Dealing Cues Internationally

[Bamacues]

True about customs...

First, Let me say that I have had successful transactions with players from Singapore, Taiwan, Phillipines, Japan, England, Germany, Italy, and some others. If you only work with people who have had successful transactions with others and can offer some type of references, you increase your chance of success, whether in the USA or abroad.

As for Fish and Wildlife, unfortunately, I know first hand that what has been said is true, and it is not simply Ivory that they are looking for. I bought a cue abroad that had Abalone in it. Apparently, there was an endangered species and was a prohibited type of Abalone from that country, and Fish and Wildlife seized the cue. Later, they released the cue and sent it along to me, along with a fine that was more than the value of the cue.
Joe

 

[Rainman]

I apologize to any of the Singaporean members of the AZ forums. It was not my intent to offend. But there are plenty of stories about scams coming out of China and Singapore, especially with guitars, that.....well....makes it look bad. I didn't create that bad image so please don't take your hurt out on me. As for kids not shooting their teachers where you live, I live in Japan so it doesn't happen very much here either.
MULLY
and don't call me a racist. I'm a Caucasian with an Asian wife.

Hmmm...I was thinking that you should have known better since you reside in Japan. I was under the impression that you were staying much further off or at least away from Asia to have such misinterpretations abt Singapore.

I have been to Japan once and the Japanese are a courteous bunch of ppl who held us in high regards.

Anyway apologies accepted...its just that many ppl have misunderstood Singapore as one of those countries tainted with cases of fraud and scams. Its true that in many third world countries, and many parts of Asia, such unfortunate incidents are aplenty, and this has resulted in many inconveniences for me as I tried to get good deals from America.

Singapore has very strict laws, and the government clamps down hard on those who flout them. So do give us a chance and judge fairly in future when we are sincere in future dealings in regards to custom cues and other pool equipment...

 

[Bigtruck]

Clarify?

Second story involved a Japanese buyer. In this instance Japanese customs intercepted an ivory ordained cue inbound from the US. Not only did they confiscate that cue, but they raided his home and confiscated ALL of his cues - a substantial hit, as this is how he made his living.

Legal ivory, that is used in cues built in this country, cannot cross international borders. To attempt it is to risk siezure. Just wanted to let people know that cues are now on the radar screen of the authorities.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

Am i reading this right? The person who was to be recieving the ivory adorned cue was the one who lost all his cues to Customs? I don't think something like that would happen in the U.S..

Ray

 

[GADawg]

though you are right Mully. Singapore is like the international capital of Scams!!!

Removed by author. Enough said

 

[ridewiththewind]

Please quote some details. I have had many business dealings with Singaporeans with no scams involved.

Did you read the WHOLE thread?

 

[BHQ]

The point of my original post is that the authorities are becoming more aware of, and cracking down on, the international shipment of prohibited items used in the manufacture of pool cues. It hasn't always been thus, and shipping of these items occurred on a pretty regular basis. I just wanted to warn anyone making an international transaction that it may fall under greater scrutiny than it did in the past.

BTW, not EVERY Schon has ivory in it, and some that appear to have ivory may actually be using holly. Adios,

Pizza Bob

you're probably right about that.
i bought a schon on ebay a few years ago that had a ton of ivory in it.
so, was that illegal for the seller in england to send the cue to me in the usa????​

 

[mullyman]

Anyway apologies accepted...its just that many ppl have misunderstood Singapore as one of those countries tainted with cases of fraud and scams. Its true that in many third world countries, and many parts of Asia, such unfortunate incidents are aplenty, and this has resulted in many inconveniences for me as I tried to get good deals from America.

Don't feel too bad about it. For what it's worth I've had several sellers on Ebay tell me they wouldn't sell to me because I'm in Asia. My being American didn't sway them at all.

I've been to Singapore and think it's a wonderful place. The people were always very welcoming and the service was top notch. The food is incredible.

With that said, there is a very large market in Asia for brand goods that are copied. Louis Vitton and Chanel bags for example. Another highly copied item from Asia is guitars. There are a lot of fake Gibson and Fender guitars coming out of China. I just wouldn't want to chance it. With that said, even if I deal with someone in America I only go using escrow. I always tell them that I'll cover all charges. Any seller that won't go for that is probably a thief. No matter what country they come from.
MULLY
Once again, I apologize if my original post offended you.

 

[mullyman]

you're probably right about that.
i bought a schon on ebay a few years ago that had a ton of ivory in it.
so, was that illegal for the seller in england to send the cue to me in the usa????​

You know, that's a good question since the cue was originally made in the USA.

I sent one of my cues off to be refinished by the maker in the US. I orginally bought the cue here. When my cue was sent back to me I had to pay import taxes on it. That didn't sit well with me but there wasn't much I could do about it.
MULLY

 

[Sprite]

Different countries has different security run.

 

[buddha162]

Brian <------- and If you really think I'm a racist, ask buddha. He's one of my closest friends and he's Taiwanese.

Chinese, but it's a political distinction so, close enough...lol.

-Roger

 

[no-sho]

you're probably right about that.
i bought a schon on ebay a few years ago that had a ton of ivory in it.
so, was that illegal for the seller in england to send the cue to me in the usa????​

IMHO yes.
If I try and buy a Schön cue direct, Evan will tell me to buy it from Cuestix or another supplier if it contains any ivory. He wont ship it out of the states because he has already had problems before with Japan..
I also think it's illegal to import anything containing ivory into the states but I'm no expert.lol Although I have done it on many occasions I'm always a little hesitant of something be confiscated. I have sent many cues back and forth between the US and Europe that contained Ivory, to be restored or repaired. Cross my fingers everytime!!!
no-sho

 

[no-sho]

You know, that's a good question since the cue was originally made in the USA.

I sent one of my cues off to be refinished by the maker in the US. I orginally bought the cue here. When my cue was sent back to me I had to pay import taxes on it. That didn't sit well with me but there wasn't much I could do about it.
MULLY

I have the same deal here too. Everytime I send a cue back to the States for repair or refinish, I have to pay 20% import tax when it comes back. The good thing is I can write that tax off against what I sell...

no-sho

 

[ShaneS]

What about importing an American made cue into America? I was going to ask my prof. of International Econ. about it...

Since many of the top American made cues get exported, would I still have to pay the 15 or 20% tariff to bring them back? I would have to guess yes.

-Shane

 

[no-sho]

What about importing an American made cue into America? I was going to ask my prof. of International Econ. about it...

Since many of the top American made cues get exported, would I still have to pay the 15 or 20% tariff to bring them back? I would have to guess yes.

-Shane

That is a good question. I have sent many American cues back into America But I always state on the invoice and the customs declaration that it is for REPAIR ONLY
I don't live in America, so I have no idea what the import tax or tarrif is. What I do know is that I have to pay 20% everytime it comes back into Austria from outside an EU country.

no-sho

 

[DJEnD]

That is a good question. I have sent many American cues back into America But I always state on the invoice and the customs declaration that it is for REPAIR ONLY
I don't live in America, so I have no idea what the import tax or tarrif is. What I do know is that I have to pay 20% everytime it comes back into Austria from outside an EU country.

no-sho

That truly sucks if you didn't have anything to write off against...

 

[mullyman]

That truly sucks if you didn't have anything to write off against...

It does suck. Big time. Lilke I said, I bought the cue here many years ago. It's mine. It's been paid for. All taxes and duties were taken care of many moons ago. Then, when I sent it to the US to be refinished it got back here and I got taxed. I was pissed to the gills.

Another problem I had one time was that I sent a cue for repair and the customs declaration said that the repair cost 150 bucks or whatever it was. Then it was insured for 2500. Customs wouldn't release it to me like that. They couldn't wrap their heads around the idea that the repairs cost 150 bucks but the cue needs to be insured for more in the event it was damaged in transit. I got screwed again. Ended up having to drop the value of the cue on the declaration yada yada and had to pay about 50 bucks in import duties.
MULLY

 

[Pizza Bob]

you're probably right about that.
i bought a schon on ebay a few years ago that had a ton of ivory in it.
so, was that illegal for the seller in england to send the cue to me in the usa????​

Yes it was. In that instance the law was broken twice. Once when it was exported and the second time when it was imported back into the USA. As I said, these prohibitions against ivory and other derivatives of endangered species have been in place for a long time. I don't know whether customs just got educated about cues or what, but something put us on their radar screen. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know if there are accommodations in place for distributors that sell abroad, but I think the laws apply to everyone regardless of individual or corporate status. It would be interesting to find out from some large distributor what they are allowed to export.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

 

[Icon of Sin]

The more I read this thread, the more I am reminded why I started posting at a new pool forum a couple days ago.

 

[robertno1pool]

Dealing cues internationally

One problem is what is considered legal and what is not to import or export cues with ivory where you happen to live. Problems with abalone and other materials are another. Seems only safe to deal with cues that have none of these materials in them internationally.

Another is whether it is ethical to help others finds sources or ways to increase the odds of breaking those rules.

Third is how can you travel with a cue or cues you own that have ivory or other materials in them just to have them to shoot with, participate in cue shows, etc. Is a paper trail all that is needed to prove up your cue has pre-ban ivory in it? Should we be getting some more documentation with new cues than we are getting now from cue makers?

Fourth is what is going to happen when all the "pre-ban" ivory runs out, cost of ivory increases, and eventually something other than ivory will be used. How much is still available and what other items (knives, gun handles, pens, etc.) are competing for these items? Will it be a synthetic, some other animal or plant, etc.?

 

[cueman]

I don't think its right to call Singapore an international capital of scam.. i've lived in Singapore all my life and i certainly don't think she's what you've claimed..

Your right. It is by far not the capital of scam. Indonesia and Nigeria beat it many times over. I have done a little business with Singapore and Indonesia, so there are some very honest people there who are active in billiards. I have sent machinery. There is a small element in those countries that are very active. You just have to know what to watch out for. Don't take credit cards from anyone there that is in a hurry for shipment. I have required all Indonesians to send payment by western union. Singapore can pay with paypal unless I smell a fraud. Nigeria on the other hand has so many different scams that I have done almost no business with them as we can never come to an agreement on how they will send the money.