Cutting shaft dowels

You must have quite an operation. Logs weighing thousands of pounds to move, debark, cut to length. saw or split, stack and sticker in the kiln and dry and all very quickly before the wood stains.

I know someone who does this very thing and he can get up to almost a 15% yield from a very good log.

I'm too old for that sort of thing. I'll keep buying 500 or 1,000 shafts at a time and pick the good ones.

Good luck!
 
qbilder said:
I cut everything myself, sometimes even the tree. Usually I buy lumber, picking through pallet loads hoping to find a nice board or two. I pick the boards for weight, straightness or grain, tightness of grain & straightness of board. It's tricky talking the lumber yards into letting me hack open a pallet of 1000bf to pick through, but being neat & orderly helps. It's easier when I mill my own trees. Then I can cut the boards along the grain, and give the face of the board the most grain count. I'll be milling one this winter, a big ole' bastard of a tree, but still rigid & strong. I can't wait. I'm doing all the logistical research this summer for building a kiln specifically to dry shaft wood. The idea is to no longer depend on the timber industry for finding quality shaft wood, but instead do it all 100% self sufficient & 100% in control of the wood from log to shaft.
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I've heard that New Mexico is thinking of changing their state tree to sugar maple........
 
Paul Dayton said:
You are correct. There is no difference between a 1" round and a 1" square other than the missing flats. They are both ripped from 1" boards. The shaper doesn't change the wood.
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Maybe it is the wood..........just maybe........
 
Paul Dayton said:
You must have quite an operation. Logs weighing thousands of pounds to move, debark, cut to length. saw or split, stack and sticker in the kiln and dry and all very quickly before the wood stains.

I know someone who does this very thing and he can get up to almost a 15% yield from a very good log.

I'm too old for that sort of thing. I'll keep buying 500 or 1,000 shafts at a time and pick the good ones.

Good luck!
Click to expand...

The family has a farm in Wisconsin, and there's a band mill in the barn. We move the logs around with tongs attached to the PTO on the tractor. Pretty easy stuff, really. It's just hard physical labor. Milling a log for shafts takes about two hours. From the mill we load the lumber up & haul it down to the next farm where they have the kiln. It's kinda cool how the farmers all work together. One has a mill, one has a kiln, etc. The main purpose for the operation is making fence boards & barn lumber. All of them are pool league enthusiasts & think my building pool cues is the neatest thing, so they get excited about milling logs up for pool cues & it becomes a community effort.

I have family in Ohio with a circular mill, too. They also have an old growth forest. We down a log, pull it down the mountain with the tractor & load it on the trailer, haul it a couple miles down the road to the family's mill operation. The forest is called, "Sugartree Hollow", hence the name of my cues. I was born & raised there. The trees in the bottoms were all tapped for syrup for as long as anybody knows, so the name came pretty logically. Most of the trees cut are giant cherrys & oaks & sold as veneer logs. The trees are incredibly old, tall & straight up with no branches. It's a lot of fun, adventure. I go deer hunting & am constantly scanning the timbers for just the right shaft log. I have one chosen that i'm cutting this December, hoping to get three 10' veneer logs, enough shaft wood to last me until I die. I enjoy the hell out of this stuff :) Part of the forest is mine, around 20 acres, but i'm working on talking the rest of the family into selling all of their share to me so I can keep the old forest as is.
 
JoeyInCali said:
Everytime you say MAYBE, I know you're holding out.:eek:
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Yeah, he's got something he's not saying :) There may be something to it, though. I have noticed sharpness of blades & speed of cut having a relation to warpage. I don't mean a dull bit causing chatter & pushing the wood away as it cuts. I mean ultra sharp blades & slow cuts compared to faster cuts or worn blades. Either way results in a straight shaft immediately off the machine, but the ones cut with the sharp blades & rediculously slow seem to stay straight quite noticeably more frequent than the shafts cut with old blades. Maybe it's just me & nothing to it. It just really seems that way, though. One thing is for certain, this shaft cutting crap is a friggin science & i'm not sure anybody has it 100% figured out. Just when I think I have it right, I learn something new.
 
qbilder said:
Yeah, he's got something he's not saying :) There may be something to it, though. I have noticed sharpness of blades & speed of cut having a relation to warpage. I don't mean a dull bit causing chatter & pushing the wood away as it cuts. I mean ultra sharp blades & slow cuts compared to faster cuts or worn blades. Either way results in a straight shaft immediately off the machine, but the ones cut with the sharp blades & rediculously slow seem to stay straight quite noticeably more frequent than the shafts cut with old blades. Maybe it's just me & nothing to it. It just really seems that way, though. One thing is for certain, this shaft cutting crap is a friggin science & i'm not sure anybody has it 100% figured out. Just when I think I have it right, I learn something new.
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If the blade is old and worn, it will create heat, which will then steam up the moisture on that side of the wood leaving less moisture on one side compared to the other. Just a thought.
Dave
 
JoeyInCali said:
If the blade is dull, more pushoff. Less round dowels.
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Yeah, that's what I meant by "chatter". It's not what i'm talking about. What i'm trying to say is a blade sharp enough to make good clean cuts doesn't seem to have as good of results as a blade that's sharper than it needs to be. I know what i'm saying, just having a hard time expressing it clearly.
 
qbilder said:
Yeah, that's what I meant by "chatter". It's not what i'm talking about. What i'm trying to say is a blade sharp enough to make good clean cuts doesn't seem to have as good of results as a blade that's sharper than it needs to be. I know what i'm saying, just having a hard time expressing it clearly.
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word!
I quit using 2-flute thick kerf cutters on my router. They just don't cut clean enough for me. Problem with ugly cuts is when you turn the dowels to check for runout, it's hard to see the edges.
Clean cuts make it easier for me eyes.:)
Plus you can roll the dowels on the table if you want.
 
qbilder said:
The family has a farm in Wisconsin, and there's a band mill in the barn. We move the logs around with tongs attached to the PTO on the tractor. Pretty easy stuff, really. It's just hard physical labor. Milling a log for shafts takes about two hours. From the mill we load the lumber up & haul it down to the next farm where they have the kiln. It's kinda cool how the farmers all work together. One has a mill, one has a kiln, etc. The main purpose for the operation is making fence boards & barn lumber. All of them are pool league enthusiasts & think my building pool cues is the neatest thing, so they get excited about milling logs up for pool cues & it becomes a community effort.

I have family in Ohio with a circular mill, too. They also have an old growth forest. We down a log, pull it down the mountain with the tractor & load it on the trailer, haul it a couple miles down the road to the family's mill operation. The forest is called, "Sugartree Hollow", hence the name of my cues. I was born & raised there. The trees in the bottoms were all tapped for syrup for as long as anybody knows, so the name came pretty logically. Most of the trees cut are giant cherrys & oaks & sold as veneer logs. The trees are incredibly old, tall & straight up with no branches. It's a lot of fun, adventure. I go deer hunting & am constantly scanning the timbers for just the right shaft log. I have one chosen that i'm cutting this December, hoping to get three 10' veneer logs, enough shaft wood to last me until I die. I enjoy the hell out of this stuff :) Part of the forest is mine, around 20 acres, but i'm working on talking the rest of the family into selling all of their share to me so I can keep the old forest as is.
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My new VBF...................;)



<~~~thinks one problem with dowelers is the blades usually don't get changed as often as they should.....................
 
qbilder said:
The family has a farm in Wisconsin, and there's a band mill in the barn. We move the logs around with tongs attached to the PTO on the tractor. Pretty easy stuff, really. It's just hard physical labor. Milling a log for shafts takes about two hours. From the mill we load the lumber up & haul it down to the next farm where they have the kiln. It's kinda cool how the farmers all work together. One has a mill, one has a kiln, etc. The main purpose for the operation is making fence boards & barn lumber. All of them are pool league enthusiasts & think my building pool cues is the neatest thing, so they get excited about milling logs up for pool cues & it becomes a community effort.

I have family in Ohio with a circular mill, too. They also have an old growth forest. We down a log, pull it down the mountain with the tractor & load it on the trailer, haul it a couple miles down the road to the family's mill operation. The forest is called, "Sugartree Hollow", hence the name of my cues. I was born & raised there. The trees in the bottoms were all tapped for syrup for as long as anybody knows, so the name came pretty logically. Most of the trees cut are giant cherrys & oaks & sold as veneer logs. The trees are incredibly old, tall & straight up with no branches. It's a lot of fun, adventure. I go deer hunting & am constantly scanning the timbers for just the right shaft log. I have one chosen that i'm cutting this December, hoping to get three 10' veneer logs, enough shaft wood to last me until I die. I enjoy the hell out of this stuff :) Part of the forest is mine, around 20 acres, but i'm working on talking the rest of the family into selling all of their share to me so I can keep the old forest as is.
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That's awesome. You are very lucky.
 
BarenbruggeCues said:
My new VBF...................;)



<~~~thinks one problem with dowelers is the blades usually don't get changed as often as they should.....................
Click to expand...

I think you are absolutely right. They are pretty easy to sharpen, and easily adjusted, so there's not really any excuse to not keep sharp blades. Wes has the doweller at his shop, he bought it brand new. When we began milling shaft wood & dowel the squares, we made some pretty neat mods to the machine. For a complex gear box, the actual logic of the doweller is pretty basic. It's like a giant pencil sharpener. But even still, straight squares go in & some come out the other end in 10 seconds warped. One good clean-up cut on the lathe & they are straight again, but I really do beleive there's a science to the actual cut & how it affects the straightness.
 
JoeyInCali said:
word!
I quit using 2-flute thick kerf cutters on my router. They just don't cut clean enough for me. Problem with ugly cuts is when you turn the dowels to check for runout, it's hard to see the edges.
Clean cuts make it easier for me eyes.:)
Plus you can roll the dowels on the table if you want.
Click to expand...


The 1/16 thick ones have always worked better for me.......2 flute for roughing...3 for the finals.

<~~~I like Amana the best..........
 
qbilder said:
I think you are absolutely right. They are pretty easy to sharpen, and easily adjusted, so there's not really any excuse to not keep sharp blades. Wes has the doweller at his shop, he bought it brand new. When we began milling shaft wood & dowel the squares, we made some pretty neat mods to the machine. For a complex gear box, the actual logic of the doweller is pretty basic. It's like a giant pencil sharpener. But even still, straight squares go in & some come out the other end in 10 seconds warped. One good clean-up cut on the lathe & they are straight again, but I really do beleive there's a science to the actual cut & how it affects the straightness.
Click to expand...

I also agree. The best set up I know about is one that is custom made using molding blades. Even the slightly bent squares are coming out straighter than they went in.
 
Yes, I am. And if all goes as I want it to, i'll have a total of around 100 acres of untouched appalachian mountain wilderness. In today's world, it's a rare find. I'm lucky my folks have had the fortitude to hold onto it & not give in the potential cash boom all that timber would bring.
 
qbilder said:
Yes, I am. And if all goes as I want it to, i'll have a total of around 100 acres of untouched appalachian mountain wilderness. In today's world, it's a rare find. I'm lucky my folks have had the fortitude to hold onto it & not give in the potential cash boom all that timber would bring.
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OK, start training dogs to find antler sheddings!
Wohooo!!!!:D
 
JoeyInCali said:
OK, start training dogs to find antler sheddings!
Wohooo!!!!:D
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:) Don't need a dog for that. My brother does that well enough himself. In the past 10 years, around 20 trophy size bucks have been harvested on the property & there's antlers everywhere. He's a taxidermist as well, a true 100% hillbillie, so naturally he collects antlers. I get the "less than trophy" antlers every year when I visit. I use them for joint collars. He won't part with the large ones. There's lots of antler tips, though, if you need some for ferrules.

It's kinda funny. After being in the military for years, I lost interest in shooting any critters. I still go back home to deer hunt with my brother, but rarely ever pull the trigger. I just enjoy the time spent with family, and time in the open wilderness. The last time I went, I actually shot a buck because it had nice, smooth, roughly 1" diameter antlers!!!! I seen joint collars & jerky!!!!! Couldn't resist :)
 
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