There a lot of immoral people in this world. I guess they would sell it to the same people that were going to buy it from the people that killed the elephants. Come on Mac.....use your head a little bit on this.
Feds "Crushing" 1 Ton of Confiscated Ivory in Times Square
- Thread starter ironchef.
- Start date
There a lot of immoral people in this world. I guess they would sell it to the same people that were going to buy it from the people that killed the elephants. Come on Mac.....use your head a little bit on this.
Yes...........
Cool :clapping: In the scheme a things, I don't even know it's gone. They just bill my CC every month, but compared to the other stuff on there, this is usually the smallest
If they actually sold it dirt cheap and flooded the market, the value of ivory would drop and would also discourage poaching as it would be worth considerably less. Not to mention all the good you could do with the money that was made selling it.
Instead, lets make a public shitshow spectacle and destroy it. This is only going to drive up the value and rarity of it.
Last edited:
You can pretty much tell a custom cue from a few tables away and therefore can assume and be right 80 percent of the time that the white inlays in it are ivory....
All this is assuming you are a pool player and know a little about cues.
The more that gets crushed, the more that will be needed to replace it. Where ever that market may be. The fact is that will be 7 tons of crushed ivory at 150 a lb, over 2 million in ivory.
Lets be realistic here... the biggest use is in Asia and those in Asia that desire the ivory have enough to buy most of us here, 1000x+. Once they start paying a premium to obtain it, that premium will trickle down to the poachers. All they are doing is increasing the price on an elephants head.
Anyone that thinks differently lives in a fantasy world. The monetary value in destroyed ivory could have paid for every elephant to have an armed guard at its side for 100 years, roughly...
Think of the ivory market as an elephant, the cue industry is a tick on that elephant terms of usage.
JV
Lets be realistic here... the biggest use is in Asia and those in Asia that desire the ivory have enough to buy most of us here, 1000x+. Once they start paying a premium to obtain it, that premium will trickle down to the poachers. All they are doing is increasing the price on an elephants head.
Anyone that thinks differently lives in a fantasy world. The monetary value in destroyed ivory could have paid for every elephant to have an armed guard at its side for 100 years, roughly...
Think of the ivory market as an elephant, the cue industry is a tick on that elephant terms of usage.
JV
Many people either don't know or lie. I have been working on cues for decades and I can't tell you how many claim their cues have ivory in them. Once I have a chance to look at the cue by myself, I can tell if it is or not under a loupe.
I never say anything to them one way or another.
Not beyond arms length. So essentially, if you like that look of ivory you can get it from any number of materials and there you go. The only thing ivory may add is in resale value. And again some think it plays better as ferrules and joints.
I have played with ivory joint cues for years and loved them. It must be 40 years since I have played with a steel joint cue. But I was also just as happy with the phenolic joints and even plastic joints.
They think they're being moral. In reality they're just acting foolishly. I find it very hard to believe that some good in the world couldn't be done instead of just destroying it. Other countries must be laughing us.
From what 2strong4u "Said" If they were being harvested for food or even if they were killed for food and their "Ivory" it would make more sense".I wouldn't agree because it wouldn't be the only source of food in that region." However they are being stripped of their Ivory and then left to die. So I don't think we/or I am just taking the high road. A cue will look just as nice with a substitute material and would still be considered a nice cue.
How do you sell it when you made it illegal to own or sell it?
If the Feds stop and seize a 500kg shipment of cocaine those drugs are worth a huge sum of money. Should they turn around and sell it and use the profits to fund the "war on drugs"?
Logic I am afraid does not compute in this case if you really think about it.
I get it, and I struggle with that too. But ivory is confiscated on a moral basis based on the opinions that it's not ok to kill elephants. Cocaine is a narcotic dangerous to our health and well-being. Your analogy makes some sense, but it's a little different.
And you actually think that the Feds don't sell the drugs that are confiscated in seizures and raids?
The Feds, here in America, can and will do anything they want to. They are the law.
When this happens, what happens? Drugs are scarcer and the value increases. Supply and demand....
What also happens.. .more violence and drug lords out to prove a point.
What do you think will happen with the elephants?
JV
What also happens.. .more violence and drug lords out to prove a point.
What do you think will happen with the elephants?
JV
Why not stop eating pork because the pigs are kept in cages where they can't even turn around ....the pigs are slaughtered or just used to make piglets....littter after litter after litter and the pigs are kept standing in cages where they can't even turn around.......there are always going to be abuses and wrongs to right......and I think that fat ass governor Christie should not have vetoed the law that would have banned crate confinement of pigs......he just sold out to some money interests.
Elephants deserve to be protected as do all other endangered species but this rhetoric about how ivory in pool cues is contributing to the poaching of elephants is all phooey.......Someone...anyone......come forth and identify......provide the identities and names of US cue-makers that are violating the ivory ban....or have done so in the past.......identify these culprits......just don't recite the flea market episodes because you do not find any US cue-makers at flea markets.....at least none worth their salt. Furthermore, US cue-makers are definitely not purchasing their ivory at these flea markets either......they procure their ivory "legally" since ivory can still be bought and sold in the USA.
Face the hard facts....... there is "LEGAL" ivory right here in the USA ......so why shouldn't it be used? Is it because it reminds you that some elephant died......at least with legal ivory, you can draw comfort from the fact the elephant died a long....long time ago.The ivory being destroyed is not "legal ivory" and that ivory wasn't destined to wind up in any pool cues. So please do come back and let us know which American cue-makers, that today can still buy legal ivory & have been buying legal ivory for decades, are violating the ivory ban regulation.
Why shouldn't something that is legal....yes perfectly legal ivory as defined by the very regulation..... be used.by American cue-makers? Cue-makers are not contributing to the decimation of the elephant population......my pool cues are not causing nor contributing to the poaching of elephants because American cue-makers are not buying illegal ivory........it's that simple. Cue-makers should be able to obtain some type of license from US Fish & Wildlife that allows them to work with ivory.......they can keep accurate records and documentation that can be inspected at will.....but ivory is useful for making pool cues.......it has unique, superior properties......and my cues will always have ivory ferrules and joint......I don't require it for pool cue inlays but definitely for the ferrules and joint.
Matt B.
Elephants deserve to be protected as do all other endangered species but this rhetoric about how ivory in pool cues is contributing to the poaching of elephants is all phooey.......Someone...anyone......come forth and identify......provide the identities and names of US cue-makers that are violating the ivory ban....or have done so in the past.......identify these culprits......just don't recite the flea market episodes because you do not find any US cue-makers at flea markets.....at least none worth their salt. Furthermore, US cue-makers are definitely not purchasing their ivory at these flea markets either......they procure their ivory "legally" since ivory can still be bought and sold in the USA.
Face the hard facts....... there is "LEGAL" ivory right here in the USA ......so why shouldn't it be used? Is it because it reminds you that some elephant died......at least with legal ivory, you can draw comfort from the fact the elephant died a long....long time ago.The ivory being destroyed is not "legal ivory" and that ivory wasn't destined to wind up in any pool cues. So please do come back and let us know which American cue-makers, that today can still buy legal ivory & have been buying legal ivory for decades, are violating the ivory ban regulation.
Why shouldn't something that is legal....yes perfectly legal ivory as defined by the very regulation..... be used.by American cue-makers? Cue-makers are not contributing to the decimation of the elephant population......my pool cues are not causing nor contributing to the poaching of elephants because American cue-makers are not buying illegal ivory........it's that simple. Cue-makers should be able to obtain some type of license from US Fish & Wildlife that allows them to work with ivory.......they can keep accurate records and documentation that can be inspected at will.....but ivory is useful for making pool cues.......it has unique, superior properties......and my cues will always have ivory ferrules and joint......I don't require it for pool cue inlays but definitely for the ferrules and joint.
Matt B.
Last edited:
2strong4u
Banned
You sound like another sheep. The level of group think and brainwashing in the US is laughable.
If the person in an impoverished country has a means to an end, they will take it. Whether we think it's morally right has nothing to do with it.
You are linking pool/cues to poached ivory, which is a fallacy. It has been stated here and elsewhere ad nauseam that the demand for ivory in pool cues here in the United States is more than satisfied by using pre-ban material that's (1) already here and (2) was harvested long, long ago....material that for decades has been 100% legal to own, use, and sell. This is not a market driver for poached ivory. Even the government's own information shows that. Why shouldn't it be used...and then when it's gone, it's gone.
What this is all is about is power and control. If the government makes up a need to enforce something, they will set up a branch of gov't and expand to do just that. To hell with individual property rights and the fact that we are using 'borrowed money' to do this, being in debt up to our great grandchildren's eyeballs over superfluous things that the federal government has no business being involved in. :angry:
The end game here is sad...a ton of wasted money, wasted time, and zero real impact on saving elephants, zilch.
