gabon ebony

[Mcues]

Mario is right here wood is wood and you never know 100% until you turn it down what it will look like Im pretty sure most of the wood I have sold turns out to be pretty good and nice and dark as far as the ebony

Tommy,

I think anybody selling wood here, specially ebony, should state clearly the moisture content. I personally don't like the fact that a lot of stuff is being sold to the unknowing crowd that will not be workable for a long time. God forbid they try coring it.

Of course, is always buyer beware but maybe the older and more knowledgeable members have some kind of responsibility towards the Neophyte, and atleast ask the tough questions, which I know some already do.

Let the sellers sell quality here or go to e-bay with everybody's blessing.

Mario

 

[ELBeau]

While I think stating moisture content is a noble idea in concept, moisture readings will vary based on the complexity of the equipment. Most lower-end moisture meters won't calibrate for the exotics. In the beginning I put pin holes in wood and regretted it. Much better to get it to where it is acclimated to my shop and reaches EMC (Equilibrium Moisture Content) IE: no longer loses weight.
While I'd be nervous buying wet wood, I'm perfectly fine with air dried. Some folks even prefer it, since there is less chance of any kind of "drying defects" inside the wood. If you see checks and cracks on the outside you know what you're getting into.
That said, I believe "Wet, air dried and Kiln dried" are acceptable classifications. Of course, indoor air drying and outdoor air drying are two different creatures.

 

[QMAKER]

Dry wood

Moisture content is one thing, SEASONING is an entirely different can of worms. Just because a piece of woods reads 6 on your trusty moisture meter does not mean it has stopped moving. That is where seasoning comes in.
This is how I check to see if my wood has stopped moving.
First off I core just about everything except Brazilian and Camelia Rosewood
and would not think of touching a piece of wood that I haven't had in my shop for at least a year.
I bore the .758" core hole and let the wood HANG for at least four weeks and
then I check with a "plug gauge" I made out of a piece of 3/4" tube to see if the gauge slides thru the core hole. If it does all is well and you are all set for the next step. If it requires a slight push to get thru the hole I rebore
and check again in 4 weeks. If after the second try I still cannot get the gauge thru the hole I just scrap the piece as it is trying to tell me something.

Tommy,

I think anybody selling wood here, specially ebony, should state clearly the moisture content. I personally don't like the fact that a lot of stuff is being sold to the unknowing crowd that will not be workable for a long time. God forbid they try coring it.

Of course, is always buyer beware but maybe the older and more knowledgeable members have some kind of responsibility towards the Neophyte, and atleast ask the tough questions, which I know some already do.

Let the sellers sell quality here or go to e-bay with everybody's blessing.

Mario

 

[pescadoman]

I can mill it for you...

 

[Joe Barringer]

I bore the .758" core hole and let the wood HANG for at least four weeks and
then I check with a "plug gauge" I made out of a piece of 3/4" tube to see if the gauge slides thru the core hole. If it does all is well and you are all set for the next step. If it requires a slight push to get thru the hole I rebore
and check again in 4 weeks. If after the second try I still cannot get the gauge thru the hole I just scrap the piece as it is trying to tell me something.

WOW - talk about different operations! Not faulting you here because it must be working for you in your area. With that note aside...

Now, we are talking about well aged wood here so with that in mind...
Early on, I tried letting the wood hang with a hole blown through it and it just doesn't work at least for me. All it does is absorb moisture or release moisture too fast. Letting the wood hang with a hole is a ticking time bomb. Tried it both in Boca Raton, Florida and Las Vegas; talk about different experiences!

Additionally if the wood moves, you cannot possibly blow a second hole through it with the same accuracy as the first hole because it's warped in one end or the other or the center. So, then you create a hole that is larger in one area than the other areas. Not to mention that you're spinning a wobbly piece of wood which will in many instances crack when you try to bore it another time. This is tricky enough without making it unduly more complicated.

We have found the best method is to get all your wood in order, core it and glue it up in the same day. Let the pieces sit for a week or so and then cut a taper pass and you're good to go for the long haul. In this way you're putting the core concentrically in 100% and 100% of the time.

My scenario is not etched in stone but it works well for us and a lot of other cue makers. Of course you can tweak it to your own specs, liking, and area of the country.

OH!! And a Happy New Year to all of you.

 

[QMAKER]

Well Joe nowhere did I mention "warped" wood. This is my quote,"
If it requires a slight push to get thru the hole I rebore".
I have had bored wood hanging in my shop for several years, including ebony and snake wood and I can still slide the "no-go" gauge thru it. I am not finding fault with your method but I wonder how you know the wood has stopped moving or are you depending on the core to stop all residual movement.

WOW - talk about different operations! Not faulting you here because it must be working for you in your area. With that note aside...

Now, we are talking about well aged wood here so with that in mind...
Early on, I tried letting the wood hang with a hole blown through it and it just doesn't work at least for me. All it does is absorb moisture or release moisture too fast. Letting the wood hang with a hole is a ticking time bomb. Tried it both in Boca Raton, Florida and Las Vegas; talk about different experiences!

Additionally if the wood moves, you cannot possibly blow a second hole through it with the same accuracy as the first hole because it's warped in one end or the other or the center. So, then you create a hole that is larger in one area than the other areas. Not to mention that you're spinning a wobbly piece of wood which will in many instances crack when you try to bore it another time. This is tricky enough without making it unduly more complicated.

We have found the best method is to get all your wood in order, core it and glue it up in the same day. Let the pieces sit for a week or so and then cut a taper pass and you're good to go for the long haul. In this way you're putting the core concentrically in 100% and 100% of the time.

My scenario is not etched in stone but it works well for us and a lot of other cue makers. Of course you can tweak it to your own specs, liking, and area of the country.

OH!! And a Happy New Year to all of you.

 

[JoneseyCues]

With a hole in the middle you're creating more surface area for transfer of moisture in or out. If a piece is dry, aclimated to the enviornment and not moving, coring and doweling it is only going to improve its stability, especially with woods that have high movement in service ie; snakewood any burl or spalted woods etc.. With ebony or any really dense wood you're not coring for stability as much as you would be coring for weight. Woods with high movement, leaving a cored hole for any length of time you're only creating potential problems for yourself that otherwise wouldn't happen if there isn't a cored hole. That creates stress that wouldn't be an issue with no hole in it...

 

[RBC]

If a piece of wood has reached moisture equilibrium, then it has reached moisture equilibrium. Boring more holes in it, or hanging it out to dry for another decade isn't going to change that. Now, if the humidity level of the environment in which the wood is stored changes, then the wood will have to reach moisture equilibrium again. Once it does, it's in the same place as before the humidity level changed.

Movement in wood that has reached equilibrium is not caused by moisture, but by stress. Stress can come from many different things that are far beyond a cue makers control, so all a cue maker can do is to look for the signs of stressed wood. If you're wood still has stress in it, and you can't relieve it with cutting, then it's junk and will never stop moving. If you're wood doesn't have any stress in it, or you have relieved it through cutting, then it will be stable pretty much forever. Of course, major changes in relative humidity can cause wood to have a different "happy place" where any stresses are relieved, so there are some variables. But for the most part stress free wood is stable. You can't do anything beyond that.

I have seen maple shafts cut from 1" squares to the final taper, jointed and finished in one day that are dead straight many years later. The wood is stable because it was stress free when it was turned down to that shaft. I've also seen wood that has hung for 20 years in a climate controlled environment with small cuts taken every couple of years that still moves every time it's cut. That wood will never stay straight. Why you ask? It moves because it has stress in it, and no hanging or small cuts will make it go away.

Don't over think this stuff. If a piece of wood moves every time you cut it, use it as a door stopper, or a conversation piece when people come by your shop. If it moves a little on the first cut or 2 and then stops moving. Make something nice for somebody out of it.


Royce

 

[Joe Barringer]

Well Joe nowhere did I mention "warped" wood. This is my quote,"
If it requires a slight push to get thru the hole I rebore".
I have had bored wood hanging in my shop for several years, including ebony and snake wood and I can still slide the "no-go" gauge thru it. I am not finding fault with your method but I wonder how you know the wood has stopped moving or are you depending on the core to stop all residual movement.

I don't want to go round and round on this as I said there is nothing wrong with what you are doing (even though it's not for me) as it is obviously working for you. However, now since you pushed the issue, yes warped. A warp even slightly is a warp. If your gun drill went through it once, then so will your 'gauge'. If in a month, your 'gauge' doesn't go through it, then one of two things happened. The wood swelled or it moved. If it moved then it warped no matter how slightly. If it swelled it picked up moisture that wasn't there initially.

I am amazed that you said you had Snakewood hanging in your shop with a hole in it. And it's didn't crack! I find that simply astonishing.

Personally, I think leaving wood with a hole blown through it is just one more unnecessary step and just asking for more trouble. BUT... repeat... BUT... if it's working for you then that's great.; run with it. You've been successfully building cues your way so it's just a matter of opinion here.

As far as when we core: the wood is totally stable and we rarely get movement.

Side note: We understand that many of you may have different approaches to building a cue or in this case coring. Many of you need to understand that your comments and methods are far reaching and there are a lot of newbies on here and a ton of lurkers. Just because you are in the desert of California where it's dry and you can core by blowing a hole in the front doesn't mean the rest of the country can do the same thing. When some come on here and I am only using this as an example since we are on this subject with coring but your remarks (not you Bob), construction techniques and methods reach the entire country. What happens is a newbie in Miami or Washington State reads what you write and tries it. He let's the wood dry, blows a hole in it and let's it sit for 30 days. He then picks it up and it's warped. He blows it apart when he tries to re-core it and then picks up the phone and calls us. "I read a new way to core on AZ and I just cracked 3 sticks of ebony trying to core it". And the story goes on. So, when we offer out advice it's for the general public so that they can construct a successful cue regardless where they reside. Our method works throughout the entire country or world. Letting a front sit for 30 days with a hole in it will not work for most of the world.

I hope this clarifies our stance on this.

 

[QMAKER]

Warped wood

I don't want to go round and round on this as I said there is nothing wrong with what you are doing (even though it's not for me) as it is obviously working for you. However, now since you pushed the issue, yes warped. A warp even slightly is a warp. If your gun drill went through it once, then so will your 'gauge'. If in a month, your 'gauge' doesn't go through it, then one of two things happened. The wood swelled or it moved. If it moved then it warped no matter how slightly. If it swelled it picked up moisture that wasn't there initially.

I am amazed that you said you had Snakewood hanging in your shop with a hole in it. And it's didn't crack! I find that simply astonishing.

Personally, I think leaving wood with a hole blown through it is just one more unnecessary step and just asking for more trouble. BUT... repeat... BUT... if it's working for you then that's great.; run with it. You've been successfully building cues your way so it's just a matter of opinion here.

As far as when we core: the wood is totally stable and we rarely get movement.

Side note: We understand that many of you may have different approaches to building a cue or in this case coring. Many of you need to understand that your comments and methods are far reaching and there are a lot of newbies on here and a ton of lurkers. Just because you are in the desert of California where it's dry and you can core by blowing a hole in the front doesn't mean the rest of the country can do the same thing. When some come on here and I am only using this as an example since we are on this subject with coring but your remarks (not you Bob), construction techniques and methods reach the entire country. What happens is a newbie in Miami or Washington State reads what you write and tries it. He let's the wood dry, blows a hole in it and let's it sit for 30 days. He then picks it up and it's warped. He blows it apart when he tries to re-core it and then picks up the phone and calls us. "I read a new way to core on AZ and I just cracked 3 sticks of ebony trying to core it". And the story goes on. So, when we offer out advice it's for the general public so that they can construct a successful cue regardless where they reside. Our method works throughout the entire country or world. Letting a front sit for 30 days with a hole in it will not work for most of the world.

I hope this clarifies our stance on this.

Well I guess it is a matter of semantics--to me "warped" means a distinct curve in the hole or the wood--whatever.
On the snakewood--I believe I bought it from you right after you moved from Vegas to FL and core drilled it right after.

 

[Joe Barringer]

Well I guess it is a matter of semantics--to me "warped" means a distinct curve in the hole or the wood--whatever.
On the snakewood--I believe I bought it from you right after you moved from Vegas to FL and core drilled it right after.

That's amazing because if I look at Snakewood wrong it cracks!

 

[aplusbilliard]

I may just have to cut it down and sell ty for all the input

If you do decide to do that be sure and put me on your list of people to call. I LOVE the last piece I got you. If you do some 6/4" x 6/4" x 18" I'll take 10 sticks.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[tommygunn78]

ty and glad you are happy with the the wood you got before you will be first on my list if I mill it down ty once again..Tom