Getting 2 Mechanical

[TheConArtist]

Can one get to mechanical? Should you just free up your mind and let your stroke take hold and do its natural thing? Or is that for the players who have natural talent in this game and for the rest of us we must be mechanical.

Thanks.

 

[JayBates]

when im playing bad its because im trying to stroke like alison or getting over confident and stroking a bit more loose like efren or fransisco. when your playing the best your not worried about your stance or your stroke...its just there. if your thinking about it too much than you must not be all that comfortable IMO

 

[unknownpro]

That's why I try to simplify everything down to speed and direction of the cuestick. Then it's easier to loosen up my stroke without worrying about where the balls are going. You can be too mechanical. It's as if people are trying to throw a ball without moving their elbow or shoulder. It may be possible, but why would you want to do it that way?

unknownpro

 

[TX Poolnut]

Personally, I think it's important to be "mechanical" in your practice time. It's important to experiment when you practice.

On the other hand, I focus on just playing when I'm in a tourney. I think it's very important to loosen up when you're not practicing.

 

[steev]

Personally, I think it's important to be "mechanical" in your practice time. It's important to experiment when you practice.

On the other hand, I focus on just playing when I'm in a tourney. I think it's very important to loosen up when you're not practicing.

tap, tap, tap.

these ideas (and a bunch more) are discussed nicely in Pleasures of Small Motions. this book is a must-read.

-s

 

[Tommy Joe]

when im playing bad its because im trying to stroke like alison or getting over confident and stroking a bit more loose like efren or fransisco. when your playing the best your not worried about your stance or your stroke...its just there. if your thinking about it too much than you must not be all that comfortable IMO

I agree. It's good to be mechanical - if you're a machine. But if you're a human and you're thinking all the time about your stroke, forget it, you're in trouble.

When I first began playing, for the first few years I held the stick way back and was a very good shot maker. Maybe I didn't care as much about position, just starting out.

Anyway, someone told me I should hold the butt of the cue up closer to the balance point, not so far back, and I practiced with that for weeks until it became the norm. But was it really the norm? Even now I wonder, had I stuck with holding the butt way back, might I not have been a better, more natural player. I notice Strickland holds his stick back kind of far. But it's like you say, you can't really dwell on that stuff.

I think a lot of it has to do with how old you were when you started. I suspect a lot of top players began playing in their pre-teens. When you start doing something mechanical at a young age, you tend to grow into it, and it grows into you, I suspect. I read that Gene Nagy didn't start playing until he was 18. If that's the case, then I respect him all the more. I also didn't begin playing until that age. I also began drinking regularly at that age.

The real reason I chimed in is that the Con Artist's post reminded me of certain guys I used to watch practicing, and it always made me laugh. They'd be down on the shot, but gazing back at their shooting hand to study it, stroking five or six times, to see how 'cool' it looked or whatever. They cared more about how they looked than how they played. I'm not putting them down. I can identify. I'm an egotist too. Except I'm an advanced egotist who knows not to make it look too obvious. I'm not an A player, but I think I could have been. Nevertheless, if they ever need someone to star in a movie about the world's greatest player, I'm the guy they need, because I look good on the table, better than I ever got to be. Next question: Can posts too mechanical?

Tommy Joe

 

[RiverCity]

Well, I think it really boils down to whats best for you, in that whatever you do more consistantly is the best stroke you have. Guys like Efren, Bustamante etc have fluid loose strokes, because thats how they learned to play and what works best for them. Buddy Hall on the other hand is very mechanical and piston like in his stroke because thats what works best for him.
Best advice I ever got on strokes came from one of the Bad News Bears movies, where the kid pitching was trying to pitch like several different big leaguers, and the coach finally told him to just pitch like himself. Its true..... dont worry about how anyone else does it, find YOUR stroke, that you can reproduce naturally with the only goal being consistancy.
Chuck

 

[JDB]

Well, I think it really boils down to whats best for you, in that whatever you do more consistantly is the best stroke you have. Guys like Efren, Bustamante etc have fluid loose strokes, because thats how they learned to play and what works best for them. Buddy Hall on the other hand is very mechanical and piston like in his stroke because thats what works best for him.
Best advice I ever got on strokes came from one of the Bad News Bears movies, where the kid pitching was trying to pitch several different big leaguers, and the coach finally told him to just pitch like himself. Its true..... dont worry about how anyone else does it, find YOUR stroke, that you can reproduce naturally with the only goal being consistancy.
Chuck

Great post! I think that people get too caught up sometimes on how so and so does it. I do this as well, at times. There are so many variations between top players that it is clear that there is no "one" way to be successful. However, I believe there are certain things that are consistent in order to build the foundation.

 

[TheConArtist]

well i let my stroke out and not worry about to much about my mechanics although i work on them if you know what i mean. If i find myself going into a slump then i focus on them, but when i play really think to much about it as i try to keep it simple. But after watching the Francisco and John Horsfall match he is really into his mechanics at the table, and the reason i made the post is after watching golf today, they were talking about this player and they said his coach said he was trying to be to mechanical, and they were just practicing on letting his stroke out and letting it do what it wants or capable of. But this can be like a pool player also.

 

[justnum]

being mechanical does bring consistency.

I tried being a feeler player but that wasnt cutting it in my league.

 

[TheConArtist]

being mechanical does bring consistency.

I tried being a feeler player but that wasnt cutting it in my league.

i have seen some players like this, that are all mechanical. Look like machines and i love to watch these kind of players play. But i also love to watch players who are natural talent and make the game look easy. I was all mechanical but now i think i just let my stroke do its thing and not worry to much about it, and i can say i play better. I find that when i practice being perfect at doing my drills and practicing with a good habit bring me consistency, and with that i feel more loose at the table.

 

[tfdr]

just think of those basketball shooters

they have their own way of holding the ball and aiming for a shot

yet all can shoot the 3

it's what is comfortable and what works for you

 

[Tommy Joe]

the reason i made the post is after watching golf today, they were talking about this player and they said his coach said he was trying to be too mechanical........

This is a bit off topic and maybe a bit insane as well, but your quote about golf made me think of an old debate I had with myself some years ago concering the mechanics of golf vs those of pool. My argument was, and is, that golf is way more mechanical than pool.

I picture the following scenario. A thousand kids - age 5 to 10 - are taken to an island where they are given golf clubs and a course on which to play. They are told how the game is played but they are not given instructions on how to use the equipment.

A thousand kids of the same age are taken to another island and are given equipment for playing pool (elves come in once every 6 months to re-cloth the table and re-tip the sticks) - but the kids are not given instructions on how to hold the cue or strike the cue ball.

Given this scenario (sure it's insane), I believe over time that very few if any of the kids playing golf would be holding the clubs as pros do today, with the pinkie over or under the thumb of the other hand. They'd probably be swinging the club like a baseball bat.

I think more of the pool-playing kids would be using a stroke similiar to that used by known pool players, although how good they'd be playing is another matter. Anyway, I think the golf swing is way more mechanical and unnatural than the pool stroke. Does this have anything directly to do with your original post? No, not directly. But it came to my mind and there it is. Next topic for debate: Who would win in a fight to the death between a gorilla and a grizzly bear? Thanks for reading.

Tommy Joe

 

[Tommy-D]

> I think the only way a player could possibly be too mechanical is if their effort to produce the exact same stroke all the time,by constantly thinking about it or consciously trying to deliver the cue in a dead straight line interferes with their thought process as far as choosing an aiming point,a spin or no spin,a speed,and cue ball/object ball path,committing to them,and letting them happen. I've believed for a long time,perhaps incorrectly,that if a player had a stroke that truly achieved mechanical perfection,meaning that it did the exact same thing time and time again,that it would take the mental/emotional sides of the game right out of the equation,in a sense. You would never beat yourself by incorrectly applying the stroke,and coming up short/long on position by under/over hitting shots,it did exactly what you intended. You couldn't tense up and hit a ball funny under pressure,because your stroke can only hit a ball that one way. All you would have to do is develop a pre-shot routine that puts your feet in the right place to shoot the cue ball at the correct spot on the object ball,pick a spot to send the cue ball to,and let it happen. Of course,all of us being human pisses on that fire. The physical reproduction of the stroke is something that can be worked on and improved on,but at the table trying run out to win a match is NOT the time to be focusing on such things. Tommy D.

 

[pooltchr]

I think it depends onknowing the difference between practice and play. When I practice, I foucs on the mechanics. When I am playing, I don't even think about mechanics. But if I practiced properly, I have developed fundamental habits that will automatically show up in my game. I had a young lady come up to me after a match once and asked me if I knew that my elbow doesn't move when I shoot. I told her I hadn't thought about it that night. I guess the practice sessions are working.
Steve

 

[Purdman]

Mechanics

Establishing good mechanics thru practice is how I improved my game. Set, pause, finish, and freeze, grip, bridge, stance & stroke. When that work was done and it became "natural", your style and rhythm create your game. Now when not playing my best, for whatever reason, them mechanics sure come in handy. It is back to set, pause, finish & freeze.
Purdman
Thanks Randy!!!

 

[TX Poolnut]

Who would win in a fight to the death between a gorilla and a grizzly bear?

The grizzly would be eating monkey meat for days, but he'd have to catch it first.

 

[pooltchr]

Establishing good mechanics thru practice is how I improved my game. Set, pause, finish, and freeze, grip, bridge, stance & stroke. When that work was done and it became "natural", your style and rhythm create your game. Now when not playing my best, for whatever reason, them mechanics sure come in handy. It is back to set, pause, finish & freeze.
Purdman
Thanks Randy!!!

It's amazing how something so simple can have such an impact on your game, if you actually apply what is taught in the class.
As Randy is fond of saying, "Knowledge is only power when application is included". I think you applied what you learned.
Steve

 

[TheConArtist]

Ditto. I love RandyG's method, but I must add that I think that it is important to not only be mechanical but to also practice being 'loose as a goose' while you are doing it. After all you play like you practice, and if you don't practice being loose your odds of getting loose in real play go way down. It is one thing to be able to make the shots but it is an entirely different matter when you want to get that exact position, time after time after time, like Efrem.

Allison Fisher has perfect mechanics and she says on her web site that this is what she practices on - fundamentals.

However, I like Jasmin's style because she just shoots with more looseness with the same good table mechanics.

This is a very good question BTW.

Good post,

So what i am doing is fyne then, as i practice my mechanics and such when i am alone practicing. So during match play everything should be natural and just let what i work on do its thing.

 

[PoolSleuth]

I do not own my Own Table, but if I did. My Tip would depend upon if the Mechanic was the Owner or Employee of the Company doing the Table Work.

Owner gets 100% of the FEES Charged

Employee in most cases work only for an Hourly, or per Job FEE...