Hiding your speed

[InTheCloudzzz]

IMO, there is absolutely no difference between feigning weakness at the pool table or feigning weakness during a hand of poker. Needless to say, I have added respect for someone who can keep someone playing over a long period of time when they have next to no chance to win. As someone else mentioned before, that is an art in itself. Just like how playing good pool is an art.

Ryan

 

[trustyrusty]

IMO, there is absolutely no difference between feigning weakness at the pool table or feigning weakness during a hand of poker. Needless to say, I have added respect for someone who can keep someone playing over a long period of time when they have next to no chance to win. As someone else mentioned before, that is an art in itself. Just like how playing good pool is an art.

Ryan

And that's the art that makes me nuts!!! I'm not chasing the money (and I mean AT ALL), so string me along, or play to your real potential = same amount of money outta me. If you look at it as getting paid, say, by the hour - then you're only screwing yourself by only beating me by a game or two per set if, in fact, I shouldn't even win a game or two per set against you.

I realize that I'm not "everyone", and the "I gotta chance" game may work on others....should I just say it up front? Look, I'll play you for whatever per set, but once I'm down this much, that's it. Would that help any? I don't go to the poolhall very often, so it's not like I'm gonna be back the next night trying to make my money back. If I'm willing to shell out $500 to play Pebble Beach for 5 hours - 1) I'm not playing the easiest (forward) tees, 2) I'm not taking mulligans, 3) I'm not picking up gimmies, 4) I'm not going to not admire all it's beauty. In other words, I want to feel that I've gotten the most for my money - a true test, and everything else that I'd expect from playing a great course. So, don't essentially tell me to take a mulligan, or pick up a putt when playing me in a (pool) match, and don't make the challenge easier thinking you can extract more coin from me if you do

 

[softshot]

IMO, there is absolutely no difference between feigning weakness at the pool table or feigning weakness during a hand of poker. Needless to say, I have added respect for someone who can keep someone playing over a long period of time when they have next to no chance to win. As someone else mentioned before, that is an art in itself. Just like how playing good pool is an art.

Ryan

smear Poop on the wall... you can call it art if you want... but it still stinks..

Huslting is just plain weak.. sounds to me like handy excuse when you lose... yea he beat me but I didn't want to show him my A game.... whatever... get over yourself..

if you are not going to bring your A game.. don't bring your cue..

 

[bikencycle]

Huslting is just plain weak.. sounds to me like handy excuse when you lose... yea he beat me but I didn't want to show him my A game.... whatever... get over yourself..

if you are not going to bring your A game.. don't bring your cue..

I agree! I enjoy going to pool halls every once in a while and my main goal is to play better players. I enjoy playing them even if I only shoot once or twice in a game. Hopefully I learn something and for whatever reason it motivates me to play to the best of my ability, which is something that is harder to do when playing an equal or lessor player.

 

[DeadPoked]

Hide some speed? I'm still trying to show some.

 

[ironman]

I think it is weak to ever play less than you are capable of, especially to basically steal someones money. Besides I am too competitive, and take too much pride in giving a full effort to lose on purpose.

This may well be, but until you have lived life on the road, it is tough to say what you will and will not resort to.

The road play is almost gone as we knew it in the past, but that life was different. The expenses or daily "Nut" was there whether you played real good or real bad. Simply, you couldn't afford to make bad games or take on losses. A couple of nights of sleeping in the car would cure that.

The true roadie back then had litle time for ego or being cool. It was about getting the money and squeezing every ounce of juice out of each nut.

Back in the day, One avoided the pool hall with the big hitters. That was a sure fire way of knocking your action. When you arrived in a town there was ususally a book on who to play and who was bad action. You look for the B players in bars and what not and take off the little money and work your way up. If you didn't have the tolerance for this, it was usually a short trip and back home working $10 entry fee tournaments and $100 scores and everyone knows that won't get you anywhere except out of stroke and almost broke.

SO, it may look like something totally off the chart and auacceptable to most, but live the life and many attitudes would change very quickly. Again, that is why few were really very good at it.

 

[Bigtruck]

Hustling

You can make good money playing pool, or you just play good pool.

If you try doing both, you will be sorely disappointed.

My game is schizophrenic. One day I play like SVB and the next day I'm a APA3!! I don't know exactly what causes it to switch back & forth, but it happens. I have some ideas but can't put a finger on it. It makes gambling with me tricky.

Some might accuse me of playing off, but when it's happening, I'm really off!! LOL.

Ray

 

[Siz]

Adopt the morality you can afford

This may well be, but until you have lived life on the road, it is tough to say what you will and will not resort to.

The road play is almost gone as we knew it in the past, but that life was different. The expenses or daily "Nut" was there whether you played real good or real bad. Simply, you couldn't afford to make bad games or take on losses. A couple of nights of sleeping in the car would cure that.

The true roadie back then had litle time for ego or being cool. It was about getting the money and squeezing every ounce of juice out of each nut.

Back in the day, One avoided the pool hall with the big hitters. That was a sure fire way of knocking your action. When you arrived in a town there was ususally a book on who to play and who was bad action. You look for the B players in bars and what not and take off the little money and work your way up. If you didn't have the tolerance for this, it was usually a short trip and back home working $10 entry fee tournaments and $100 scores and everyone knows that won't get you anywhere except out of stroke and almost broke.

SO, it may look like something totally off the chart and auacceptable to most, but live the life and many attitudes would change very quickly. Again, that is why few were really very good at it.

I'll buy this.

What it comes down to is that hiding your speed etc, is like any other other form of obtaining money by deception (better known as fraud): that is, something you might do if times are hard and you don't have any honest way of making money. Not something I would want to shout about (but then I haven't been there - yet ).

(And before anyone else says it, yes I know I am being sanctimoneous - sorry!)

 

[ironman]

I'll buy this.

What it comes down to is that hiding your speed etc, is like any other other form of obtaining money by deception (better known as fraud): that is, something you might do if times are hard and you don't have any honest way of making money. Not something I would want to shout about (but then I haven't been there - yet ).

(And before anyone else says it, yes I know I am being sanctimoneous - sorry!)

Pool and playing good pool is a very funny business and can look very funny at times. There are days when for many reasons, you just can't come with it. Out on the road it is the most aggrivating thing there is. Motels get old in a hurry, sleeping in the car and driving all night just ain't cutting it, greasy meals, a cold, a fight with the girl back home, or just plain burnout, whatever, it just ain't ahppening. So people assume he is stalling.

How many times I've seen guys in what should be soft action and he just can't get out and guess what, they all accuse him of dumping.

The road life whern going well can be great and great money but, one loss and all seems to change as the reality sets in. Then it isn't so glamarous as it may appear.

IMO, people take good players for granted way too much. Sometimes the engine just isn't tuned or hitting on all 8 as they say.It's frustrating and embarassing as well. This game requires some attitude and a gunslinger attitude and when it isn't there, a great player becomes just another player.

So the next time you see one struggling or look like he is stalling, take a good look at him and the body language before making such harsh judgements. Sometimes, it just don't work.

In todays pool world, stalling is a lost art and something few of todays pros even have a clue about.

 

[crawfish]

Pool and playing good pool is a very funny business and can look very funny at times. There are days when for many reasons, you just can't come with it. Out on the road it is the most aggrivating thing there is. Motels get old in a hurry, sleeping in the car and driving all night just ain't cutting it, greasy meals, a cold, a fight with the girl back home, or just plain burnout, whatever, it just ain't ahppening. So people assume he is stalling.

How many times I've seen guys in what should be soft action and he just can't get out and guess what, they all accuse him of dumping.

The road life whern going well can be great and great money but, one loss and all seems to change as the reality sets in. Then it isn't so glamarous as it may appear.

IMO, people take good players for granted way too much. Sometimes the engine just isn't tuned or hitting on all 8 as they say.It's frustrating and embarassing as well. This game requires some attitude and a gunslinger attitude and when it isn't there, a great player becomes just another player.

So the next time you see one struggling or look like he is stalling, take a good look at him and the body language before making such harsh judgements. Sometimes, it just don't work.

In todays pool world, stalling is a lost art and something few of todays pros even have a clue about.

I was thinking the same thing. Sometimes, you can't come outta the stall. I was gonna rep you for this, but "I must spread it around."

 

[Fatboy]

Since I have posted in a few "gambling" threads I thought I'd start this one to get a few more questions answered.

I know that hiding your true speed is a time honored tradition in billiards; my question is why? Is it to milk as much money out of an opponent as possible? Do you think playing all out, all the time will kill your action? Why is it that hustling is so revered in pool? Are the guys that have mastered this practice scared of an "even" match, therefore they try to never really show their true game? I'm not much of a gambler, nor will I ever be, but is it truly "gambling" when you set up matches based on your "shown" ability???

I know, I know, since "everyone" else does it, that evens things out....

I don't mind having to "pay" to play better players, but I think it's kinda funny how they try to disguise how much better they are. I'm not going to go chasing that money anyways, so why the act?? It must be a gambler thing, and I may never get it, but I thought I'd ask.

BTW, I am currently a 2.7 GHIN (golf handicap) and have never felt the need to lie about that either...lol :thumbup: Yes, I've run into the gambling sandbagger types in golf too... oh well! :wink:

When I needed $$$ I had to stall, For along time it was very hard for me to play good after I was on the lemon, stalling got me out of stroke. But over time and with the help of Dave Knottingham I learned how to "Push" balls around and give my customers a good show. Whan I thought of it that way and was a happy fun guy to play I got 2 things: 1. Happy Customers 2. The $$$$. It a art, acting and some pool. Thats robbing bangers/drunks(not for me).

Now stalling to play a player is the the same principals but alot more subtle because players can spot stalling easier than bangers, I never played good enough to do that(yet), I believe that a player has to be a super strong A player or better to pull that move. I play good enough to stall on a B or B- player but B- players arnt gonna have stake horses or big $$. I wish I played good enough to stall on guys that could give me the 7 or 8. I knew alot of guys who did and learned from them, Toby in Vegas was one of them and he won maybe a million stalling and trapped Archie(archie played the 8 ball lower than me back then)


Stalling is a art and when its done right it is as important or more important and playing good when you want to get the money.

 

[Fast Lenny]

When I needed $$$ I had to stall, For along time it was very hard for me to play good after I was on the lemon, stalling got me out of stroke. But over time and with the help of Dave Knottingham I learned how to "Push" balls around and give my customers a good show. Whan I thought of it that way and was a happy fun guy to play I got 2 things: 1. Happy Customers 2. The $$$$. It a art, acting and some pool. Thats robbing bangers/drunks(not for me).

Now stalling to play a player is the the same principals but alot more subtle because players can spot stalling easier than bangers, I never played good enough to do that(yet), I believe that a player has to be a super strong A player or better to pull that move. I play good enough to stall on a B or B- player but B- players arnt gonna have stake horses or big $$. I wish I played good enough to stall on guys that could give me the 7 or 8. I knew alot of guys who did and learned from them, Toby in Vegas was one of them and he won maybe a million stalling and trapped Archie(archie played the 8 ball lower than me back then)


Stalling is a art and when its done right it is as important or more important and playing good when you want to get the money.

You a hustler Eric?

 

[Fatboy]

This may well be, but until you have lived life on the road, it is tough to say what you will and will not resort to.

The road play is almost gone as we knew it in the past, but that life was different. The expenses or daily "Nut" was there whether you played real good or real bad. Simply, you couldn't afford to make bad games or take on losses. A couple of nights of sleeping in the car would cure that.

The true roadie back then had litle time for ego or being cool. It was about getting the money and squeezing every ounce of juice out of each nut.

Back in the day, One avoided the pool hall with the big hitters. That was a sure fire way of knocking your action. When you arrived in a town there was ususally a book on who to play and who was bad action. You look for the B players in bars and what not and take off the little money and work your way up. If you didn't have the tolerance for this, it was usually a short trip and back home working $10 entry fee tournaments and $100 scores and everyone knows that won't get you anywhere except out of stroke and almost broke.

SO, it may look like something totally off the chart and auacceptable to most, but live the life and many attitudes would change very quickly. Again, that is why few were really very good at it.

I had my fare share of nights in the car-so I bought a VW bus.:thumbup: I still have it to remind me where I came from, I said when I was living in it that I would park in infront of my mansion someday, I never forgot that promis I made to myself, I kept it.


Hustling is a art, being PC and playing pool dont mix, the sheep get slaughtered.

 

[Fatboy]

You a hustler Eric?

Who me? nah, I'm a salesman.

 

[mantis99]

I guess for me then, I would simply never adopt that lifestyle. Aren't you basically a con man then?

 

[Johnnyt]

Stalling, being on the lemon, hiding your speed is no different than the politicians that want your vote. They ALL lie, tell half truths, put spin on what they say what you want to hear, then when elected the they show their own Speed (agenda with the lobbyists).

A pool hustler is NO different than car dealers with the fast talk and the fine print. No different than pharmaceutical industry telling you all the good things a pill can do for you? slow, load and clear. But the bad things that the FDA makes them tell you in ads is voiced like a song with music played over it so you can barely make out what's being said. At the same time they show some scene that has absolutely nothing to do with the product the ad is for. An erection lasting over four hours is a bad thing? "Just whack it with you pen?it will go down" says my wife the RN. (Sorry lost my train of thought for a minute there)

Life is one big con/hustle, not just pool. If you don't want to be hustled at pool, don't play anyone you don't know for money, or don't play for money period. It's as simple as that. Johnnyt

 

[Fatboy]

I guess for me then, I would simply never adopt that lifestyle. Aren't you basically a con man then?

yes, absolutely 100%, is that a bad thing? I'm proud of the fact i'm a top rate one at that, think salesman are squares, other than teachers and nurses you gotta have game to survive in this land of milk and honey. I never lie to my family or friends. I'm a con artist with morals and ethics-my own code of honor not someone elses opinion.

 

[Fatboy]

Life is one big con/hustle, not just pool. If you don't want to be hustled at pool, don't play anyone you don't know for money, or don't play for money period. It's as simple as that. Johnnyt

From your lips to Gods ears, thats the truest thin ever posted here. Only people who lie to themselfs believe otherwise.

 

[ironman]

Stalling, being on the lemon, hiding your speed is no different than the politicians that want your vote. They ALL lie, tell half truths, put spin on what they say what you want to hear, then when elected the they show their own Speed (agenda with the lobbyists).

A pool hustler is NO different than car dealers with the fast talk and the fine print. No different than pharmaceutical industry telling you all the good things a pill can do for you? slow, load and clear. But the bad things that the FDA makes them tell you in ads is voiced like a song with music played over it so you can barely make out what's being said. At the same time they show some scene that has absolutely nothing to do with the product the ad is for. An erection lasting over four hours is a bad thing? "Just whack it with you pen?it will go down" says my wife the RN. (Sorry lost my train of thought for a minute there)

Life is one big con/hustle, not just pool. If you don't want to be hustled at pool, don't play anyone you don't know for money, or don't play for money period. It's as simple as that. Johnnyt

You can't hustle and an honest man!!!!!

 

[APA7]

just about a...StevenPWaldon is NOT a C player...far from it.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

And why do U say that, just becoz he can beat U?? :wink:

Brian