with it.
I like the way you moved around the balls. You could have gone 1,3, 2, 6 which might have tempted others but instead you went 1,3 and then down for the 7, which offered a safe path to 2 and 6 balls which could have been played in various ways depending on the position you ended up with. If you finished short you could have played the 6 in the bottom left and finished with the same patter of 2, 4 and 5.
3 to 7 and 7 to 6 are probably the game shots here, but should give too much problem. Good solution: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Paths look realistic. I especially like the shoot lines v position lines contrast. I'd like to see cuetable incorporate this feature for clarity: 10 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Looks as simple as I can at least imagine, though maybe there is a simpler path that I haven't noticed that could simplyfy the shape to 7 and 6 balls: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Nice way of using the 2 to the 4 ball: 10 points
Total: 48 points
Result to Billyards, as I think he chose the more simple balls and came up with pretty nifty out plan to manage them, combined with pretty safe routes.
Thanks Perk and better luck next time. Your solution was also high standard imho.
The FINAL will be jsp v BillYards
I'll post the table challenge shortly.
Colin
Attachments
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Final: jsp v BillYards
Final: jsp v BillYards
Ok guys, I want a clean, fair fight
Table code, if it starts working again is:
http://CueTable.com/P/?3AUYR3BIlr4C...3HBBG3IRhy2JNXP2KaIF4LDMy2MNgp1NFaD2OCRX4PEKL
I ask that you submit a detailed explanation of your reasoning on critical aspects of your run out plans, along with your attached solution diagrams.
Here is your table...
Final: jsp v BillYards
Ok guys, I want a clean, fair fight
Table code, if it starts working again is:
http://CueTable.com/P/?3AUYR3BIlr4C...3HBBG3IRhy2JNXP2KaIF4LDMy2MNgp1NFaD2OCRX4PEKL
I ask that you submit a detailed explanation of your reasoning on critical aspects of your run out plans, along with your attached solution diagrams.
Here is your table...
Attachments
Solution
Ok… my first look told me that stripes were too difficult to start, so I knew I had to go with solids. Looking backwards from the 8… it has two good pockets that it can go into (upper side and lower left corner) and a couple of bad pocket options.
So, I will try a route for either of those two pockets… I looked at several routes before choosing one that looked quite easy… with the smallest amount of cueball movement for position and nice natural routes running along position zones instead of perpendicular to them.
6 ball in the corner pocket, with about 6” of draw… a nice, easy shot, setting up a good angle on the 2 to go one rail behind the 9 with natural cueball movement. If anything goes way wrong with the 6 ball position and I can’t make the two, I can shoot at the 1, 3, or 5.
This is the key to the rack: shoot the 2 ball (a bit of a problem ball) into the corner, cueball off the rail around the 9, to the center of the table, leaving shots on the 1, 7, 3, 5, and maybe even the 4. I chose the one-rail shot instead of drawing the cueball straight uptable between the 9 and 8 because the margin of error is too small for the draw shot. As soon as you hit the rail, you can see the 3 or 5 in case you fall short on the 1.
Now that I am into this route, I see that I want to shoot the 1 or 7 last as I will have the best chance for an easy leave on the 8.
But I also see that I have another problem ball… the 4. I go after the 4 by shooting a stop shot on the 1, then the 3 in the side with a little roll ahead to get a good line on the 5 ball. If my leave on the 3 was not straight enough to make this shot work, I could have easily gone for the 7 first,
Now, 5 in the corner rolling up enough to have a safe shot on the 4 to draw back for the 7.
7 in the side, floating over a couple of inches which leaves the cueball behind the 8 in a huge position zone.
That’s my choice of routes.
Ok… my first look told me that stripes were too difficult to start, so I knew I had to go with solids. Looking backwards from the 8… it has two good pockets that it can go into (upper side and lower left corner) and a couple of bad pocket options.
So, I will try a route for either of those two pockets… I looked at several routes before choosing one that looked quite easy… with the smallest amount of cueball movement for position and nice natural routes running along position zones instead of perpendicular to them.
6 ball in the corner pocket, with about 6” of draw… a nice, easy shot, setting up a good angle on the 2 to go one rail behind the 9 with natural cueball movement. If anything goes way wrong with the 6 ball position and I can’t make the two, I can shoot at the 1, 3, or 5.
This is the key to the rack: shoot the 2 ball (a bit of a problem ball) into the corner, cueball off the rail around the 9, to the center of the table, leaving shots on the 1, 7, 3, 5, and maybe even the 4. I chose the one-rail shot instead of drawing the cueball straight uptable between the 9 and 8 because the margin of error is too small for the draw shot. As soon as you hit the rail, you can see the 3 or 5 in case you fall short on the 1.
Now that I am into this route, I see that I want to shoot the 1 or 7 last as I will have the best chance for an easy leave on the 8.
But I also see that I have another problem ball… the 4. I go after the 4 by shooting a stop shot on the 1, then the 3 in the side with a little roll ahead to get a good line on the 5 ball. If my leave on the 3 was not straight enough to make this shot work, I could have easily gone for the 7 first,
Now, 5 in the corner rolling up enough to have a safe shot on the 4 to draw back for the 7.
7 in the side, floating over a couple of inches which leaves the cueball behind the 8 in a huge position zone.
That’s my choice of routes.
Attachments
John and Johnny
Ok, here is my secret "phone-a-friend" that has been helping me with the Wei table tournament! Just kidding! This is me with Johnny when he was in Puerto Rico at the start of the year. Found him to be a very nice guy. His wife and son were very nice too. Dang! Sorry to hijack this thread!!!
Ok, here is my secret "phone-a-friend" that has been helping me with the Wei table tournament! Just kidding! This is me with Johnny when he was in Puerto Rico at the start of the year. Found him to be a very nice guy. His wife and son were very nice too. Dang! Sorry to hijack this thread!!!
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I think there's one other reasonable, though similar, way to go, but I'll wait till JSP posts his answer before putting it up. But I like Bill's path.mnShooter said:
Cory
Sorry people for delaying the finals. My baby daughter just had surgery this morning, so I had to put pool on the far backburner over the weekend (my daughter is okay 
, not trying to win sympathy points 
). I'll try to get out a solution by tonight. I haven't seen Bill's solution yet, and i'm trying to avoid looking at it. I'll get my solution out fairly soon.
, not trying to win sympathy points ). I'll try to get out a solution by tonight. I haven't seen Bill's solution yet, and i'm trying to avoid looking at it. I'll get my solution out fairly soon.
my finals solution
First I have to say i'm kinda disappointed in the Calc for not picking a tougher rack for the finals. Cue table isn't working for me either, so I painted my out below.
Choosing solids is a no brainer. I chose to get rid of the 6 and 2 immediately. They really don't serve as good key balls to the 8, and getting position to pocket these two later in the rack would be tricky. The draw/drag shot from the 2 to the 1 is the most difficult shot of the entire rack. Ideally I want to get straight in on the 1, such that a stop shot can be executed on the subsequent 3 for a slight follow on the 5 to drop down for the 4. Then a simple draw back from the 4, being sure I stay on the correct side of the 7 to drop down for the 8. This would be the ideal route.
Although positioning from the 2 to straight-in on the 1 would be difficult to obtain perfectly, I have three back up balls in the 3,5, and 7 in case I get out of shape. If I go a little too far on the 1, then I would go 3,5,4, and 7 and have the 1 as the key ball. If I go much further such that I'm on the other side of the 7, then I'd go 7,3,5 and have a power draw on the 4 to go one rail for the 1 as the key ball. If I get in between the 2 previous scenarios, then i'd probably hit the 5 and 4 first, leaving the 1,3, and 7 to get position on the 8.
Because the 1,3, and 7 are open in the middle of the table, this rack is fairly simple because of the numerous options you have availabe to you after pocketing the 2. It is a must, however, to get the 6 and 2 out of the way right from the start. The 1 or 7 should be left last as the key ball.
First I have to say i'm kinda disappointed in the Calc for not picking a tougher rack for the finals.
Cue table isn't working for me either, so I painted my out below.Choosing solids is a no brainer. I chose to get rid of the 6 and 2 immediately. They really don't serve as good key balls to the 8, and getting position to pocket these two later in the rack would be tricky. The draw/drag shot from the 2 to the 1 is the most difficult shot of the entire rack. Ideally I want to get straight in on the 1, such that a stop shot can be executed on the subsequent 3 for a slight follow on the 5 to drop down for the 4. Then a simple draw back from the 4, being sure I stay on the correct side of the 7 to drop down for the 8. This would be the ideal route.
Although positioning from the 2 to straight-in on the 1 would be difficult to obtain perfectly, I have three back up balls in the 3,5, and 7 in case I get out of shape. If I go a little too far on the 1, then I would go 3,5,4, and 7 and have the 1 as the key ball. If I go much further such that I'm on the other side of the 7, then I'd go 7,3,5 and have a power draw on the 4 to go one rail for the 1 as the key ball. If I get in between the 2 previous scenarios, then i'd probably hit the 5 and 4 first, leaving the 1,3, and 7 to get position on the 8.
Because the 1,3, and 7 are open in the middle of the table, this rack is fairly simple because of the numerous options you have availabe to you after pocketing the 2. It is a must, however, to get the 6 and 2 out of the way right from the start. The 1 or 7 should be left last as the key ball.
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Just saw Bill's solution. Not bad solution, I have to say! I'm actually not surprised to see that we have the same out, since the rack was pretty straight forward.
Only difference between our solutions is that Bill went one rail from the 2 to the 1, while I chose between the 9 and the 8. Both works.
I vote that Colin counts this as a tie and gives us a very difficult rack to run as a tiebreaker, such that it would be almost impossible to have duplicate outs.
EDIT: Okay, since we're showing off our "phone a friends", this is my buddy who has been helping me out on the Wei. Has Johnny won a world 8ball title? I think not! Man, calling Taiwan several times this past week will definitely destroy my phone bill!
FYI, this was taken during the IPT qualifier in Chelmsford.
I'm actually not surprised to see that we have the same out, since the rack was pretty straight forward.Only difference between our solutions is that Bill went one rail from the 2 to the 1, while I chose between the 9 and the 8. Both works.
I vote that Colin counts this as a tie and gives us a very difficult rack to run as a tiebreaker, such that it would be almost impossible to have duplicate outs.
EDIT: Okay, since we're showing off our "phone a friends", this is my buddy who has been helping me out on the Wei. Has Johnny won a world 8ball title? I think not!
Man, calling Taiwan several times this past week will definitely destroy my phone bill!FYI, this was taken during the IPT qualifier in Chelmsford.
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Hey guys, thanks for putting up your solutions.
I was also a bit busy yesterday, but I'll put up my judgement as soon as I get time.
I'll also put up my own solution which is a bit different, so you can all have a chance to critique me
btw: jsp, I hope your daughter is recovering well!
As for the choice of out, I wanted the choice of balls to be one sided so we could get a direct comparison of routes on the same balls. It was a little simpler than I would have liked it, but still, I think there are still route options, as you'll see when I post my own.
I had to go through quite a few racks to find one that was suitable. If kisses are needed then the out plan becomes much more speculative. Even easy outs like this can be messed up with one poor positional shot, especially if we don't have second options, so I will contrast the positions played to, considering their ease and risk of getting out of line.
And Billyards...nice photo...certainly not a threadjacker. Good to know Jonny has a good OUT-PLAN advisor
I was also a bit busy yesterday, but I'll put up my judgement as soon as I get time.
I'll also put up my own solution which is a bit different, so you can all have a chance to critique me
btw: jsp, I hope your daughter is recovering well!
As for the choice of out, I wanted the choice of balls to be one sided so we could get a direct comparison of routes on the same balls. It was a little simpler than I would have liked it, but still, I think there are still route options, as you'll see when I post my own.
I had to go through quite a few racks to find one that was suitable. If kisses are needed then the out plan becomes much more speculative. Even easy outs like this can be messed up with one poor positional shot, especially if we don't have second options, so I will contrast the positions played to, considering their ease and risk of getting out of line.
And Billyards...nice photo...certainly not a threadjacker. Good to know Jonny has a good OUT-PLAN advisor
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jsp said:Sorry people for delaying the finals. My baby daughter just had surgery this morning, so I had to put pool on the far backburner over the weekend (my daughter is okay
jsp:
Very sorry to hear about your daugher having surgery this morning. It must be in the air, as my son, Tyler, is in the hospital too. He is 16 months old and has been battling colds and infections since entering daycare at 1 year old. He had a bad fever on Sat night, so I was in cold showers off and on with him and we took him to the emergency room at 10:00 Sunday. The doctor did blood work and said that Tyler had to stay there for IV antibiotics. That was at 2:00 in the afternoon. It took until 9:00pm to get the room and 10:00pm to get the antibiotics flowing. Drove me nuts!
I took the camera tonight to get a shot of him in his little crib with the IV, but the other little girl in his room is on oxygen, so no flashes allowed. Will try to snap one tomorrow after I have to door open for a while to make sure I won't torch the place.
It is one of the hardest things in the world to hold your baby down while they are sticking him and he is looking to you for help with tears in his eyes.
Tyler's first real word was "daaa-DEE" and he always says it like that.... real hard and quick on the second "D".
Here is a photo of Tyler at his 1 year birthday party...
Sorry for the hijack... this is the "community" part of the tournament, Haha!
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Final - The Decision
The FINAL
BillYards v jsp
Well guys, you both get my sympathy votes with your sick kids
...but I have to make a decision...and we can try some trickier out sequences later.
Both of you took out the 2 early, instead of playing the tempting 1 first shot, which was smart I think. The only difference was playing the rail off the 2 ball, and the drawing of lines, which I consider to be important, as this is part of critical planning too.
I will focus on your differences to simplify things.
BillYards
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
Bill plays off the rail, but I feel there are three negatives with this shot, which over-ride the positive of being an easier speed feel shot that comes in at a slightly advantageous angle to the line wanted on the 1-ball.
1. The distance of travel is larger. 2. The 9 is close to the path. 3. If you run too far and get up against the 3-ball, then you may struggle to get the CB back on track.
However, I do like your choice of angles, a couple of slight stun throughs and some roll throughs. I think you'd make the 2 to 1, and run out from there. But I would have prefered that you drew up to the 1-ball if you finished a friendly angle on the 2 ball to do this.
: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Very Good: 10 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Very good except my preference for the 2 to 1 ball: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
The 2 and 4 balls were the potential problems. Particularly the 4 ball. You both went the same way here, and played the 4 ball on the 6th shot. I do think there was a better way to get rid of the 4 earlier, as it could have presented problems if you drifted out of position on the other shots: 9 points
Total: 47 Points.
jsp
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
As I already said, I prefer drawing up to the 1-ball, but the position you drew this from looks very tough, if possible at all. I also think you went the wrong way on the stun through on the 5 ball, which moves toward, rather than away from the 4. This brings in added risk of getting a bad angle for the draw from the 4 ball back to the 7: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
The line on the 2 ball does not look accurate, or optimal to me: 9 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Again, a slight penalty for the positions from the 2 and 5 balls: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Same as BillYards: 9 points
Total: 46 points
It's a shame there has to be a loser...and remember it's just my opinion, done in a way that hopefully all of us can learn some things about analyzing the game and using the new software in a fun and productive way.
So a hat tip to jsp for 2nd place and a hearty handshake of congratulations to BillYards who never looked like missing a ball
I will post my own solution and reasoning after this, so the 7 who were not so fortunate to win can get some revenge on me.
Colin
The FINAL
BillYards v jsp
Well guys, you both get my sympathy votes with your sick kids
...but I have to make a decision...and we can try some trickier out sequences later.Both of you took out the 2 early, instead of playing the tempting 1 first shot, which was smart I think. The only difference was playing the rail off the 2 ball, and the drawing of lines, which I consider to be important, as this is part of critical planning too.
I will focus on your differences to simplify things.
BillYards
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
Bill plays off the rail, but I feel there are three negatives with this shot, which over-ride the positive of being an easier speed feel shot that comes in at a slightly advantageous angle to the line wanted on the 1-ball.
1. The distance of travel is larger. 2. The 9 is close to the path. 3. If you run too far and get up against the 3-ball, then you may struggle to get the CB back on track.
However, I do like your choice of angles, a couple of slight stun throughs and some roll throughs. I think you'd make the 2 to 1, and run out from there. But I would have prefered that you drew up to the 1-ball if you finished a friendly angle on the 2 ball to do this.
: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
Very Good: 10 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Very good except my preference for the 2 to 1 ball: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
The 2 and 4 balls were the potential problems. Particularly the 4 ball. You both went the same way here, and played the 4 ball on the 6th shot. I do think there was a better way to get rid of the 4 earlier, as it could have presented problems if you drifted out of position on the other shots: 9 points
Total: 47 Points.
jsp
OUT PLAN SUCCESS ESTIMATE (OPSE): 20 points
As I already said, I prefer drawing up to the 1-ball, but the position you drew this from looks very tough, if possible at all. I also think you went the wrong way on the stun through on the 5 ball, which moves toward, rather than away from the 4. This brings in added risk of getting a bad angle for the draw from the 4 ball back to the 7: 19 points
PATH ACCURACY: 10 points
The line on the 2 ball does not look accurate, or optimal to me: 9 points
PATH SIMPLICITY: 10 points
Again, a slight penalty for the positions from the 2 and 5 balls: 9 points
PROBLEM BALL HANDLING : 10 points
Same as BillYards: 9 points
Total: 46 points
It's a shame there has to be a loser...and remember it's just my opinion, done in a way that hopefully all of us can learn some things about analyzing the game and using the new software in a fun and productive way.
So a hat tip to jsp for 2nd place and a hearty handshake of congratulations to BillYards who never looked like missing a ball
I will post my own solution and reasoning after this, so the 7 who were not so fortunate to win can get some revenge on me.
Colin
Attachments
My Solution
Ok, here's how I would have planned for the Final Table out.
I see the 4 ball as the biggest potential problem ball, but I also want to get rid of the 2 and 6 balls early, as they are not friendly for a finish.
The shot you other guys played to get on the 1 off the 2 ball is about 80% chance of getting the required angle I feel. The shot I played to get from the 2 to the 4 ball is about 70% by comparison I reckon. But if I get it right, I think I'm on a cosmo finish. No potential problems except making a decent pot on the 5-ball, but this shouldn't be a problem.
If I finish longer than what I diagrammed on the 4 ball, I could get an even better angle on the 4, for a stun shot to the 5, or if even lower I should have a 3/4 ball run through off 1 rail for the 5 in the same pocket. Any further and I'm in some trouble and will have a toughish 3. But I have about a 10" margin on the long side.
On the short side of my aim position, I would have the 7 or 3 as good options for a pattern similar to the ones jsp and BY played. If I'm really short I can play the 5 and be on the 4 early too. So I have about a 24 inch margin on the short side. Totally I have 3 foot margin for a good position, but I'm aiming to get to the top 1/3rd of that line so I can take care of the 4 ball first.
The way I analyze it is where would I place the CB if I had BIH after the 2 ball. I'd want to be on the 4 with a good angle for the 5 ball, for a cosmo finish. As there is a way to get onto that 4 ball, which shouldn't get me in any serious trouble, I figure it's worth a shot. And this is a situation where I reckon it's worthwhile.
Ok, here's how I would have planned for the Final Table out.
I see the 4 ball as the biggest potential problem ball, but I also want to get rid of the 2 and 6 balls early, as they are not friendly for a finish.
The shot you other guys played to get on the 1 off the 2 ball is about 80% chance of getting the required angle I feel. The shot I played to get from the 2 to the 4 ball is about 70% by comparison I reckon. But if I get it right, I think I'm on a cosmo finish. No potential problems except making a decent pot on the 5-ball, but this shouldn't be a problem.
If I finish longer than what I diagrammed on the 4 ball, I could get an even better angle on the 4, for a stun shot to the 5, or if even lower I should have a 3/4 ball run through off 1 rail for the 5 in the same pocket. Any further and I'm in some trouble and will have a toughish 3. But I have about a 10" margin on the long side.
On the short side of my aim position, I would have the 7 or 3 as good options for a pattern similar to the ones jsp and BY played. If I'm really short I can play the 5 and be on the 4 early too. So I have about a 24 inch margin on the short side. Totally I have 3 foot margin for a good position, but I'm aiming to get to the top 1/3rd of that line so I can take care of the 4 ball first.
The way I analyze it is where would I place the CB if I had BIH after the 2 ball. I'd want to be on the 4 with a good angle for the 5 ball, for a cosmo finish. As there is a way to get onto that 4 ball, which shouldn't get me in any serious trouble, I figure it's worth a shot. And this is a situation where I reckon it's worthwhile.
