Diamond pro am

cincyman

cincyman

Banned
I have a 9 ft diamond pro am bought brand new in november so it alomost a year old. I would say it gets moderate play.
Tha table is in my garage that i turned into a pool room. 20x21 dry wall ceiling carpet, heating and air. It has a few gaps where the garage doors are but they are small.
Now to my question i have a humidity gauge out there and it generally stays between 40 and 50 percent. On both end rails there are a few spots where the ball will jump off the rail in the air. Its generally in the same spot on both sides of the table.
I checked the cushion and it doesnt seem loose----and some days it is worse than others ----
Why is this. and what can i do to prevent it?
 
cincyman said:
I have a 9 ft diamond pro am bought brand new in november so it alomost a year old. I would say it gets moderate play.
Tha table is in my garage that i turned into a pool room. 20x21 dry wall ceiling carpet, heating and air. It has a few gaps where the garage doors are but they are small.
Now to my question i have a humidity gauge out there and it generally stays between 40 and 50 percent. On both end rails there are a few spots where the ball will jump off the rail in the air. Its generally in the same spot on both sides of the table.
I checked the cushion and it doesnt seem loose----and some days it is worse than others ----
Why is this. and what can i do to prevent it?
Click to expand...
What is the cloth on the table?

Glen
 
cincyman said:
it is tournament blue simonis
I havent talked to diamond yet
Click to expand...
Who do you think answers these type of questions when you call Diamond?...LOL... Where at exactly on the rails are the balls are hopping? Is it close to the corner pockets on the end rails, and side rails? In-other words, halfway between the first Diamond, and the corner pockets? On the foot end rail mostly?

Glen
 
realkingcobra said:
Who do you think answers these type of questions when you call Diamond?...LOL... Where at exactly on the rails are the balls are hopping? Is it close to the corner pockets on the end rails, and side rails? In-other words, halfway between the first Diamond, and the corner pockets? On the foot end rail mostly?

Glen
Click to expand...
It happens close to the corners on the 2 end rails and sometimes close the side pocket on only one rail. It is from the first diamond to the corner,, so from the pocket to the closest diamond to the pocket
 
cincyman said:
It happens close to the corners on the 2 end rails and sometimes close the side pocket on only one rail. It is from the first diamond to the corner,, so from the pocket to the closest diamond to the pocket
Click to expand...
Ok, now we're getting somewhere...:D Have you had the table recovered lately, or is it still the factory cloth? I have a few minutes before I take off for Salt Lake City to deliver Mike Massey's Gabriel's 10ft billiards table:( so I'll try to explain more than likely what is up with your rails. First of all, you more than likely hear the ball hop instead of seeing it. Now, if I'm right with that assumption, the cause of that more than likely is do to the installer that recovered the rails. What happens sometimes, is when an inexperienced installer is stapling the cloth on the rails, as they get closer to the pocket they have a tendency to pull the cloth tighter to get rid of any loose cloth, or so they think. In pulling the cloth more tighter as they get closer to the pocket end of the rail, they are in fact pulling the point of the cushion downward with the cloth as they staple the cloth to the rail, thus causing the cushion to be slightly low at that spot, combine that with humidity causing the cloth and balls to somewhat sticky, you get that slight little ball hop as the balls are coming off the rail at that one spot. You can correct this by cleaning the balls, cleaning the cloth, and...take an object ball, rub it hard enough against the cushion at the point where it hops causing the cushion to sort of lift up a little in order to sort of pull against the rail cloth. What you're trying to do is make the rail rubber shift a little under the cloth, causing it to release the hold of the cloth against the nose of the cushion. You have Artemus Intercontinental rubber on your table so the problem is not with the rubber, it's with the cloth.
Glen
 
Glen hit the nail on the first shot,I was betting on a thread under the cloth untrill I reread your post . Most installers still do it today because customers and installers worry about wrinkles and not the playability of the table.
All rookies do it even I did it for awhile till players pointed out what they liked and didnt like from my work 10 years ago and what other installers have done in the past; thats how we learn and perfect our SKILL as in Installer/mechanic instead af an assembler of tables
 
n10spool said:
Glen hit the nail on the first shot,I was betting on a thread under the cloth untrill I reread your post . Most installers still do it today because customers and installers worry about wrinkles and not the playability of the table.
All rookies do it even I did it for awhile till players pointed out what they liked and didnt like from my work 10 years ago and what other installers have done in the past; thats how we learn and perfect our SKILL as in Installer/mechanic instead af an assembler of tables
Click to expand...
I tried giving you a rep point, but AZ posted a message that said I have to spread them around first before I can give you another point..LMAO:D

Glen
 
I don't know what the problem with my giving out rep points is, I've given out 3 points in the last year...ROTFLMAO:D :D :D

Glen
 
realkingcobra said:
Ok, now we're getting somewhere...:D Have you had the table recovered lately, or is it still the factory cloth? I have a few minutes before I take off for Salt Lake City to deliver Mike Massey's Gabriel's 10ft billiards table:( so I'll try to explain more than likely what is up with your rails. First of all, you more than likely hear the ball hop instead of seeing it. Now, if I'm right with that assumption, the cause of that more than likely is do to the installer that recovered the rails. What happens sometimes, is when an inexperienced installer is stapling the cloth on the rails, as they get closer to the pocket they have a tendency to pull the cloth tighter to get rid of any loose cloth, or so they think. In pulling the cloth more tighter as they get closer to the pocket end of the rail, they are in fact pulling the point of the cushion downward with the cloth as they staple the cloth to the rail, thus causing the cushion to be slightly low at that spot, combine that with humidity causing the cloth and balls to somewhat sticky, you get that slight little ball hop as the balls are coming off the rail at that one spot. You can correct this by cleaning the balls, cleaning the cloth, and...take an object ball, rub it hard enough against the cushion at the point where it hops causing the cushion to sort of lift up a little in order to sort of pull against the rail cloth. What you're trying to do is make the rail rubber shift a little under the cloth, causing it to release the hold of the cloth against the nose of the cushion. You have Artemus Intercontinental rubber on your table so the problem is not with the rubber, it's with the cloth.
Glen
Click to expand...
It is 100 percent seen not heard the ball on thin cuts will almost hit me in the mouth. i have never had the table recovered it was done at the diamond factory less than a year ago. my dad and i just played and it oured outside and it was more noticable than before. What can i do to stop this ? and do the diamond cushions really play that tight it seems like the ball comes off way shorter than normal?
 
realkingcobra said:
I have a few minutes before I take off for Salt Lake City to deliver Mike Massey's Gabriel's 10ft billiards table
Click to expand...

You're supposed to be in Chicago - or did you ferget? :D
 
cincyman said:
It also seems to me to have just started doing it as well
Click to expand...
Then I want you to take a square, put it up against the cushion, and tell me what the point of the cushion reads in relationship to the slate. I want to know how high the point of ball contact is, because from what you're telling me, the point of the rubber is low, that's the only way you can get a ball to bounce like you're talking about. So, either the cushions were mounted low, in which case, the rails would have been hoping from day one, and I know the Diamond workers don't mount the cushions low, OR...the rail rubber has come unglued, which in most cases, it's caused by a table having a ball return system, because when you reach down to retrieve the balls from the ball box, you unknowingly grab a hold of the cushion to pull yourself back up as you place the balls on the table to rack them, and where you grab the rail to stand up is by the outer diamonds on the end rail. Make sure you measure the point of the cushion all the way across, from pocket to pocket, then tell me what the low point is, and where it's at. There are no other reasons that a ball will hop off the rails, other than what I described.

It's probably a dumb question, but I have to ask it. What cue ball are you playing with, the red circle, or an over-sized cue ball from a bar table?

Glen
 
realkingcobra said:
Then I want you to take a square, put it up against the cushion, and tell me what the point of the cushion reads in relationship to the slate. I want to know how high the point of ball contact is, because from what you're telling me, the point of the rubber is low, that's the only way you can get a ball to bounce like you're talking about. So, either the cushions were mounted low, in which case, the rails would have been hoping from day one, and I know the Diamond workers don't mount the cushions low, OR...the rail rubber has come unglued, which in most cases, it's caused by a table having a ball return system, because when you reach down to retrieve the balls from the ball box, you unknowingly grab a hold of the cushion to pull yourself back up as you place the balls on the table to rack them, and where you grab the rail to stand up is by the outer diamonds on the end rail. Make sure you measure the point of the cushion all the way across, from pocket to pocket, then tell me what the low point is, and where it's at. There are no other reasons that a ball will hop off the rails, other than what I described.

It's probably a dumb question, but I have to ask it. What cue ball are you playing with, the red circle, or an over-sized cue ball from a bar table?

Glen
Click to expand...
Well i talked to a knowledeable heating and air guy and he said that when it gets humid the cloth might pull the rubber down a hair and make the ball jump. The cushions are definetely all the same height and none are loose. It only happens when it is humid or wet, but my other question is WHY only my table. I have played on 1000 new diamonds and even in wet conditions the rails dont jump
 
It only happens when it is humid or wet, but my other question is WHY only my table. I have played on 1000 new diamonds and even in wet conditions the rails dont jump[/QUOTE]

You don't have the only table effected by humidity, dirty cloth, dirty balls. I've played on Diamonds, Brunswick's, Olhausen's, Connelly's...you name it. They ALL are effected by the above mentioned.

Now, back to my questions, what is the height of the cushions, and what cue ball are you playing with? If you can't answer these questions, it's pointless to continue on with this discussion.

Glen
 
cincyman said:
Well i talked to a knowledeable heating and air guy and he said that when it gets humid the cloth might pull the rubber down a hair and make the ball jump.
Click to expand...

Are you/he suggesting the cloth gets tighter with increaded humidity? :confused:
I think your hvac guy should stick to hvac.
 
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