Difficult Situation

JIM...that fryer idea is really a very good one for rooms that

JimS said:
Dave comes on here with serious concerns and the response is talk about grease fryers and vegitarian stuff. Wtf is up with that? Why not leave that crap for some forum other than the room owners forum and get back to trying to help Blackjack with his attempts to make a living. Can't you guys see he's facing a MAJOR crisis?
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cannot have a kitchen.
There is a room near me that really was not in a position to open a kitchen and they got one of these self enclosed fryers. I know it has added to their bottom line. They also sell coffee. I mean good coffee, none of that weak burned sock water stuff.
Lattes, expressos and the like.
ruk
 
I don't mean to be harsh here, but I'm going to say what I'm sure alot of people who've read your post are probably thinking. What the hell do you expect???

I've previously run a pool hall for five years, and I've been a player all my life.

I can't conceive why anyone would think you even deserve to make a living running a pool hall. You talk about your customers with such disdain that it's no wonder you have no business. You seem to have the attitude that the customers are stupid for not thinking that they can have a great time in your room.

You have no food, no liquor, no pro shop. I would imagine that aside from the tables there are no other quality amenities (video games, digital jukebox), etc.

The bottom line is it's a dog-eat-dog world. The "players" who put the word out on you for charging them table time 100% of the time didn't do that arbitrarily - they did it because someone esle out there isn't charging them. And when they left, the tournaments went downhill right? How much were you adding? Were you adding as much as the pool hall down the street?

And the league teams... First of all I'd never join a league team that plays out of a place with no food. Most league players are blue-collar joes who work hard and once or twice a week they rush straight from work to the bar or pool hall to play league - I'm sure they'd like to have something to eat, not to mention a good stiff drink.

My pool hall always gave each team a free drink. The league players thought they were getting over on us because they'd order a jack and coke even though they'd been drinking beer all night. Do they realize the shot of jack cost about the same as a beer? No. They just knew it was free.

And have you ever tried putting in some big speakers and a digital jukebox. Even splitting the money with the amusement company, my jukebox pulled in 2500 per month!! Mostly from the teeny boppers on Saturday nights who would play the same crap over and over again.

Sorry Jack, but the days of the bottled beer only, no kitchen, no-nonsense pool rooms are a thing of the past. Adapt or perish.
 
Just some general comments -
When in competition with other locations it's wise to do your homework and determine what they offer the customer. With that in mind you need to then figure out what you can do better given whatever limitations you have i.e., no kitchen, no liquor, etc. or what you can capitalize on i.e. better equipment. When faced with choices (where to play tonight) I think customers will lean towards whoever is offering the better deal, better atmosphere, better equipment, higher tourny payout, cheaper rates and so on. In essence examine your weaknesses and improve them and do all you can to capitalize on your strengths. Simply put, walk inside your own door and ask yourself - why would I want to spend my money here.
 
Know where you're comin' from

Reading your post, all I could think about was "I could have written this". I own 2 rooms and have similar problems. Some of the things that I have done that have helped are:

One of my rooms doesn't have a kitchen (or serves alcohol). Food is important. If someone comes in to play and they're hungry, they'll leave if you don't have anything to offer. I have a small (cheap) microwave oven and a very small (1-1/2' x 1-1/2') pizza oven and a small refrigerator/freezer. We serve microwave burgers, rib sandwiches, chicken sandwiches, hotdogs and pizzas. We buy them all at a local wholesale club (BJs). The idea isn't so much to make a profit off of the food (although we do). The idea is to keep people in the room. The food is actually pretty good.

Same Room - On Tuesdays, we do a Ladies night. All females can play all night for $5.00 and I worked out a deal with my juke box vendor that the juke box would be free on Tuesdays. I also offer "free" instruction on Tuesdays. People can come up to me and ask how to make different shots or how to draw a ball, etc. If you can get the girls in, the guys will follow.

Same Room- We established an in-house league on Thursday nights. It consists of 2-person teams. Each team plays one 8-ball & one 9-ball match. We typically have about 16 - 20 teams. We charge $5.00 table time & $5.00 dues, which is paid out in prize money.

Other Room - We do serve alcohol (not a full liquor license) and we have a full kitchen.

On Tuesdays, we do "Free Pool". Each player is required to spend at least $5.00 in food or beverage. That change turned Tuesday, from my slowest night to my 3rd busiest. Understandably, that would not work real well at my other room, but you do, at least, serve beer.

On Sunday and Thursday nights, we do a "Free Texas Hold'em Tournament". I have an outfit that comes in, sets up the poker tables and runs the tourney. It costs me $150.00 per night. We typically draw about 40-50 players (if you can't beat 'em, join 'em).

This is a really great forum. You don't often get a chance to speak with other room owners and when you do (if they're local) they don't want to share their secrets.

Good Luck
 
I have mentioned this in another post, but I threw in the towel on April 1 - and I have returned to Central Florida (Kissimmee).

In El Paso, I was in business with somebody that was unwilling to take the risks necessary to turn the business into a profit making venture. We were not on the same page of music. In the past I was very successful with that SAME business. My partner was the main reason I left. I had an out clause that I exercised - I lost my entire investment - but I would rather be out now than to suffer the consequences in 6 months when the business folds due to incompetence. That's all I will say about that. I think I made the right decision to leave and I have no regrets.

I really appreciate the people that gave some incredible ideas for me to try out. It was also comforting to know that I was not alone with my attitude or with the problems I was facing in the day to day operations of the business.

To the poster that claimed I had a pissy attitude, said he made over $2500on his juke box, gave away free stuff to the leagues while still making money hand over fist, etc, etc, - I will say that I have talked to room owners all over the country and nobody else is having as much success. I'm not saying its BS, I'm just saying that its not the norm, and I have talked to well over 30 room owners. Rooms are going out of business at an alarming rate. Running a pool hall is not easy these days. Increase in overhead has forced room owners to raise prices and that has driven customers away. Most of the rooms in Orlando charge $10 an hour per player after 4PM - because they HAVE to. In El Paso it was not much better. Room owners know what I am taking about and why the rates are so high and out of reach for many people. As far as my bad attitude towards players, it is shared by those that know better - and FWIW I am a player. As a player, I am embarrassed by the freeloading idiots that refuse to support pool, pool halls, and business owners. Those people suck. I refused to kiss the asses of people that came into my room trying to get everything for free. Those people are worthless to any business (not just mine), whether or not you agree with my attitude. To the people that came in and supported my business, helped keep the lights and the a/c on, I was extremely grateful.

This is a funny time for room owners. Many are giving in to the new poker craze - I think its a bad move - but many room owners have no choice but to give the customers what they want to keep their doors open. In some rooms there are more people playing poker than pool, yet I've never heard about anybody opening up a poker hall.

I am now in Florida and I will concentrate on coaching and instruction. If another opportunity to run/own a pool hall was placed before me, I would not hesitate to take it, work my ass off, and do my very best as always.

Once again, thank you to everybody that responded.
 
FWIW, I'm sorry to hear this. You sounded like the type of owner I would go out of my way to help. There is a top level pool hall, meanig mostly equipment, I go to here at times, but not alot anymore due to the owner's attitude and personality. I'd rather go to a place that it is glad to see me rather than a place that acts like I don't exist.

Good luck to you.
 
rukiddingme said:
cannot have a kitchen.
There is a room near me that really was not in a position to open a kitchen and they got one of these self enclosed fryers. I know it has added to their bottom line. They also sell coffee. I mean good coffee, none of that weak burned sock water stuff.
Lattes, expressos and the like.
ruk
Click to expand...
This is a premium idea...quick food makes good money in a pool hall...the Brickyard Pub in Battle Creek, MI does a jamup business with their hamburgers, chicken strips and such fair...they have a full bar now but if you can get liquor (you didn't state if you could or not) do very well with that...they don't give no free pool time as does no one in Michigan...every table was full on Friday when I was there last...

As for the freeloaders F 'em...you're the only gig in town as far as pool halls go...run some specials but don't give nothing for free...either they'll come back or new ones will replace them...Also this place is in El Paso?? What other city are they going to travel too??
 
I was a room owner with 18GCs and a small bar. Its very hard to say what would be your best plan of attack to regenerate business without seeing your layout.

If your storefront faces an indoor mall area, how about a large size lcd TV showing through the window some looping video of trickshot tapes, or 3 cushion magic tapes. Something to grab their attention as they pass. I also would consider a name change along with changing the look of the outside. This alone may bring a surprising number of new faces coming in to see what the room is like. It important that their first impression is one of comfort and safety.

IMO keep music at a comfortable level. In my room I'd rather put bat to the jukebox than let it blast patrons. Take care that the content of what is in the jukebox is not obscene. I also had a casual dress code that I was strick with. No tank tops for men, no bare feet, that kind of thing. IMO anyone who comes in looking like a slob is most likely a slob. Who wants em anyway.

Family hours on early weekend opening times at very reduced rates. (Notice I said family and not kids) Offer the sale of some line of cues that will generate some nice revenue. Offer "X" number of hours free pool with the purchase of a new cue. Perhaps base the number of hours relative to the cues value. Offer group lessons also to those family patrons.

Make the room comfortable for women to come in. Ask women what they would like to hear or see when they come in. If women like being in the room, men will like to be there as well.

I've played in a ton of rooms and its not unusual to see a couple walk in to play, pause and turn and leave. Its the kind of things that trigger that sensation in new patrons that you have to be sensitive to.

good luck.
 
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