Diamond--Blue Label vs Red Label (long post)

I put the Diamond table at Hardtimes and recovered it at the same time with 860HR. I pull the rail cloth tight, very tight. The bed-cloth is also tight. The table is stock and hasn't been modified. In southern CA the climate is hot and dry, which makes a difference. Also how the table is maintained will make a difference. Keep in mind your comparing a table your playing on in person to a table your watching on TV and on TV your watching professionals. Try to move the cloth on your table?
 
peppersauce said:
Maybe this has been discussed, but I wanted to share an experience and get your insight and some opinions.

First, I've always loved Diamond tables. There's just something about them that sets them apart from other manufacturers. And I mean beyond the obvious differences that one can observe by simply looking at the table.

For a long time though, I played on nothing but GCs with very lively rails and loved them. Well, the room I currently play at got rid of their modified GC "pit" table and replaced it with a standard blue label Diamond pro am. Here's where things went south a little for me...this table doesn't play anything like I remember Diamond tables playing. With the exception of the pocket size, cut, and shelf depth--it plays more like an old GC that needs new cushions to me. Granted I always played on red labels, but something is definitely lacking, IMO.

I just assumed it was my mind playing tricks on me since I hadn't played on a Diamond in so long.
However, I recently took a road trip and stopped in a room I had never been in and hit some balls for an hour or so on a red label Diamond. What a breath of fresh air! The whole time I was there I was thinking, "THIS, whatever it is, is what's missing. THIS is the Diamond feel I know and love!" The cushions were so responsive and really had a LOT of "bite". I found myself pulling position shots out of the bag that I had gotten away from and spinning banks in from crazy angles, just because I could on that table. I was having fun!

On the blue label Diamond my pool room switched to, you are somewhat limited in that respect. The table doesn't play bad. It's mostly what I would expect from Diamond--the table is a tank...great quality. But it seems like the spin doesn't take nearly as well off the cushions and, as a result, I rarely stray more than a tip from center ball anymore because there's no point. The CB doesn't bite like feel it should so I play more dead ball now than I ever have before and mainly just adjust my speed to get the white around the table.

It almost feels like trying to spin the CB off the cushion on a table with new cloth...like once you go beyond a certain point horizontally, it makes no difference in how the CB comes off the cushion and those delicate little soft spin shots off the cushion for position that come up sometimes, like when playing 1p, become more difficult--if not impossible in some cases.

I recently watched some 10 ball matches from Hardtimes that were played on their blue label and it's like night and day, watching the way the CB bites the cushion on that table, compared to the one I play on regularly.

What's the reason for the difference? Is the Diamond at Hardtimes modified in some way? Do all the blue labels that come straight from the factory unmodified play like the one I described that I regularly play on? And what are your thoughts and opinions in general on the red labels vs the blue labels?
Click to expand...


Jesse, just a wild stab: is this a new table from Diamond, delivered and installed by Diamond -- or a used Diamond delivered and installed by someone else?

Lou Figueroa
 
I hate the way the red label banks short! The blue label banks much truer to me, closer to a GC. I know that Mark and Glenn have talked about the difference being the angle of the rails in relation to the ball height contact point is what makes the ball bank funny with the red label. But like someone already posted, the weather, cloth, tightness of the cloth and up keep play a role as well.
 
Any chance the folks from Diamond are reading the forum these days and we can all get the latest info and have them chime in and tell us what the differences are (technically) between the red label and the blue label tables?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
Sauce,

Send an e-mail to Paul Smith of Diamond. Try psmith@diamondbilliardproducts.com. Paul knows lots about how to correctly set up all Diamond tables. Donny Wessels and Glen Hancock are also great go to guys for Diamond in the Southwest.

Is it possible the table you're having problems adjusting to is a Diamond Pro instead of a Pro/Am? The two tables are different in construction and may play slightly different. The Pro model has legs that look similar to a Gold Crown. The Pro/Am has square legs with hidden adjusters. Just a guess.

Lyn
 
Darkridder said:
If i ordered a table from diamond today it wouldn't have any problems right?
Click to expand...

I ordered a table from Diamond in 07 and had no problems. Glen H set mine up and it has played really well since that time. Banks great and I have never looked back.
 
I've played on Diamonds all over the country. My personal opinion is the Blue labels play the most consistent anywhere anytime. The red labels are horrible. I've seen them play long, short and in between. I would only have one if it was free, then I would change the top to Blue.
 
Donny Wessels said:
I put the Diamond table at Hardtimes and recovered it at the same time with 860HR. I pull the rail cloth tight, very tight. The bed-cloth is also tight. The table is stock and hasn't been modified. In southern CA the climate is hot and dry, which makes a difference. Also how the table is maintained will make a difference. Keep in mind your comparing a table your playing on in person to a table your watching on TV and on TV your watching professionals. Try to move the cloth on your table?
Click to expand...

I lived and played in Long Beach and the surrounding areas for five years. The damp, salt ocean air and smog and all, the tables get real dirty and grabby. I've played in rooms with Gold Crowns (not triple shimmed), and if ya hit the ball down the long rail too hard 3 diamonds up from the corner pocket, even if you hit it PERFECT, it still wouldn't go. Every table in every room plays different, unless your in Houston :thumbup: or New Orleans :D or Miami, or MS. :grin-square:
 
peppersauce said:
Maybe this has been discussed, but I wanted to share an experience and get your insight and some opinions.

First, I've always loved Diamond tables. There's just something about them that sets them apart from other manufacturers. And I mean beyond the obvious differences that one can observe by simply looking at the table.

For a long time though, I played on nothing but GCs with very lively rails and loved them. Well, the room I currently play at got rid of their modified GC "pit" table and replaced it with a standard blue label Diamond pro am. Here's where things went south a little for me...this table doesn't play anything like I remember Diamond tables playing. With the exception of the pocket size, cut, and shelf depth--it plays more like an old GC that needs new cushions to me. Granted I always played on red labels, but something is definitely lacking, IMO.

I just assumed it was my mind playing tricks on me since I hadn't played on a Diamond in so long.
However, I recently took a road trip and stopped in a room I had never been in and hit some balls for an hour or so on a red label Diamond. What a breath of fresh air! The whole time I was there I was thinking, "THIS, whatever it is, is what's missing. THIS is the Diamond feel I know and love!" The cushions were so responsive and really had a LOT of "bite". I found myself pulling position shots out of the bag that I had gotten away from and spinning banks in from crazy angles, just because I could on that table. I was having fun!

On the blue label Diamond my pool room switched to, you are somewhat limited in that respect. The table doesn't play bad. It's mostly what I would expect from Diamond--the table is a tank...great quality. But it seems like the spin doesn't take nearly as well off the cushions and, as a result, I rarely stray more than a tip from center ball anymore because there's no point. The CB doesn't bite like feel it should so I play more dead ball now than I ever have before and mainly just adjust my speed to get the white around the table.

It almost feels like trying to spin the CB off the cushion on a table with new cloth...like once you go beyond a certain point horizontally, it makes no difference in how the CB comes off the cushion and those delicate little soft spin shots off the cushion for position that come up sometimes, like when playing 1p, become more difficult--if not impossible in some cases.

I recently watched some 10 ball matches from Hardtimes that were played on their blue label and it's like night and day, watching the way the CB bites the cushion on that table, compared to the one I play on regularly.

What's the reason for the difference? Is the Diamond at Hardtimes modified in some way? Do all the blue labels that come straight from the factory unmodified play like the one I described that I regularly play on? And what are your thoughts and opinions in general on the red labels vs the blue labels?
Click to expand...

The one you described needs the rail bolts tightened;)
 
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