Double elimination finals: even race or?

[jdott]

EDIT: just realized I messed up the last option in the poll, though I'm not sure it really matters much, but it should read, "SET i: winner needs 3, loser only needs 2; SET ii: race to 2"
(basically the last two options are for an UNeven race in the finals)

I'd like some votes and opinions on this.

For purposes of the vote, please assume this is a true double elimination where the losers side has to beat the winners side twice.

With that in mind, there's a double elim tournament with a race to 3 on the winners side, and race to 2 on the losers side. In the finals is it an even race for each set / match? or have you seen a handicapped race of sorts?

 

[336Robin]

I'd like some votes and opinions on this.

For purposes of the vote, please assume this is a true double elimination where the losers side has to beat the winners side twice.

With that in mind, there's a double elim tournament with a race to 3 on the winners side, and race to 2 on the losers side. In the finals is it an even race for each set / match? or have you seen a handicapped race of sorts?

Some details about the tournament would help. Too many choices not enough information in my opinion.

 

[jdott]

Hmm. I'm not sure what else I can add, but hopefully this helps:

It's a true double elimination 9-ball tournament. Race to 3 on the winners side, race to 2 on the losers side. It pays 1st-3rd.

 

[BRussell]

Hmm. I'm not sure what else I can add, but hopefully this helps:

It's a true double elimination 9-ball tournament. Race to 3 on the winners side, race to 2 on the losers side. It pays 1st-3rd.

You asked whether the finals should be handicapped, but you didn't say whether the rest of the tournament was handicapped. That's probably the only relevant information as to whether the finals should be handicapped.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I have never seen anything other than scratch matches in the finals of a scratch tournament. The only way that makes sense to me is if the format is changed to a single final match and the winner's-side finalist starts with some games on the wire to give roughly the same advantage as a double-win requirement for the other player.

 

[jdott]

You asked whether the finals should be handicapped, but you didn't say whether the rest of the tournament was handicapped. That's probably the only relevant information as to whether the finals should be handicapped.

No handicaps. This came up, because the person I played in the finals told me that he only had to win twice the first set (he was on the winners side), and I had to win three on the first set since I was on the losers side. Then if I won the first set, of course we would play the second set, but shocker I had it 2-1, and he took the fourth game in the first set, so he "won" ...

I didn't make a big deal about it, but since this is an ongoing tournament, I want to make sure I'm correct in thinking that an uneven race was complete BS, so that next time I can tell the person running it that we do even races throughout, or I'm not going to do it at all.

I left this info out, b/c I don't want to sway the vote here, and I don't want to start any drama if they happen to see this post. I really just want to know though if anyone has ever seen that or thinks it's at all fair before I make a stand at the next event heh.

 

[Poodle of Doom]

Hmm. I'm not sure what else I can add, but hopefully this helps:

It's a true double elimination 9-ball tournament. Race to 3 on the winners side, race to 2 on the losers side. It pays 1st-3rd.

We do this for both 8 ball and 9 ball. It works just fine.

 

[BRussell]

No handicaps. This came up, because the person I played in the finals told me that he only had to win twice the first set (he was on the winners side), and I had to win three on the first set since I was on the losers side. Then if I won the first set, of course we would play the second set, but shocker I had it 2-1, and he took the fourth game in the first set, so he "won" ...

I didn't make a big deal about it, but since this is an ongoing tournament, I want to make sure I'm correct in thinking that an uneven race was complete BS, so that next time I can tell the person running it that we do even races throughout, or I'm not going to do it at all.

I left this info out, b/c I don't want to sway the vote here, and I don't want to start any drama if they happen to see this post. I really just want to know though if anyone has ever seen that or thinks it's at all fair before I make a stand at the next event heh.

Oh I see. Pretty funny. If you want to be technical about it like he was trying to be, since he was still on the winner's side HE should have to race to 3 and you were on the loser's side so you should only have needed 2. :grin: Then the second match would be 2-2.

But no I would vote for 3-3 first match and 2-2 second.

 

[jdott]

haha exactly! That's what I said too, but really I just thought an even race made the most sense overall.

 

[Maniac]

I think the finals should always be one set, and longer than the normal sets during the rest of the tournament. Since you were using a winner's side race to three, I would have made the finals a single race to five.

It's tough enough to have to work your way through the B side and then have to win two sets to take the cheese.

Just my opinion.


Maniac

 

[sbpoolleague]

IMO the only reason to handicap the final match (in an otherwise non-handicapped tourney) is so that you can end the tourney (quicker) with a single match instead of using true double elimination. In that case I would say that having the loser-side player race to 3 and the winners-side player race to 2 IN A SINGLE MATCH FINAL would be more than fair.

To speed up a tourney I frequently use modified single/double elim brackets where the final 4 on the loser side (for example) jump back to the winners side, and play moves on single elimination from there on out. To quiet the grumbles from the winners bracket players who have yet to lose, I usually have a fixed amount of "extra" money that gets paid out to all players still on the winners side when the tourney switches from double to single elimination.

 

[garczar]

.......................................

 

[Poodle of Doom]

Oh I see. Pretty funny. If you want to be technical about it like he was trying to be, since he was still on the winner's side HE should have to race to 3 and you were on the loser's side so you should only have needed 2. :grin: Then the second match would be 2-2.

But no I would vote for 3-3 first match and 2-2 second.

Again, this is also what we do for 8 ball and 9 ball. When the last two play, the loser (possible second place) is playing on the winners side. If the winner wins three, match done. Winner takes first, losers side goes home in second. If loser wins three, then winner is now on losers side. It becomes a race to two. Winner is in first, loser in second.

 

[jdott]

Again, this is also what we do for 8 ball and 9 ball. When the last two play, the loser (possible second place) is playing on the winners side. If the winner wins three, match done. Winner takes first, losers side goes home in second. If loser wins three, then winner is now on losers side. It becomes a race to two. Winner is in first, loser in second.

Yep that makes sense. True double elim, and an even race in each finals set, continuing the theme of the race that was used throughout the tournament.