Fav WPBA Player....why?

[drivermaker]

I guess the real question for the boys is that if your fav is your fav, based on looks alone, and then you come to find out that her personality sucked, would she still be your favorite? Do classiness, morals, and attitude outweigh looks?

Alright...I create controversy amongst the men and get into some dandy flame wars from time to time, and since I haven't been in one for quite a while, lets see what we can get started here with the women. I'm just gonna lay it out as I see it and not take on the spokesman position for anybody else.

As to your first question, the answer is NO because a cu....I mean a snot is a snot is a snot and NO amount of looks can overturn that. Nobody needs that anywhere in life, especially one that's in sport, show business (which sport is), and supposedly trying to create a fan base and good will toward the sport.

As to your second question, it could, but it takes a hell of a lot longer to outweigh looks and a hot body. I'll say this about female pool players, I think there are a lot more attractive women in the sport overall, as well as professionally presentable, than anywhere else with the possible exception of tennis or beach volleyball. Golf is a much larger sport in money and attendance, but there are many that refer to the women on the LPGA, especially in years past when there wasn't such a young crop, as "dykes on spikes". Why??...because it was true and also because they were grossly overweight and beastly in looks with no care given to makeup, hair care, ear rings, jewelery, and other factors. Could they play golf at a high level? Absolutely, but the male population didn't care about going to watch and their attendance and popularity suffered. They also had the attitude that, "hey...we can play this game at an exceptional level and that's what really matters". They weren't very friendly, they didn't mingle, and they ran off without signing autographs. Now, there's a much larger number of young women that look really good, take care of themselves, dress well and sometimes sexy, and attendance as well as T.V. viewers are recognizing it.

Let's face it we all like attractive...guys like women, and you women love guys that look good. Otherwise, Sex in the City, Lucky Vanoss, Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt, Matt Damon, Ben Affleck, etc. would never have come to be. I haven't seen any of the women players not carry themselves without class and professionalism. They should all be commended for that, and I as a fan appreciate it. But hot is sure good along with it, and it doesn't necessarily have to be runway beauty pagent hot either. ALL women ARE sexy in different ways...many of you just don't know how to use or flaunt it...or refuse to. Not only in public, but even with your boyfriends and husbands. That's why relationships go to shit...we all start looking elsewhere. Hey...men are guilty too.

O.K...I'm jumping into a trench and covering up because I can tell the bombardment will be coming soon.......

 

[landshark77]

Drivermaker,

ROTFLMAO!

You are certainly not going to generate a flame war with me. I'd like to think I can attack an opinion with out attacking the person, so get outta that trench! LOL!

I actually agree with you on most parts, although I find it funny that you mention beach volleyball. Do you feel that would remain a popular sport (it's a popular sport? ) if the ladies threw some clothes on?

I do not want to get off topic, but I do not feel any girl needs to slut it up, or flaunt it in order to keep a man. Any real man KNOWS his woman is hot, regardless. The leaving is just an excuse to try to intimidate women and bash their self esteem. And it says a lot about that man, or his lack of manhood, IMO. I can say that it is VERY rare for a woman to leave a man based solely on looks and his inability or lack of desire to appear sexy. Women don't usually use looks as a deciding factor to be with a man.

With that said, why does the most popular woman anything have to be classified as the best looking (which is highly subjective) among the men? Why do women in sports have to be deemed as sexy to have a legit following? I mean come on, guys...most of you go hay wire over football and I know most of you don't like it solely based on the sexiness of the players, or do you? I guess that is why a woman's football league has not happened. The men wouldn't be able to see anything, as she would be covered up with pads and other gear. Why she might even look like "dykes on spikes."

 

[Deanna Michelle]

Amen!

Now..those are questions to truly ponder..I'm going to go do that for the rest of my life, and I'll get back to you asap lol

 

[drivermaker]

Drivermaker,

ROTFLMAO!

You are certainly not going to generate a flame war with me. I'd like to think I can attack an opinion with out attacking the person, so get outta that trench! LOL!

I actually agree with you on most parts, although I find it funny that you mention beach volleyball. Do you feel that would remain a popular sport (it's a popular sport? ) if the ladies threw some clothes on?

I do not want to get off topic, but I do not feel any girl needs to slut it up, or flaunt it in order to keep a man. Any real man KNOWS his woman is hot, regardless. The leaving is just an excuse to try to intimidate women and bash their self esteem. And it says a lot about that man, or his lack of manhood, IMO. I can say that it is VERY rare for a woman to leave a man based solely on looks and his inability or lack of desire to appear sexy. Women don't usually use looks as a deciding factor to be with a man.

With that said, why does the most popular woman anything have to be classified as the best looking (which is highly subjective) among the men? Why do women in sports have to be deemed as sexy to have a legit following? I mean come on, guys...most of you go hay wire over football and I know most of you don't like it solely based on the sexiness of the players, or do you? I guess that is why a woman's football league has not happened. The men wouldn't be able to see anything, as she would be covered up with pads and other gear. Why she might even look like "dykes on spikes."

You know what I'm starting to think? That this entire poll was a setup and form of entrapment so that you could go on your pulpit for a bitchfest regarding the feelings of men regarding good looking women and sport. It started off slowly and innocuously, but it's starting to pick up steam with your every comment.

In different parts of the country and especially since the olympics, beach volleyball IS a popular sport. Neither the men nor the women would want to put more clothes on because they're roasting their butts off in the sun and running around. They'd die! Little clothing is a good benefit for the patrons though.

I never said women need to "slut it up", you did. There's a difference between being sexy and slutty. They do shows on the tube such as Oprah where very heavy women dress up provacatively and act sexy...and ARE sexy without being trashy sluts. Don't throw in "Any REAL man knows his woman is hot, regardless" crap either. A man would like to think that and does, otherwise he wouldn't be with her. But if he comes home to someone everyday that dresses like hell, acts tired and is bitching and whining, and doesn't express it...hey it isn't a turn on. Your comment about a man's lack of manhood is another start in the castration process to demean men. You're slowly but surely closing that vise, aren't you?

The most popular women DON'T have to be the best looking. Annika Sorenstam isn't the best looking woman in golf, but she IS the best golfer, is very personable, expresses her personality on and off the course, does work very hard to keep herself in physical shape, appeals to both sexes, and IS the most popular. Yes, she is attractive and easy on the eyes, but not the hottest one out there by anyone's standards.

You just ain't gettin' it...sex does sell and always will. And so does reaching the top level in sport and playing it well. It's great if both exist.
And if you want the real truth...we all evolved from the dog. We're just f*#king dogs. Now...is that truthful and honest enough for you? NO...we ain't gonna change either!

 

[landshark77]

Entrapment, LOL! Trust me; I am nothing more than your stereotypical dumb blonde. There is no way I can premeditate the meaning behind a thread. Thank you for the confidence though!

You are so right about the volleyball and them being so hot that they would die if they wore something more than string bikinis! I have to wonder though why Alaskan snow volleyball hasn't caught on?

Yes, my bad for using the term "slut it up", however, it is just a matter of semantics. To most girls the terms are interchangeable. Sexy to most guys mean less clothes and most girls consider that slutin' it up. This is not the forum to go into the whole men/women personal relationship discussion and whether or not I am demeaning men. I would be more than happy to discuss that in the non-pool related forum. Let me know if you are interested.

Yes, you are right, the post popular women don't HAVE to be the best looking, but more often than not they ARE. Women are consistently objectified and made fun of if they are not "hot". And I admit as a woman I do it too, all sexes perpetrate it, but does that make it right? And yes women give into the objectification. All I want to do is have an open discussion about women in sports, mainly pool and their popularity inside and outside of the sports arena, and the criteria that their fans base them on. Sex has not dominated in my poll yet, and it may not. Skill is leading and that is good, IMO. I doubt that J Lo (or enter your idea of the sexiest girl alive here) would make it as the most famous female pool player just because she is subjectively hot. I just want to have a discussion. No rights, no wrongs...just opinions. Men may feel like they are getting picked on because pool is a dominated by men (players and fans). I get it all the time at the pool table and on these boards. Oh my God, you're a girl? Oh my God, you play pool?

And yes, I do understand that sex sells. How would you feel, as a man, if you had to consistently make yourself "sexy" in order to sell yourself? We live in a world where your mind, skills, and behavior are second rate to beauty. It's a shame, but it is not the fault of the boys or the girls, but a mixture of both. And IMO, a half naked person doesn't want to make me buy a car, a cue, or anything else...well OK maybe soap. It would be senseless to buy soap from a fully clothed person...how would I see how well it lathered?

 

[Rod]

LS, I’ve been buying soap for a long time and I have yet to see anyone sell it that wasn't fully clothed. ha ha ha

At any rate my vote goes to AF. That lady carries herself very well on and off the table. Of course she's not the only one as many do. Allison just happens to play better than the others and is devilish charming as well.

Rod

 

[Deanna Michelle]

Allison Fisher is the epitome of all of the above, in my opinion as well. I was a fan of Allison, before she made it to #1, or her image changed, from the traditional snooker vests, etc, to her style now. She's always been just so classy, she carries a *deliberate* presense, in the game and out. I think her awareness of her fans, like myself, is always great as well.

Of course, the first match I ever watched her play, when she walked out, and said something sarcastic, I was like "Who's this? She's hilarious." Then she played as well as she entertained.

Okay, so who can tell I'm an AF fan? LOL

Dea

 

[Deanna Michelle]

a half naked person doesn't want to make me buy a car, a cue, or anything else...well OK maybe soap. It would be senseless to buy soap from a fully clothed person...how would I see how well it lathered?

I think we should go buy soap, LS77, from half-naked men... And test this theory!!! How many half-naked ones do we have to see if we'd want to buy it from, before it becomes a fact? haha
Girls on a mission

 

[drivermaker]

I think we should go buy soap, LS77, from half-naked men... And test this theory!!! How many half-naked ones do we have to see if we'd want to buy it from, before it becomes a fact? haha
Girls on a mission

Why stop with half naked. I know a few guys that would be willing to get involved in an Amway distributorship to get all the soap you want and we'll just set up a time to meet and go take showers together to lather each other up and see what works and what doesn't. LS77 seems to think sexy is trashy with no clothes, so we'll oblige if you'd like. My idea of sexy for women was actually WEARING clothes and carrying yourself in a confident and sassy fashion that stimulates the thoughts and fantasies of the male mind. So...mission accomplished. When do you want to meet and try some soap?

 

[Perk]

I voted for the sexy hot, although i dont have a particular favorite wpba player in that category necessarily.

I think one of the things that makes players your favorite player is whether or not you know them. I am tired of seeing the same 4 women on the re-runs on ESPN. I root for the players that are from my AREA soley for that reason.

The reason I answered to the poll for the sexy category is do to the idea that if I am going to watch reruns, I would prefer 'some' eye candy. That way I get some bad looks from my wife. As far as good pool and seeing skill, that is a bonus, and ultimately what I watch pool for, but I tend to prefer the matches when the women look professional, and a bit sexy. As mentioned, every woman has her own appeal.

I just hope that the quality of pool will be raised in the WPBA to where you dont see the same faces all the time. Its time to see players like Sarah Rousey, Alice Rim, and dare I say Jennifer Barretta?

Cheers!

 

[hemicudas]

Skill & Integrity should lead. Looks should be either presentable or not. Not "Hot" or "Easy on the eyes". I see some of the men here hold the hotness in high regard.

Maybe the women here should decide who the best of the men are citing "hot" as criteria behind skill??? Ladies?

Phyl

How have you been, Phyllis? Great to see you again. My favorite must have, Class, Heart, Personality and Game. For this reason my favorite player is, Sarah Rousey. Others may have the same assets but I guarantee you, none have more of each. Best of luck in all your endeavors, Sarah..................................$Bill

 

[sjm]

This pretty much describes my favorite WPBA player to a tee. Linda Haywood is all of that. She actually dropped off the WPBA rolls for a while to promote women in pool. I don't think she liked how it was somehow made so difficult to break into the WPBA as a newcomer. She promoted and helped? (may have done it all?) put on tournaments in the Baltimore area for a couple years. SHe did it just to get more women interested and let them get some experience in the tournament arenas.

She is now back on the WPBA tour and I have seen her listed in the money. Although I have not seen her recently, I am sure she is still accessable and doing all she can to promote the sport.

Phyllis Gumphrey

Linda Haywood Shea is a very nice lady, whom I have met many times.
I think, however, you're mistaken about her being back on tour. I think she last played an event during the 2002 WPBA Tour season.

 

[sjm]

I'll tell you something....the players that people are really drawn to usually have a combination of it all.

I certainly don't have Jennifer B's body (then again...not many do), but I have had guys tell me that the combination of skills, personality and looks is why they like watching me play or why they have become a fan. (OK I just reread that sentence and it seems a little conceited....please don't take it that way....I just meant that I have had fans tell me that...not that I believe it all.....LOL)

I personally have seen or met several girls in my life who weren't the hottest girl in the room, but they certainly drew the most attention. I think that people are "attracted" to women that carry themselves with an air of confidence....and when a girl has "mad skills" on the pool table, they usually have that confidence. And if they happen to be a little attractive too....then they can definitely become stars in the pool world.


Melissa H.

Don't sell yourself short, Melissa. You are a good looking lady. You have always been one of my favorites and I've seen many of your matches over the years and delighted in your achievements. You play an exciting, aggressive style, of pool, and carry yourself with an air of quiet condfidence that is both visible and attractive.

As the third highest ranked American born player (only Monica and Jeanette are presently ranked higher), you are very much part of the nucleus of American pool excellence.

You played some great pool in Peoria, Melissa, and if you play that same kind of pool in the upcoming WPBA events, we on the forum may be tuning in to watch you on ESPN real soon. Now that's a day to live for! Good luck.

 

[CaptainJR]

I was one of the honest votes. #3 'She's got the look'. But I'm not telling which one just in case I ever meet one. Then I can say, It was really you beautiful.

 

[drivermaker]

Trust me; I am nothing more than your stereotypical dumb blonde.

Yes, my bad for using the term "slut it up", however, it is just a matter of semantics. To most girls the terms are interchangeable. Sexy to most guys mean less clothes and most girls consider that slutin' it up.

Yes, you are right, the post popular women don't HAVE to be the best looking, but more often than not they ARE. Women are consistently objectified and made fun of if they are not "hot". I just want to have a discussion. No rights, no wrongs...just opinions.

I doubt very seriously that you are nothing more than your stereotypical dumb blonde. You sure as hell aren't dumb, I don't know if you use color or not....

Semantics? "Slut it up" and "Sexy" are interchangable? What was I thinking when a woman looked classy and sexy in an evening gown or even a striking business suit walking down the street or in an office? "Slut it up" never comes to mind, especially when almost every inch of their body is covered. I don't think sexy to most men means less clothes, although it might in an intimate and personal setting. But even then, a little clothes are better than none to stimulate and tease the mind into a heightened state of eroticism. It's the expectations of the unknown and our vivid imaginations that create the desire for another person. It's how they carry themselves in whatever attire they have on and what kind of attitude they're exuding.

I really don't have any clue where you're coming from at all and where you get these ideas. Sounds to me like you really don't know how to be sexy or what men really think. So why don't we just find out what YOU think as a woman regarding female pool players, looks, sexiness, and how they're perceived from a woman's standpoint. Let me throw out some names:

Ewa

Jeanette

Jennifer Barretta

Angel Paglia

Do you think they all have class? Do you think any of them have been slutty?
Do you think they are sexy? Do you think they're overrated due to looks? Do you think others are more deserving of publicity or fan adulation? I'm interested in YOUR opinions......add any other comments regarding each.

 

[landshark77]

Ok, I had no idea that the soap comment would be so popular, LOL!

Anyway, thank you guys and gals for your honest opinion on this subject. And no, Drivermaker, I do not think sexy is trashy with no clothes. The point that I was trying to get across is that society perpetuates the idea that LESS clothes equals sexy. That is why sex sells. Do I believe that naked equals sexy? No.

And yes, semantics. When girls appear in magazines, on TV, and any other visible media the less dressed they are the more exposure they get. Most (not all) guys seem to believe this is sexy, while most (not all) girls seem to believe this is trashy or "slutin' it up". How many times have you heard that Katie Couric is sexy? I really haven't, but IMO; she is one of the sexiest women alive. But who do we hear a lot about? Britney Spears, J Lo, Madonna (at one time) and the list can go on and on. Are these ladies deemed sexy because they carry themselves well? Or is it because they appear in the public's eye a bit on the naked side? They may be the brightest, most talented, and likeable people in the world, but society can not get passed their looks.

I do not KNOW any of the ladies you have mentioned. Therefore I can not truly judge them. Are they good looking ladies? Yeah. Are they getting somewhere based on their looks more so than their pool skills? I do not know. I lack the courage of that conviction. I have never really seen them in action. It would be unfair of me to judge anyone based solely on their looks. Can they paly pool? Obviously.

I assure you that I am totally comfortable with myself and my looks. I KNOW I am good looking. It is a fact. And no, I do not know how guys think and guys do not know how women think. Thus, the discussion.

 

[landshark77]

I was one of the honest votes. #3 'She's got the look'. But I'm not telling which one just in case I ever meet one. Then I can say, It was really you beautiful.

Smart man!

 

[drivermaker]

I assure you that I am totally comfortable with myself and my looks. I KNOW I am good looking. It is a fact. And no, I do not know how guys think and guys do not know how women think. Thus, the discussion.

I stand corrected...I think you know how to be sexy. You just proved it with the above statement and your ATTITUDE. Even if you're covered in clothes from your toes to your nose right now, the curiosity has been aroused and a number of men on here are now using their imaginations to picture you and how you move. (At least I am) The difference between a sexy woman in the public eye and ones that aren't is the ability to just act it. Not many have the ability or desire to do it, although they can if they wanted to, while others just ooze of it naturally. Lucky them! A woman always has a choice of whether she wants to give off those vibes or not, many just aren't comfortable with it so they just plod along. Hell, telephone sex hot lines earn a fortune and the women are fully clothed and, in actuality, many times very unattractive. But they sure talk and ACT sexy without revealing anything. (uhhh...don't go getting the wrong idea...I saw this in a Dateline or 60 Minutes expose) It's just in the image that one is willing to create. Many on the WPBA prefer to just let their cue do the talking, so that's what we get and that's what we live with.

And you're right...men and women don't know how each other think and NEVER will. Therefore, the discussion as well as Cosmopolitan and all the rest will go on forever.

 

[CaptainJR]

Not many have the ability or desire to do it, although they can if they wanted to, while others just ooze of it naturally. Lucky them! A woman always has a choice of whether she wants to give off those vibes or not, many just aren't comfortable with it .

Why can't men be sexy if they want to be. I've had many women like me for various reasons - music, dance, tennis, attitude, convictions, etc. etc., yup even pool, but I've never had one call me 'sexy'. If women can turn this on and off, why can't men? LOL

Seriously now, are we really talking about "sexy". What is "sexy"? Is that something like the difference between 'making love' and 'casual sex'? Personally, I've never had casual sex. I loved every one of them at the time.

Women are from Venus and men are from Mars. I want to live on Venus! (only because I might have a better chance of winning the Venus World billiard title). Did what I put in those paraphrases strike a chord? I was just kidding of course, your first guess of why I want to live on Venus was a better guess. We are generalizing here to much. You've said the men don't understand women and women don't understand men. I understand a lot of women. The better I get to know one, the more I understand that one. It's just to diverse to generalize.

I don't think there is any difference between sexy and good looking except attitude. Oh, well maybe a low cut blouse or a mini skirt could help. Oh, also, hmmm did I ever tell you about the time I wore a white shirt to work and when I took my jacket off.... aaa. Well anyway, long red polished fingernails could make a difference I guess. I don't think leather has anything to do with it at all! Does the length of hair make any difference? Depends on where it is. I'm not into hairy arm pits. Shaved is sexy, but you can't tell that until... Are we only talking about what we think is sexy before the act or can we include after the act? Farting is NOT sexy? Not the loud ones men, and not those quiet deadly ones either ladies. Well, I guess farting afterward is more acceptable than during.

Sobriety has an effect on what is sexy, sort of. Maybe not. Just might be whether 'sexy' matters at all. Oh, and and .... I wouldn't know to much about that.

Sexy - A condition of the moment. Yes

 

[Melissa Herndon]

But that is my point, why should us girls feel as though we have to be "a little attractive" too? Why can't the skills and personality allow them to become stars in the pool world? I mean really, look at the boys, most of the famous ones, I mean the really famous ones are not Brad Pitt's of pool. Yet, with women’s pool it is different. Those who are deemed the best looking get the most attention outside of the general pool arena. It' s not my intention to pin point any one person, but Allison is #1 and Karen is #2, yet the name most linked to women's pool is Jeanette's. Is it because she is a great player? Is it because outta all the ladies, she has the best personality? Or is it that pool is still dominated by the boys and she has a hot looking body? To what degree does sexiness make or break a player in/outside of the WPBA?

If you are going to ask that question, then you might as well ask why women and men dress differently, and why most women feel the need to wear make-up, shave their legs, and put on perfume before they leave the house. The truth is, most of us would rather be playing in sweats, sneakers, and t-shirts, with our hair in ponytails and no make-up. But, I play in dress clothes, with dress shoes, and I spend a good deal of time in front of the mirror making sure that my make-up and hair are done. Why? It doesn't have anything to do with pool. It is the same reason that the majority of women do it everyday...whether they are going to work, going shopping with friends, or taking the kids to school. Because that is what we do. Because that is what attracts members of the opposite sex. Because that is what is "normal" for society...women trying to be more attractive. Is it wrong? Depends on who you ask. Personally, I love having my make-up on and hair done and nice clothes on...I feel pretty and sexy...and when I feel that way, I have more fun...no matter who I am with or what I am doing.

But I digress...

Personally, I think it happens all the time that certain players get more attention based on their looks and not their skill level. It has been a pet peeve of mine for awhile now. (And if you don't believe me, just wait until you read the BD interview I did....coming out in Dec probably). But I have come to realize that the world just works that way....and while it might not be fair...it is completely natural. So you can't really get upset about it...and you shouldn't try to fight or change it.

BTW, it doesn't just happen in the pool world (i.e. Anna K. of tennis)...and we certainly should not be blaming men. It is natural human instinct to be drawn to beauty...for men and women. The only difference might lie in what women find "beautiful". For me, I find it very sexy when a man is doing something he is good at....whether it be pool, carpentry, computer stuff, crossword puzzles, dancing, driving, whatever. So, if there are other women who feel the same way, they would appreciate a man who is at the top of their profession more than they would appreciate a guy who is "better-looking".

Anyhow, I know that I am being long-winded...and I could go on forever on the subject....but I hope I got my basic opinion across. Now, I have to go throw some mascara on so that I can return these darn movies to Blockbuster....LOL.

All the best,

Melissa H