Definition of a PRO

Wags

Wags

2 pocket-one pocket table
Silver Member
Many years ago I remember that the definition for a pro was anyone that entered a tournament with a $300 entry and received $300 or more in winnings. It was a nice easy difinitive statement that was easily applied.

Nowdays, that line is somewhat blurred. Pro lists are put out by amateur organizations saying who can and can't play. The BCAPL has a Grand Master designation which equals "pro". The APA calls itsel the world largest amateur organization and I can't find anything that disallows a "pro". The ACS has some strict ranking guidelines, but what do those rankings mean? How are those rankings based?

Is Jesse Bowman really an amateur or a pro? Beau Runningen is listed as a Master in 2 organizations but when you are ranked #41 on the BCA ranking list, is that correct? Is Chris Bartram an amateur or a pro? SVB just took a 7th and a 4th in the Black Bear tournament. Does that mean that those above him are pro's or at least pro caliber? Is there a difference?

I see tournaments all the time that are divided by "Open" and "A", or advertised by "no pro's allowed". What does that mean?

It would be nice if we could all at least play by the same rules by defining what makes a professional player, a professional player.

At the same time, why does anyone want to be a "pro" anymore?
 
Good post; I'd like to see the answer also. I also can't tell you how many people I've played that told me they were at one time a "semi-pro". Wonder what it takes to have that designation? custom stick and spend way too much time playing? trip to vegas? who knows.. but we are all probably semi-pros in our own minds ! :thumbup:
 
My definition:

A Pro is someone who relies on Playing Pool to make up 75-80% or more of their yearly income. Includes Sponsorships and Endorsements for playing pool.

A Semi-Pro is someone who relies on Playing Pool to make up 40-60% of their yearly income. Includes any sponsorships or endorsements. Has some other non pool related job.


Other Definitions include:

A Pro is someone that thinks I'm a Banger.
A Semi-Pro is someone that thinks I'm a Fish.
 
I consider a pro to be anyone who can make a living playing pool, whether it be tournaments or gambling. A semi-pro is basically anyone who isn't quite at that level but does make some money playing pool and can place in pro tournaments but just isn't a threat to win one or consistently finish high enough to make a living at it.
 
Im just speculating , but imo a Pro , is some one that has No less than a 100 ball run in straight pool, a pro can break and run 5 out of 10 racks in 9 ball, and barily ever misses in 8 ball ..
 
Hi Wags....:-)

IMO, I think this is the job of the Amateur groups. They must always do their best to protect their own rank & file.

Pro's could care less who plays with them. The more the merrier.

I always was in favor of the $300 rule. Made us think before joining.

To answer you last question: Nothing there to aspire to.

See you this Summer
randyg
 
Been discussed many times here...the answer depends on too many things to be defined in its current environment. skill, $, 'governing' body, etc...

Easier to define an amature, for purposes of entry eligibility into an event.
 
to me a ''PRO" is any person that makes a living at what they are doing be it baseball,basketball,roofing,plumbing or pool............of course you will have some better than others
 
Perfect description of a shortstop who can play at pro-speed, but can't or don't choose to earn a living professionally.

SKILLZELITE said:
Im just speculating , but imo a Pro , is some one that has No less than a 100 ball run in straight pool, a pro can break and run 5 out of 10 racks in 9 ball, and barily ever misses in 8 ball ..
Click to expand...
 
Pro?

The APA does not allow people who make a living at pool to play in their tournaments/leagues. Does this make them a Professional?

The owner of the Georgia Billiard Academy is not allowed to play in the US Amateur Championship because he makes his living from GBA and teaching. This does not mean he is at the skill level of a professional (although he is good, just not to that level).

To define someone as a pro by those standards seem weird to me. Another was placing in the money in a Open tournament doesn't necessarily mean a lot because the strength of the field of players varies tournament to tournament.

Hopefully one day I will be considerred a Pro. :)
 
randyg said:
Hi Wags....:-)

IMO, I think this is the job of the Amateur groups. They must always do their best to protect their own rank & file.

Pro's could care less who plays with them. The more the merrier.

I always was in favor of the $300 rule. Made us think before joining.

To answer you last question: Nothing there to aspire to.

See you this Summer
randyg
Click to expand...

Hey randyg

I certainly agree with protecting rank and file. It's just hard with all the different ranking systems in place to know where to draw the cutoff line if you are outside an organization. It really is up to the TD/promoter to make that judgement and set the parameters.

Of those that are out there, I really do like the BCAPL's system the best. I like that you have to earn your way through. If you get to the top of the system, Grand Master, that is the equivalent of being a pro (at least on a 7 footer). Of course I believe that's the avenue for pro success anyway.

Leagues are alive and well and they are all good. Player lists/rankings are never going to be perfect, but they will usually be close if they are used.

Randy, I don't remember when there has been more successful, independent, larger money added, bar table events than the present. The different state organizations seem to be putting on bigger and better events and getting greater participation. Las Vegas in May is the only place to be for competitive pool. Although I did 3 tournaments in 4 weeks there in the 80's and went a bit bonkers. That was before they had TV with regular programming. Remember, all you could watch was how to play the different games and promos for the venue. I stayed/played at the original MGM, Imperial Palace and the Riv.

It really is a great time for bar box pool.

Thanks for your input. See you this summer.

The $300 rule was so easy and clean, ah well.
 
stuckart said:
My definition:

A Pro is someone who relies on Playing Pool to make up 75-80% or more of their yearly income. Includes Sponsorships and Endorsements for playing pool.

A Semi-Pro is someone who relies on Playing Pool to make up 40-60% of their yearly income. Includes any sponsorships or endorsements. Has some other non pool related job.


Other Definitions include:

A Pro is someone that thinks I'm a Banger.
A Semi-Pro is someone that thinks I'm a Fish.
Click to expand...

For the most part this is how i would difine it as well. as for "open" vs. "no pros allowed" generally i would say that the entrance fee and pay out of a tournament will usually dictate the crowd. if a tournament is paying out 10k+ there will more than likely have a crowd of players that feel they have a shot to win. (pros and simi-pro's)
 
HDR10 said:
to me a ''PRO" is any person that makes a living at what they are doing be it baseball,basketball,roofing,plumbing or pool............of course you will have some better than others
Click to expand...




I agree with this guy, whatever you do in life, a certain person will be a PRO in a certain thing, if he makes his living out of it, if a guy plays football and he relays on football for his income and living, then he's a pro football player, same goes on any other job, basically if its your job, your a pro in that job.
 
Why not use one of the ranking challenges out there? Have the top 100 pros do the challenge 10 times, and see where a "pro" score would be. Anyone who wants to compete in these events should be able to hit the lowest score, and anyone who hits that score can't play in amateur events.

I know pros would probably welcome anyone into an event that wants to pay the entry fee so the prize money will increase. That is fine. But at least it would give you an idea of who should not be allowed. Of course, they could always try to dog the test, but then wouldn't be allowed in the open tournaments.
 
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