Has the quality difference between "custom" and "production" become negligible?

In my opinion the advantage of purchasing a custom cue is that you can have the ability to customize it before it is made, meaning you can pick the wood, the joint, the butt, design materials, etc..., which customizes the cue for you and you only. Once a custom cue has been built for someone, it really isnt custom anymore because that cue was made for someone else or could simply just be made for an open market where the cuemaker made their own choices in design, which to me is a production cue. I think many people think a cue is more special, meaningful or valuable if it made by a certain cuemaker or that a cuemaker only makes 10 cues every 6 years so that an owner feels like owning a limited production cue is more special, which to me is kind of ridiculous, but understandable. My opinion is if a person views a pool cue as a piece of art, much like myself, than it can be important what you buy. If a person just wants a cue that shoots well and has a nice hit than theres 9 zillion cues for a 100 bucks that fit the bill. I own two Blud cues, a vintage sneaky pete that hits nicely thats my player and a custom that Im now selling that also hits nicely, but I like my sneaky better :D. Next week Ill probably overpay for a tim scruggs sneaky pete that hits worse than my Blud sneaky cause it has a cool little "TS" on it. Why? Cause Im just as guilty of buying into the bullshit as the next guy. When Leonard croaks his cues will probably be worth millions. Why? Cause hes the first guy that sold a cue for 100K. And to someone, that means something :grin:. I laugh to myself because I can go buy a gorgeous vintage Brunswick Crown Gold 9 footer for $1500 which will cost me less than a vintage Scruggs cue. Hilarious. Thats like saying you can buy the farm for 100 bucks but the cow costs a 1000.
 
I've owned and played with more cues than I care to admit in the past 12 months and most of them were production cues. The quality on all of the cues was good to very good but the spliced points were uneven, the finish would bubble on metal rings, and shafts are mostly crap maple. All of the cues played ok but I did all this to decide what I really wanted out of a cue.

John Davis made my ebony/tulipwood blank in the USA. Paul Drexler (USA) will be turning that blank and my hard hitting OB+ Classic shafts that are made in the USA.

This is my cue, my length, balanced the way I want it and I have a top tier cue builder that I trust to provide me with the highest quality product.

It has been designed to play.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
 
Production vs custom

My opinion on cues has changed after buying over, well, too many, is that most of the top tier production cues, overall, are better made. Those companies simply have better equipment and engineers to design and test them. Problem is anyone can own one and therefore no status or awe factor is attached. Yep, I have many customs, yep, will buy more; but I'm just dumb. I actually know there is no cue made that will improve my game........and I hate it!
 
I agree that production cue quality is very high. Like JB, I also believe that there have been very good production cues from the past, e.g., Joss, Meucci, McDermott, Adam. If I was just starting to play, I might choose the production pathway because of the reproducibility and availability advantages the OP discusses. I still own and play occasionally with a 1985 Joss MW and a ca. 1992 Meucci SP.

I also believe that the qualities of custom cues continue to improve at least in regard to fit and finish. You don’t see uneven points or gaps in mitered veneers anymore. Inlays are much better executed with CNC technologies. Like the OP, I am not so interested in unique works of art. I play with the cues that I own. I still find that a few custom cuemakers produce cues that to me play a cut above the rest. Fortunately, I can afford the 2 custom cues that I own and enjoy as my main players. Neither cue was custom built for me.
 
No offense to custom cue makers, but I have a hard time believing some guy in his garage can match the engineering of a multi-million dollars company.

Just my opinion I guess.
 
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People here are assuming these production companies have "engineers" testing and designing cues. I highly doubt any of them have any sort of thing. You have fabricators making cues and people coming up with designs. Not much actual engineering in the true sense of the word going on. And to say one craftsman cannot "engineer" a better cue than a mega production shop is very short sided.

Kelly
 
ShootingArts said:
If the cue results in a few percent improvement in a person's game what is that worth?
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Absolutely. Fractions of a percent are worth it.

Pretty sure it was the great billiards and snooker player Joe Davis that searched for another cue for two years after his disappeared during a train trip. He said he would retire before going through that again. He also named several world class players that either retired or never returned to form after losing their cue. Equipment can't win for you but it can lose for you.
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You will note that he didn't search for a cue matching specific characteristics that he had in his old cue (or have one made to those characteristics), but rather had to TRY them all. This would seem to indicate that even in the top echelons of cue making the perfect cue (for any one person) is more a matter of luck than engineering.

To try to answer the OP's question, some mass production cues have caught up with some handmade cues. Mass production hasn't caught up with the masters and probably never will. You can't program feel and judgment into a machine.
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As a non-cue-maker, can you explain to me where you are applying feel and judgement to cue construction? When making a shaft do you adjust the taper depending on how it plays, for example?

Making a couple dozen cues a year it's silly to cut corners like that. Making dozens a day, the few pennies matter to a high production enterprise. A corner cut that won't buy a custom builder a bottle of beer may pay several salaries for an overseas manufacturer.
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Contrariwise, making dozens of cues a day give one a couple of years worth of custom-builders-experience with cues every day. That is a lot of opportunities to learn things (should one care to).

Thank you kindly.
 
gutshot said:
People here are assuming these production companies have "engineers" testing and designing cues. I highly doubt any of them have any sort of thing.
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Predator built a pool cue swinging robot, and modified their designs based on the information from it. I think that counts as engineering. Other cue makers presumably do likewise. Low Deflection shafts were invented by whom?

Thank you kindly.
 
I'm not talking about low deflection shafts, I'm talking about production cues with their standard maple shafts.
 
The difference

The biggest difference is can the workers at those overseas factory,s buy one. Can they buy a american made cue ?
 
Roar1975 said:
Once a custom cue has been built for someone, it really isnt custom anymore because that cue was made for someone else or could simply just be made for an open market where the cuemaker made their own choices in design, which to me is a production cue.
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I agree 100%. IMHO, a "custom" cue is only "custom" to the person it was made for.

A lot of people will disagree with that, but so be it.
 
Of course you're right. The importance of a thread like this is the discussion, not to declare a victor. An exchange of ideas and opinions is always beneficial and constructive if one listens and speaks with an open mind. Otherwise, it becomes like religions and politics.
 
gutshot said:
I'm not talking about low deflection shafts, I'm talking about production cues with their standard maple shafts.
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Sure, as long as we ignore anything actually engineered, then nothing is engineered, and there are no engineers. :rolleyes:

Thank you kindly.
 
Just a real random post but I work for a biotech company in the QC/QA division that produces diagnostic products and we are certified in alot of the ISO certificates: ISO9001, ISO13845....It would shock alot of you guys if you would actually see the gaps in "quality" that actually take place. Remember this is a diagnostic product that is used on living breathing people.

No offense to Bill Stroud or the factories using ISO9000, but just having those measures in place does not signify a quality product unfortunately...

It really comes down to the individual to ensure a quality product. The more hands in the pot, the more difficult that becomes.
 
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SamLambert said:
No offense to custom cue makers, but I have a hard time believing some guy in his garage can match the engineering of a multi-million dollars company.

Just my opinion I guess.
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Some "garages" would surprise you.


Skins -------------- I believe, I believe, I believe......
 
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I really don't feel like arguing about this anymore. This is utter non-sense.
 
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Cuetec aims for decent & affordable, not high-tech.
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Must be why they came out with synthetic cues .
Plane wood is not high tech. It's just nature.

I'll take a Predator over a Southwest any day, but I couldn't care less about having a cue that looks nice, I want it to play perfect and that's all that matters to me.
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No cue plays perfect.
This gap will only widen when Predator comes out with their carbon fiber shafts.
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That's funny right there .
But then again you see people on here saying low-deflection shafts are a gimmick.
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The technology behind low deflection shafts was started by custom cue makers .
In fact, most of the technologies in cues were started by custom cue makers .
 
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I really don't feel like arguing about this anymore. This is utter non-sense.
 
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I really doubt a custom cue maker has the availability of wood slates to match perfectly for radial consistency and weight and etc of every laminated shaft they make.
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Those laminated shafts are radially consistent ?
How is that ?

I really doubt a custom cue maker can make me a cue that feels 99.9% the same everytime I buy one from him.
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Those production shafts are 99.9% consistent ? Where do you get these data ?

I fully expect people to ridicule carbon fiber shafts, I will welcome them with open arms though.
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Synthetic shafts have been out for decades .

Most technologies were started by people in their garage, yes, but then a company refines the process beyond what the person in his garage can do.
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It's pool. Not rocket science .

To be honest, there is no way my opinion will change in the near future on this subject. It is simply inconceivable for me to believe someone can match, without advanced robotics, the current high-end of production pool cues.
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Funny, but the biggest factory consults with humans . Not robots.
 
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