Dress Code for Gold Crown Billiards, Erie, PA

JoeyA said:
Mike,

It sounds like you have a great mixture of your local community supporting your business and it is easy to see why that is so, knowing you and seeing photos of your business.

However, I'm genuinely curious. How many of these customers of yours have their pants hanging off the cheeks of their butt, showing the 90 degree smile or pulling up on their pants on every shot just to keep their pants from falling to their knees? (You know what I mean, the gangsta style of wearing their trousers without belts and just making a spectacle of themselves).
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JoeyA - There is a lot of disturbing clothing. It's winter and two decent looking young men come in wearing winter coats. My place is busy so I can only give them a table next to two thirty-something couples out for the evening. Ten minutes pass and I look over to see a T-shirt on one of the guys that has an unacceptable picture of a woman with the following verbiage in bold letters" NO MORE MISTER NICE GUY. DOWN ON YOUR KNEES BI**H ". This would be OK in a poolroom that has no dress code? OK, I won't judge his character but you can be sure, I did send him packing.
 
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JoeyA said:
Mike,

It sounds like you have a great mixture of your local community supporting your business and it is easy to see why that is so, knowing you and seeing photos of your business.

However, I'm genuinely curious. How many of these customers of yours have their pants hanging off the cheeks of their butt, showing the 90 degree smile or pulling up on their pants on every shot just to keep their pants from falling to their knees? (You know what I mean, the gangsta style of wearing their trousers without belts and just making a spectacle of themselves).
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None.

Maybe it's just too cold here for the butt-cheek exposure thing.
 
I think you should boot people out based on their behavior or something overtly biased on their clothes. Your best customer might not like skinny jeans and tighter shirts but you won't give them a chance based on that criteria? Since when does slacks and shoes mean you behave well?

I have family in Erie, PA. My mother is buried their. I know there is a good side of town and a bad side of town but troublemakers come in all shapes and sizes, so do good customers.
 
Just to play Devil's Advocate, one of the items you have listed is "Satanic T-Shirts." Has this caused any problems? I only ask because in the Civil Rights Act, business owners are prohibited from discriminating (refusing service) based on "Race, Nationality, Religion..." and I have heard of cases involving similar issues.

Since Satanism is a religion, you could get some person (very rare, they may just do it to "push the boundaries" even) come in with a pentagram on a t-shirt, and if someone with a Crucifix on a shirt happens to be there....if service is refused to the "Satanist" that could turn into a big battle.

Like I said, I'm just playing Devil's Advocate (pun not intended, but amusing). Have you encountered any such situation? If you did, how did (or would) you react?

Cheers, sir!

- Lou
 
I can understand most of your dress code. Its always a good idea to keep gang activity out of a public place. I don't think I would be able to play at your place though. I wear jeans most of the time and I work in them so they get torn. I also wear my work shoes just about everywhere I play. Playing in my work shoes is mandatory for me. Pool is work if you want to play it right. Plus Im a working guy on a limited budget, so if the edges of my pants leg gets a little ragged, I can still be in style. It seems a little self righteous to have so many rules for dress that have nothing to do with gangs. Especially for an activity that is supposed to be fun and relaxing. Do you have a no gambling sign that is strictly enforced? What about the women? Are thongs ok? Mini skirts? How about v-neck shirts and sweaters for the women? If being being the clothes morality sheriff is the standard, we should also expect no foul language, no gambling, no rock and roll and being closed on Sunday. Sounds a little too uptight and religious for a pool room. Dignity doesn't come from the clothes you wear, it comes from how you treat others and how they treat you.
Automatically judging someone before they come in the door seems harsh.
 
Your rules are much too strict, in my opinion, but I suppose you have to do what you feel is right. It is, after all, your room.
Having said that, if I were invited to play there I wouldn't.
 
DonLou52 said:
Just to play Devil's Advocate, one of the items you have listed is "Satanic T-Shirts." Has this caused any problems? I only ask because in the Civil Rights Act, business owners are prohibited from discriminating (refusing service) based on "Race, Nationality, Religion..." and I have heard of cases involving similar issues.

Since Satanism is a religion, you could get some person (very rare, they may just do it to "push the boundaries" even) come in with a pentagram on a t-shirt, and if someone with a Crucifix on a shirt happens to be there....if service is refused to the "Satanist" that could turn into a big battle.

Like I said, I'm just playing Devil's Advocate (pun not intended, but amusing). Have you encountered any such situation? If you did, how did (or would) you react?

Cheers, sir!

- Lou
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I am reasonably sure that civil rights legislation does not cover religion. We are not Nazis. We are not heavy handed. We do not scan the facility for dress code violations. We have a good place with good people going on 33 years and we want to keep it that way. It is just good business.
 
And now for another dress code episode:

A young man came in wearing blue jeans that were more holes than jeans. Really! There were all these horizontal rips up and down both legs. I did not understand what kept these jeans from disintegrating. I explained the dress code and he left without incident.

A half hour later he was back with no less than 50 little safety pins decorating his jeans. He made an comical attempt at closing all the holes with the pins. It was wise guy funny. I had to let him play.
 
Paul,
When are you going to update your website? The about us and history section is just filled with unreadable gibberish.
 
Paul Schofield said:
And now for another dress code episode:

A young man came in wearing blue jeans that were more holes than jeans. Really! There were all these horizontal rips up and down both legs. I did not understand what kept these jeans from disintegrating. I explained the dress code and he left without incident.

A half hour later he was back with no less than 50 little safety pins decorating his jeans. He made an comical attempt at closing all the holes with the pins. It was wise guy funny. I had to let him play.
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Geeze, and I thought I would have liked your pool room. You're too easy.
 
So would you let a priest in ?

Paul Schofield said:
I disagree. It most certainly does. We communicate in many ways and one of those ways is with attire. Not only do words have meaning, manners have meaning, conduct has meaning, and yes, clothes have meaning too.

When a man walks with his chest puffed out, all leathered-out with a muscle shirt, bandanna, and black boots on, I get his message. He does not have to say a thing.
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Priest's wear uniforms ,but I guess you'd let one of them in well of coarse that is if there arn't any young boys around. You can't make a blanket judgement about everyone buy what they wear but that seems like what you are trying to do.
 
I can't believe this thread is still going on. I would imagine that the dress code also goes with common sense. If a person walked in wearing jeans that looked clean and he or she presented themselves as upstanding Paul would have no problem letting them play.His code is to keep out undesirable's. Not your average working man.At least thats what i believe it does.
 
But the main question is, do you allow CTE?
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We do not discriminate against anyone who is CHALLENGED.
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Touche! And Pockets goes down in flames once again.

Part of being witty is also making sure you don't leave yourself open for a sucker punch, like that one.
Good one Mr. Paul.

On a side note, I noticed that in some of the pics that Paul had, there were people playing that had sweat shirts/team shirts and base ball caps on.
I'm thinking that the dress code is not that strictly enforced at times. Its just there in case some knob decides to push the outer limits.

I've also seen people, guys mostly that were dressed to the nines act like complete imbeciles after a few drinks and guys that looked like they just crawled out of a dumpster (clothes wise) that were friendly and respectful.
I guess one shouldn't judge a book by its cover.

"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged". Unless you happen to be in court at the time. That saying doesn't work well when you crack it to a judge.
 
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bobroberts said:
I can't believe this thread is still going on. I would imagine that the dress code also goes with common sense. If a person walked in wearing jeans that looked clean and he or she presented themselves as upstanding Paul would have no problem letting them play.His code is to keep out undesirable's. Not your average working man.At least thats what i believe it does.
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Bob - You are exactly right. We are not the Iron Hand. We want and need to do business. We are looking for ways to attract and keep good customers. I hope I have not given the impression that we are "down your throat", looking for confrontation. That is not ther case at all. We are in the recreation business.
 
Baby PacMan said:
I took a page out of Irving Crane's book, you'll never see me near a pool table without a suit, even at home. Anything less would be uncivilized.
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I find this very interesting. Irving Crane performed one of his final (maybe his final) exhibitions in my place in 1981. To this day, some of my older clientele view that day as a "spiritual" billiard experiance. It was not an ego-maniacal show. He taught us about respect. He showed us by his dress, choice of words, and conduct, a respect for himself, for us, and his profession. It is something that none of us will ever forget.

I always equated it to Ronald Regan who would never enter the Oval Office without a suit (even on his day off).
 
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Originally Posted by Baby PacMan
I took a page out of Irving Crane's book, you'll never see me near a pool table without a suit, even at home. Anything less would be uncivilized.

I find this very interesting. Irving Crane performed one of his final (maybe his final) exhibitions in my place in 1981. To this day, some of my older clientele view that day as a "spiritual" billiard experiance. It was not an ego-maniacal show. He taught us about respect. He showed us by his dress, choice of words, and conduct, a respect for himself, for us, and his profession. It is something that none of us will ever forget.

I always equated it to Ronald Regan who would never enter the Oval Office without a suit (even on his day off).

I dug this picture out from 30 years ago. This might stir some memories for some of you.
 

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itsfroze said:
Priest's wear uniforms ,but I guess you'd let one of them in well of coarse that is if there arn't any young boys around. You can't make a blanket judgement about everyone buy what they wear but that seems like what you are trying to do.
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Not at all. You can be a boy persuing priest or anything else for that matter. Just abide by the dress code.
 
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