Has Gambling Hurt Pools Popularity?

Is gambling a major factor why pool isn't popular?

  • Yes - gambling is a major factor why pool is not mainstream

    Votes: 21 25.6%

  • No - gambling has nothing to do with it

    Votes: 61 74.4%
  • Total voters
    82
S

Snorks

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Growing up I never played pool. In fact my Mom said I shouldn't go to the local pool hall because it was a trouble area, places where people got beat up and gambled.

Does anyone else feel that gambling and the stigma associated with pool is one of the major reasons that the game is not as main stream as it could be?

I am fortunate enough to have stopped listening to Mom when I was 35 (two years ago) and have now picked this incredible game up :)
 
It hasn't hurt Poker.

Snorks said:
Growing up I never played pool. In fact my Mom said I shouldn't go to the local pool hall because it was a trouble area, places where people got beat up and gambled.

Does anyone else feel that gambling and the stigma associated with pool is one of the major reasons that the game is not as main stream as it could be?

I am fortunate enough to have stopped listening to Mom when I was 35 (two years ago) and have now picked this incredible game up :)
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Who'd play Poker for free? Gambling hasn't hurt pool, the players have hurt pool. Attitude, attitude, attitude. Splitting, dumping, whining, laying down, all have hurt pool. Money is involved, here.
 
I voted that it has. Although, poker has had a contradictory success, I still feel that gambling at least CONTRIBUTES to the bad stigma surround pool. I do not see it as the immediate problem, but without gambling, other issues would be non-existant.
 
It's an interesting question, and I don't think I have the answer.

It's the type of thing that I have been thinking about recently, though. I just got a table in December for my basement, and am constantly looking for people to play with. It has really surprised me how many people DON'T know how to play. When I grew up and went to college in the Boston area, all of my friends played, both in high school and college. Not knowing how to play at all would have seemed like not knowing how to ride a bike or something. Now it seems that most people I know don't really know how to play. Is pool less popular than it used to be? Is it more popular in some parts of the country than others?

The second part of this rambling post is how surprised I am at how many people seem to associate pool with gambling, smoking, shady pool halls, etc. I'd never really thought of it just like that. I went to an elite private university in New England, and all the rich preppy kids played. Haven't a ton of presidents, titans of the industry, etc, played?

I'd love to hear people's thoughts on pool's image in America and it's popularity.
 
crawfish said:
Who'd play Poker for free? Gambling hasn't hurt pool, the players have hurt pool. Attitude, attitude, attitude. Splitting, dumping, whining, laying down, all have hurt pool. Money is involved, here.
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It's always a chicken-and-egg thingie. I don't think it's the players themselves at all. In fact, I place the blame squarely on the pool industry. The same payouts exist in 2007 as in 1977, and what's going on with the Billiard Congress of AMERICA? The pool players can only play with the hand they are dealt.

As American pool players continue to wander in a wilderness that is more and more becoming inhabited by players from around the world, they will eventually become extinct.

When the existing tournament trail on American soil dries up, a new one will replace it, only it will be located overseas.

Gambling may become some American players only shot at survival because today's tournament trail is not cost effective. Even when you win, you may have accounts payable to satisfy from previous events.

This is especially true for unsponsored players. I can count sponsored players in the States on one hand, and by sponsored, I mean sponsored by having their travel, lodging, and entry fees paid for, and then there's the fortunate few who get a monthly stipend.

Gambling has been, is today, and will be in the future some pool players key to survival, and may have better odds at winning than being a tournament soldier in today's pool world, when you take into account the associated expenses. JMHO, FWIW!

JAM
 
crawfish said:
Who'd play Poker for free? Gambling hasn't hurt pool, the players have hurt pool. Attitude, attitude, attitude. Splitting, dumping, whining, laying down, all have hurt pool. Money is involved, here.
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I couldn't agree more.

Look at golf, on any day more wagering takes place on a golf course than in just about any pool hall. Yet no one says golf is a seedy sport or that golf has a gambling problem. Why is that? Could it just maybe be that golfers are generally better behaved and more gentlemanly in their wagering?

I have no problem with risking a few bucks on a few sets in pool. I never bet more than I can afford to lose. I only gamble with guys that I know are going to behave properly. And no matter who I'm playing, I always insist that we post the money up. Win or lose, I always shake my opponent's hand afterwards and congratulate him on his fine play.

If everyone would just avoid playing with the unsavory characters then eventually they would only have each other to prey on, shoot air barrels at and try their shark antics on.

Fats
 
Well, if you want to place blame on the demise of pool in America, look at the opinions of the members of the pool culture. They seem to despise players as if they're King-ons on the Starship Enterprise. What they seem to forget, though, is without them, there wouldn't be any professional pool. To keep bashing them as if they're monsters isn't doing a damn thing to help pool's survival in America.

To cultivate the sport, it would seem to me there should exist something worthwhile to shoot for. The majority of pool events, you have to come in first, second, or third to break even.

You can't even compare pool to golf. It is, IMHO, ridiculous. Look at the payouts in golf compared to pool. If a pool player could make $600,000 coming in second place, like the golfers do on the PGA tour, you might see a different caliber of pool player on the horizon. There would be, in fact, something to shoot for. Most pool players today are struggling to survive, much less come out ahead. The majority of pool players who do come out ahead aren't competing professionally. Rather, they sought their niche elsewhere in the pool industry.

JAM
 
crawfish said:
Who'd play Poker for free? Gambling hasn't hurt pool, the players have hurt pool. Attitude, attitude, attitude. Splitting, dumping, whining, laying down, all have hurt pool. Money is involved, here.
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I was just about to post the same exact thing ......rep to you !!!
 
My .02

From what I understand, the name Pool Hall came from the para mutual betting parlors from the 1930's and 40's. Horse racing had a betting parlors in every major city in the country. They put pool tables in these parlors for the bettors to have something to do between races. There were quite a few shady characters who frequented these parlors and they all were gamblers. If I am not mistaken, that's where the stigma began and still exist to this day. Please correct me if I am wrong. I thought it was very interesting when I read this somewhere.
Purdman :rolleyes:
 
I don,t think gambling is particularly good or bad for any game or sport.

But the idea of dishonest gambling (fixxed games, misrepresented skill or cheating) are bad for all games and sports. Poker managed to break away from its card sharp, shady image by increasing the perception that there is little or no way to cheat or be cheated in a major venue.. Pool has not.

In the "Color of Money" movie, pool represented itself in a way that actually discourages "honest " gambling. This is unfortunately the way many people (including many of us players) seem to like it. Fair pool played by honest players for decent stakes is percieved by many to be the rarest game.

I think that holds our game back.
 
I don't know, and correct me if I'm wrong, but gambling is rampant in the Republic of Philippines, where pool is the nation's sport and its players are regarded as icons.

Pool players in America are regarded as scum of the earth.

And so there, you have it.

JAM
 
I don't really have an opinion one way or another, but I just wanted to point out that poker may not be a completely fair comparison. Picture a kid who would be interested in either poker or pool. His parents could much more easily prevent him from playing pool than poker.

All you need is a computer and an internet connection to play poker at home. It's hard for a kid to learn pool unless he has some money for table time, or a place to play for free.
 
Gambling and pool

Gambling is a part of a lot of sports.Actually all of them.Go to Vegas and you'll see that you can gamble on what ever sport you want.I'm sure gambling has hurt some feeling before,caused some arguments(sometimes more),and made some good people bad.I beleive one of the reasons pool isn't as popular as other sports for one is that how many kids don't play it at a young age.I was lucky that I got to play it at all.Some people just never get the bug for it.Not many people have gotten to see it at its best either.Kids when their younger usually dream about being an athlete but have never know of pool players as being athletes.Hell until your turn 21 you hardly ever see a pool table.In fact in Alabama its illegal to play under 21 (which is an old law but still).I won't,better can't say that pool does get an ugly look do to the gambling.Mother's everywhere probally don't want thier children to play a game that is usually surrounded in booz,cigerettes, and even drugs unfortunatly.I know in my area league is a pretty big deal although everyone that gets to go to vegas has to pay out of pocket vs a friend of mine that won a partner Flick-Ball competion and got an all inclusive to Hawaii,but thats a different story.It is odd that as many people that play pool,which i wouldn't mind getting a estimated figure of how many people just play league,that their isn't more backing from big name sponsors.I guess they don't like to gamble either.I was listening to Rodney Morris's interview on CBS or something and the rep. for the IPT was saying how they had a hard time with getting enough sponsorship in turn i'm sure lead to its demise.Looks like the only money in pool is what you gamble.Hell cards is ALL ABOUT GAMBLING and people eat it up.Why not just show people matching up and betting the bank role.I'd watch it wouldn't you all.Trying to fix,correct, whatever the image of pool I don't beleive is the neccessary action.I say promote it for what it is.
 
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I'm not really convinced it hurts, but I voted yes nevertheless, because it might. I do feel without question that people shy away from pool sometimes because they're afraid that they'll feel self-concious because they don't want to gamble. Sometimes a mystique is put forward that if you don't gamble you're not really a pool player. That mystique I think does hurt pool's popularity.
My personal opinion somebody wants to gamble more power to them, but nobody should feel afraid to play because they don't want to gamble or don't feel they play well enough to gamble.
Poker is a one off, everybody feels that they're good enough to win at poker (though in fact they probably aren't), people don't feel that way about pool.
 
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Just one question...

If you had a choice, would you want to watch two unknown players betting $25,000 on a 9 ball macth race to 13 with woofing and rail betting going on for the entire time?


Or,


two well known players playing in the finals of a Dragon Promotion tournament with 1st place only $10,000?

Poker has a much worse reputation than pool ever did. And why is it so popular to watch on TV? .... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
 
I know some great players who have clean cut images. They might not be the best in the tour but they are working hard to make honest livings by getting sponsors, showing charity exhibition, offering great classes. We are lucky to have them to set positive examples and present a healthy image for pool.

Imo, playing pool for money is a complicated matter. It is not a pure form of gamble. In money pool, less luck factor is involved when compared to cards. A lot of the action have been decided when setting up the games between private parties.

Yes, it will take a real man's to have the hearts to bet high
Yes, it requites skills to negotiate a game
Yes, it can bring some raw excitement

However..

No, this can't invite new people to play pool.
No, this doesn't benefit our community.
No, this isn't a realistic way for pool players to survive.


Please note I am trying not to place moral judgments. Please accept my apology in advance if I offend anyone here. People have all the rights to do anything in private as long as it's quiet and civilized. An example: A lot of golf players today play for big money in between but I never heard anyone hustling others for a game.
 
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Tom In Cincy said:
Just one question...

Poker has a much worse reputation than pool ever did. And why is it so popular to watch on TV? ....
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I believe that it's the Rags to Riches attraction. Look what Chris Moneymaker did in the WSOP... joe blow sits on his couch slurplin' a cold one and munchin' on a bag of Cheeteos... and he can see himself in Chris's place... makin' the big score... but not so in pool.

You've got to have some serious skills to win in pool at the top level... not so much in poker... jmo. Luck plays a significant factor in poker... but only a very minor part in pool.
 
cuetable said:
I Please note I am trying not to place moral judgments. Please accept my apology in advance if I offend anyone here. People have all the rights to do anything in private as long as it's quiet and civilized. An example: A lot of golf players today play for big money in between but I never heard anyone hustling others for a game.
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The majority of the American pool culture members feel the way you do, so you are in good company! :)

However, again, there is absolutely no way one can compare golf to pool. They are apples and oranges. Pool in the United States is not a sport.

Even the hot dog-eating champion has his own commercial on TV today for Miller Lite Beer, replacing our beloved Steve Mizerak.

When eating hot dogs attracts more sponsors than pool, therein lies the problem -- NOT THE POOL PLAYERS THEMSELVES. JMHO, FWIW! :D

JAM
 
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