HandiCapping Systems.

[Aubrey's Quay]

So rather than HiJack the recent, and somewhat obscure, post about favoritism in the TriState tour, I thought I would start a new thread to ask a simple question.

Just how many different handicapping systems are there, and is there really one that is impartial? TAP has it's own, then APA is different. And everyone seems to have complaints about all of them.

The beauty of golf is that I am a 7 handicap everywhere in the world. Thank you GHIN.

 

[measureman]

I recently joined a bar pool league. Played my first night last Tuesday. I'm still not sure how the scoring system works because i just reported what happened to the team captain but it works like this. So many points if you win plus how many balls your opponent has left. I lost 1 and won 4 and my score for the night was 41. They said anything over 40 was good.
I'll try to get a better understanding this Tuesday night.

 

[Spade]

APA has most used, tho not that accurate. think it should go higher in 8ball

 

[Bob Jewett]

So rather than HiJack the recent, and somewhat obscure, post about favoritism in the TriState tour, I thought I would start a new thread to ask a simple question.

Just how many different handicapping systems are there, and is there really one that is impartial? TAP has it's own, then APA is different. And everyone seems to have complaints about all of them.

The beauty of golf is that I am a 7 handicap everywhere in the world. Thank you GHIN.

One problem is that tables vary, so the only accurate ranking system is one that involves competition among those who are ranked.

If you want a fair ranking/handicapping system, look at the NPL system. Briefly: if you win a match, your ranking goes up, if you lose a match, your ranking goes down. Higher-ranked players have to give game spots (or point spots in 14.1) to lower-ranked players according to tables that have been worked out to be as fair as possible. Because only match wins/losses are counted in the rankings, there is very limited opportunity to sandbag. You have to lose a match to drop your rating -- you can't just mark a bunch of phony misses on your score sheet.

For more info, see: http://www.sfbilliards.com/NPL_info.txt

The main problem with the system is that the top players don't like to be 50-50 in matches against lower players, so you may have to figure out some way to reward them. Maybe a "Masters" event at the end of the season. While it is possible to skew the ranking adjustments so the top players will win, say, 70% of their matches, it's complicated and some think it's unfair.

 

[Snapshot9]

Handicapping

I believe for a handicapping system to be accurate that the system has to consider who you have played and what their handicap is, much like how they rate basketball teams by considering the SOS (strength of schedule) and their Opponents RPI.

I, also, do not believe in 100% handicapping. 90% is okay, but the top players have worked to get where they are, they have earned it, and the lower players should have to 'earn' their win against one of them.

 

[mikepage]

[...]
If you want a fair ranking/handicapping system, look at the NPL system. Briefly: if you win a match, your ranking goes up, if you lose a match, your ranking goes down. [...]

We are doing something for 8-ball that is based on all the great stuff Bob has introduced with the NPL system. And I'm convinced it is the way to go--nationally/internationally--for an 8-ball rating system. I'll introduce the details soon.

For those who understand the NPL system, I'll give you a sense of the way it works in practice.

If you win a GAME, your rating goes up. If you lose a GAME, your rating goes down.

Yes your rating goes down even if you lose a game against SVB, and it goes up even if you win a game against a blind grandmother. But trust me, this is exactly what is supposed to happen, and I've got trash cans filled with crumpled up pages of equations to back it up.

Those familiar with NPL ratings will know that if Bob is 15 points above Mike, then --approximately--out of 100 games Bob is expected to win 60 and Mike is expected to win 40. But what if we play just a single game and Bob wins?

Well for ONE game he was expected to win 0.6 games. He exceeded expectations by actually winning 1.0 games. So what hapens to his NPL rating?

It goes up by

190/N *(actually won - expected to win)

N here is the ROBUSTNESS of Bob's NPL rating --the number of prior games his rating is based upon.

So if Bob has a robustness of 400, then his rating goes up by about 0.2 points [190/400*(1.0 - 0.6)]. Then if he loses the next game to me, his rating would go down by 0.3 points. [190/401*(0.0-0.6)]

If Bob drew me in an unhandicapped race-to-5 tournament and beat me 5-4, his rating would go DOWN a bit. This is because out of 9 games, Bob is expected to win 5.4. By letting me get to the hill, he underperformed a bit--so we would zing him a bit for it...

Anyway, we have worked out a lot of the details. Every league and tournament game goes into the database. So like NPL, ratings are constantly on the move. Unlike NPL, we don't restrict ourselves to 'fair" matches.

The ratings are called FARGO RATINGS, and they have the following approximate correspondence:

• 800 A top world-class 8-ball player such as Corey Duell, Shane Van Boening, Darren Appleton, or Thorsten Hohman

• 700 A top regional 8-ball player in the US –a threat to cash in the Master’s Division at the BCA/VNEA Championships – a threat to run six in a row if the break is working

• 600 Likely to cash in the BCA Open Division but probably won’t make it to the top 32. –may get moved to Master’s Division and then flounder –has run three-in-a-row multiple times and maybe four-in-a row a time or two

• 500 A good local league player. Runs out first time at the table in about 10% of the games

• 400 Runs out first time at the table in about 1% of the games—once or twice a league season

• 300 A beginner league player

• 200 absolute beginner- may miscue frequently

 

[Pushout]

There is exactly one fair handicapping system and it works for every sport. It is a combination of natural ability, desire and practice. Automatically handicaps everything.

dld

I know someone who used this system. It cost him, literally, thousands of dollars. He could afford it, most of us can't. One of the guys who beat him out of a bunch of those thousands used to joke about it frequently.

 

[NewStroke]

You forgot the most important handicapping. It's when Joe Bob and his buddies break your legs because you can't pay the $10.00 you lost to them shooting pool. That'll handicap your happy butt.

 

[8Ball48043]

We are doing something for 8-ball that is based on all the great stuff Bob has introduced with the NPL system. And I'm convinced it is the way to go--nationally/internationally--for an 8-ball rating system. I'll introduce the details soon.

For those who understand the NPL system, I'll give you a sense of the way it works in practice.

If you win a GAME, your rating goes up. If you lose a GAME, your rating goes down.

Yes your rating goes down even if you lose a game against SVB, and it goes up even if you win a game against a blind grandmother. But trust me, this is exactly what is supposed to happen, and I've got trash cans filled with crumpled up pages of equations to back it up.

Those familiar with NPL ratings will know that if Bob is 15 points above Mike, then --approximately--out of 100 games Bob is expected to win 60 and Mike is expected to win 40. But what if we play just a single game and Bob wins?

Well for ONE game he was expected to win 0.6 games. He exceeded expectations by actually winning 1.0 games. So what hapens to his NPL rating?

It goes up by

190/N *(actually won - expected to win)

N here is the ROBUSTNESS of Bob's NPL rating --the number of prior games his rating is based upon.

So if Bob has a robustness of 400, then his rating goes up by about 0.2 points [190/400*(1.0 - 0.6)]. Then if he loses the next game to me, his rating would go down by 0.3 points. [190/401*(0.0-0.6)]

If Bob drew me in an unhandicapped race-to-5 tournament and beat me 5-4, his rating would go DOWN a bit. This is because out of 9 games, Bob is expected to win 5.4. By letting me get to the hill, he underperformed a bit--so we would zing him a bit for it...

Anyway, we have worked out a lot of the details. Every league and tournament game goes into the database. So like NPL, ratings are constantly on the move. Unlike NPL, we don't restrict ourselves to 'fair" matches.

The ratings are called FARGO RATINGS, and they have the following approximate correspondence:

• 800 A top world-class 8-ball player such as Corey Duell, Shane Van Boening, Darren Appleton, or Thorsten Hohman

• 700 A top regional 8-ball player in the US –a threat to cash in the Master’s Division at the BCA/VNEA Championships – a threat to run six in a row if the break is working

• 600 Likely to cash in the BCA Open Division but probably won’t make it to the top 32. –may get moved to Master’s Division and then flounder –has run three-in-a-row multiple times and maybe four-in-a row a time or two

• 500 A good local league player. Runs out first time at the table in about 10% of the games

• 400 Runs out first time at the table in about 1% of the games—once or twice a league season

• 300 A beginner league player

• 200 absolute beginner- may miscue frequently

Interesting system. The numbers remind me a bit of 3-Cushion handicapping.