Elbow Drop Discussion

Spimp13

Spimp13

O8 Specialist
Silver Member
After reviewing multiple videos within the last year, I notice I do a lot of elbow dropping. It seems to be more on open hand bridge firm 3-5 speed shots, but I noticed it big time on my break, as well as some closed hand bridge shots.

I saw this thread from about a year and a half ago which briefly talked about it.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=135565&highlight=elbow

I don't seem to have a tight grip (except on my break shot), so I am not thinking that is part of the problem. I don't really care for my stance either which I am going to examine, but I think that has no bearing on this. After discussing it last weekend at school with a buddy, we were almost thinking it how my wrist is following through to the finish. My knuckles almost never point up, even when I hit my chest on the finish.

Thoughts on correcting this not so great habit? Anyone on here tried Mika's wrist glove product? I am wondering if this would be worth it.
 
Spimp13 said:
After reviewing multiple videos within the last year, I notice I do a lot of elbow dropping. ...
Click to expand...
Here is an article about elbow motion, and here is another article.

It's really, really hard for anyone to diagnose mechanics problems like this through a screen. I think your best bet is to find a local instructor who can do video recording to see how bad your problem is and work on suggestions.

As it happens, I'll be in West Des Moines on October 7th in case you'd like someone to look at your problem.
 
Bob Jewett said:
Here is an article about elbow motion, and here is another article.

It's really, really hard for anyone to diagnose mechanics problems like this through a screen. I think your best bet is to find a local instructor who can do video recording to see how bad your problem is and work on suggestions.

As it happens, I'll be in West Des Moines on October 7th in case you'd like someone to look at your problem.
Click to expand...

Thanks Bob, we did just do a video at the last school follow up about a week ago, and I am sure Randy can add his 2 cents here. For sure it happened in that video on the open hand bridge higher speed follow shots as the tip was not down on the follow through. The higher speed shots do a good job point out mechanical errors, that is for sure! I will PM you my # as I should be around then if you are out and about and want to meet up for a bit. At first I was thinking possibly too tight of a grip, but for the most part I do keep my pinky off my cue helping to not have the oh so bad death grip.

Here is one video from awhile back.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0ydS3YUiIs

This is an older video but at 1:00, 1:25, and 2:05 big time on this one....the thing that is puzzline on the 2:05 one is I am finished hitting my chest. This is where the knuckles never seem to go up, even with a finish.


Edit: I will be potentially changing my stance a bit too....not very stable.
 
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Hi Spimp,

with Randy you already have *caught* one of the best-gratz for that^^

in the video you posted it seems to me, that your stance doesn t seem to be very stable and relaxed- perhaps i m wrong- do just i have seen this? If so, sorry then:) ( im not talking about the *perfect stance*-but imo it has to be rockstable)

lg
Ingo
 
Ratta said:
Hi Spimp,

with Randy you already have *caught* one of the best-gratz for that^^

in the video you posted it seems to me, that your stance doesn t seem to be very stable and relaxed- perhaps i m wrong- do just i have seen this? If so, sorry then:) ( im not talking about the *perfect stance*-but imo it has to be rockstable)

lg
Ingo
Click to expand...

Thanks for the post. It does not seem very comfortable/stable so I need to examine this as well. I am thinking this isn't necessarily effecting the elbow drop, but it is something else that bugs me.
 
Spimp,

a comfortable and stable stance is extremly important- it will make many things much easier for you bc your alignment begins with your *personal setup*...this is also something that have to be included in your routines and to do this without thinkin about it.


when i was playing in the billiard-salon i used to play in the 80 s, i was training solo. Old big Sigi (world-champion cadre 47/2 in the past) came along and was grinning like a stoned horse- i just looked at him and wondered. then he asked me *you feel well while playin?* and i answered *sure*. Then he gave me a real *baby-hug<+ from the side ...............and i sit on my ass, lol^^. Right after that i prefered to work on stance-helped me a ton!

lg
ingo
 
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i didnt necessarily think Elbow Drop was the issue. but rather, the stillness of the upper arm while the elbow operates as a hinge.

perhaps i am mistaken though???

DCP
 
His stroke looked just fine to me......It would be better to see a more fluid and natural timing to the strokes but it thats probably what your working on. A good timing method if your having smoothness problems is to stroke in and out along with your breathing. Its a great natural timer...and can also help to keep your mind centered
on the table



As far as your elbow drop is concerned....I don't believe there is any concern. As your not dropping the elbow untill after contact past 90º. That and its only dropping at most from what i saw a few inches.

Your biggest issue as stated by others and yourself is your stance.

You need to get rid of the double bent knees....it tires you out and its not stable.
Back leg straight and front leg with a little bend.

Instead of stepping forward with the front foot so much send it a little more to your left. Try and have your front heel of your shoe in line with the middle of your other foot while the feet are at a minimum shoulder length apart. Back leg straight, small bend to relax the front leg.


You will probably need to spread your legs out a little more the lower you want to get on the shot. That will drop your center of gravity as opposed to bending both your knees to get the proper elevation on the shot.

go watch these two videos and read the link to the post on this forum.
http://www.youtube.com/user/forcefollow#p/a/u/1/5u52gKAehqo
http://www.youtube.com/user/forcefollow#p/a/u/0/3uZCcKEJZjc

try the stance and line up techniques and see if it helps you out some.

best wishes,
-Grey Ghost
 
Keeb...While it is true that IF the elbow doesn't begin to move until after contact with the CB, it will not hinder the shooter from accurate contact with the CB, it is also true that the elbow movement doesn't contribute anything positive to the outcome of the shot. Hence it is merely complicating the timing of the swing. Matt only drops his elbow on high speed shots, and he just needs to mentally "realize" that he doesn't really need that extra movement, to eliminate it from his process. Also, whether the elbow moves up or down, an inch or a foot, means that the shoulder is initiating the swing (muscle), which, again, just complicates the process.

As far as his stance goes, there is nothing wrong with standing with bent legs. How you stand at the table is a matter of comfort, balance, and free movement of the cuestick, along your range of motion. Bent knees or straight leg...it simply doesn't matter. It's individual preference. While some shooters might get fatigued from a bent knee stance, others are very comfortable with it.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

greyghost said:
As far as your elbow drop is concerned....I don't believe there is any concern. As your not dropping the elbow untill after contact past 90º. That and its only dropping at most from what i saw a few inches.

Your biggest issue as stated by others and yourself is your stance.

You need to get rid of the double bent knees....it tires you out and its not stable.
Back leg straight and front leg with a little bend.

Instead of stepping forward with the front foot so much send it a little more to your left. Try and have your front heel of your shoe in line with the middle of your other foot while the feet are at a minimum shoulder length apart. Back leg straight, small bend to relax the front leg.


You will probably need to spread your legs out a little more the lower you want to get on the shot. That will drop your center of gravity as opposed to bending both your knees to get the proper elevation on the shot.

go watch these two videos and read the link to the post on this forum.
http://www.youtube.com/user/forcefollow#p/a/u/1/5u52gKAehqo
http://www.youtube.com/user/forcefollow#p/a/u/0/3uZCcKEJZjc

try the stance and line up techniques and see if it helps you out some.

best wishes,
-Grey Ghost
Click to expand...
 
Awesome video Greyghost. I have never seen so much thought and thorough-ness in a video about mechanics that encompasses both techniques.

Many people only talk about the pendulum stroke but few people actually discuss the piston stroke which is quite effective for shots that require more action.

The grip section was again detailed and very informative. I will pass this information along to those who are still learning correct fundamentals and I'm sure they will appreciate all the hard work.

As stated in the beginning of the video..individual style and strokes are personal preferrences as people are of different sizes and shapes...but information like this is great to have while learning or correcting fundamentals.
 
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