High $$ cues
- Thread starter TAP
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Gentlemen....and the rest of us! Thank you all for your comments. All points well taken. My meager collection has nothing in it valued over $1350., and I play with all of them. I drool every time I see a Manzino or Zinzola (I hope I've got the names right), however, I must be realistic, knowing that there is no way that I could or ever would buy a $3k-$5k. Especially one that would sit on a shelf or in a glass case. I prefer to eat and have a roof over my head.
As I stated in my OP, I mean no disrespect to any of the cuemakers. They have truly earned their reputation, and knowing a few up and coming cue makers, I see them struggling to make ends meet. They too will eventually be well known in the pool world. My hats off to all of them.
Keep your comments coming. This is a very interesting subject!
As I stated in my OP, I mean no disrespect to any of the cuemakers. They have truly earned their reputation, and knowing a few up and coming cue makers, I see them struggling to make ends meet. They too will eventually be well known in the pool world. My hats off to all of them.
Keep your comments coming. This is a very interesting subject!
It's just a perspective thing.
My "players" range in the 3-4K range and have no problem with that myself. I enjoy owning them and playing with them , it's a hobby I can afford so I do. Personally I couldn't care less what other poeple spend on thier gear.
But , just as you say you would never buy anything over your $1300 range is no different than some of the guys I play with that think your the one whose nuts cause thier $200 is as good as they think they'll ever need and they'd never spend any where close to a grand on cue!
Perspective.
My "players" range in the 3-4K range and have no problem with that myself. I enjoy owning them and playing with them , it's a hobby I can afford so I do. Personally I couldn't care less what other poeple spend on thier gear.
But , just as you say you would never buy anything over your $1300 range is no different than some of the guys I play with that think your the one whose nuts cause thier $200 is as good as they think they'll ever need and they'd never spend any where close to a grand on cue!
Perspective.
Thanks for all the replys. Are there any pro players out there that might have a comment? Is there really a difference in play between, say an $800 cue and a $5k cue? Is it true that a Szamboti (excuse any spelling errors) was made for the "old school" tables with heavy felt and "slug" cue balls? Do they really play different on today's equipment?
Really good info coming in. Keep it up!
Really good info coming in. Keep it up!
It depends on who makes the cues. An $800 wheat cue will never play like a $5k Ginacue
Regardless of playability, everybody has something that they are willing to spend money on, some like cars, baseball cards, pool cues, strippers, action figures, etc. Other people will think it stupid to spend so much on those item, but it is a personal choice on what we feel our money is well spent on.
Hope that made sense.
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Why would anyone pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for a stamp when they could just go down to the post office and buy a stamp for a few cents?
Obviously, highly collectable cues are different than a player from your local cue maker. There are many things that effect value in highly collectable cues. However, in my opinion, playability is formost whether its the very high end or a Wal-Mart special.
Now, playability or how a cue fills is at best highly subjective. This last weekend, I was at Chester's (pool hall) and was playing with my Joss (first cue I ever purchased). That night I bought a Black Boar RS2 from one of the locals. While I like my Joss and I will never sell it, the feel and playability is nowhere near the Black Boar, in my opinion.
I've owned several custom cues from many different cue makers and I can tell you there is a lot of differences in craftsmanship, fit and finish, and playability. And, of course rarity plays a big part in value. Until you develop the eye and even more importantly the appreciation for the subtle details, I'm not sure you will understand why people pay 10's of thousands for a pool cue.
Respectfully,
Steven
Obviously, highly collectable cues are different than a player from your local cue maker. There are many things that effect value in highly collectable cues. However, in my opinion, playability is formost whether its the very high end or a Wal-Mart special.
Now, playability or how a cue fills is at best highly subjective. This last weekend, I was at Chester's (pool hall) and was playing with my Joss (first cue I ever purchased). That night I bought a Black Boar RS2 from one of the locals. While I like my Joss and I will never sell it, the feel and playability is nowhere near the Black Boar, in my opinion.
I've owned several custom cues from many different cue makers and I can tell you there is a lot of differences in craftsmanship, fit and finish, and playability. And, of course rarity plays a big part in value. Until you develop the eye and even more importantly the appreciation for the subtle details, I'm not sure you will understand why people pay 10's of thousands for a pool cue.
Respectfully,
Steven
its hard to find a cue that costs $500 or less that will feel better than most $2,000-$3,000 cues. It is possible. I borrowed a orange Viking one time from a guy it was worth $80 at the time a Gus back then $1500 and the Viking played for me as good as a gus, but only that Viking. There are awalys gonna be low price cues that play great, I have cues that cost $15,000-$20,000 that suck but again its the exception to the rule.
Its not the signature, its the engeneering that goes into the cue and wood selection, tollerances and the experience of the player. A banger cant tell a good from a bad cue,.
But your right if you look around long enough you can find a $300 cue that plays good as anything, it just will take longer.
Its not the signature, its the engeneering that goes into the cue and wood selection, tollerances and the experience of the player. A banger cant tell a good from a bad cue,.
But your right if you look around long enough you can find a $300 cue that plays good as anything, it just will take longer.
your right, Szams play good on todays equipment, Bushkas IMO dont play to good on the fast cloth. the cues that were made for the old school equipment play better on old school equipment. My daily player is designed for todays equipment, with a heavy CB it dosent have enough back bone. However Ihave a friend who plays with a Joss(Stroud) he bought new in 74 and he can play on any equipment with it, but he is one hell of a player. I cant make a ball with his cue. He plays me 10/6 one pocket and is stealing, we play 9 ball I get the 7 and usually like it(he hates 9ball-my best game). point is if your a gifted player it really dont matter. I believe the middle of the road players like me are more equipment sensitive than JA, or solid A players.
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Why buy a car for $100-300k, when you can get a car with the exact same performance, safety ratings, and options for just over $30k.....or work boots for $250 when you can get a solid product for $80.....or eat a sushi dinner for $100 bucks when you and the wife can eat pizza for $10.....it's simple....choice....that, and because people can and/or want to...
Cues can be that expensive because they are old and collectible, because they were produced by a high end maker, because they have ton's of inlays, supply and demand, or simply that maker is hot right now....
You spent under $1k for your awesome cue.....no doubt somebody on this forum has a Muecci they bought used for $50 that looks nice to them and they think you are an idiot for spending anything over $100.....it's opinion based on your experience and values...
Reputation (perceived value). Or if they are the "flavor-of-the month" cuemaker on AZB.TAP said:
You'll only know for sure when the time comes to sell the cue. Caveat emptor.TAP said:
You don't have to spend big money to find a great playing cue, so long as you don't get locked into the mindset that big name cuemakers cues all play good and all other cues cannot possibly play as good.
Many people get too wrapped up in buying a "name".
I've seen tens of thousands won with cues most people on this forum wouldn't even spit at.
Hmmm
Remember, that same $5K cue hits the same as the $1K sneaky pete from the same cue maker. The $4k extra is the labor involved in designing the cue, installing all the inlays, as well as buying exotic woods and curing them. The inlay themselves are costly...ivory, silver, etc. etc.
It is also piece of art that I admire. I don't care if anyone else likes my cue or my car, I buy what I like and what I can afford. And in most cases the value will go up, not down. Picked up my Spain 33 years ago, and don't regret the "big dollars" I spent back then...$100.......
Again, like buying a car with hubcaps, no power windows and a 4 cyl engine....you could spend more to get the chrome rims, power everything and a V8,,but the car still takes you from point A to point B...But some like finer things and some don't... everybody has a weakness for stuff..i'm just glad mine is billiards and cars...because drugs and hookers are just too expensive!!!!
Remember, that same $5K cue hits the same as the $1K sneaky pete from the same cue maker. The $4k extra is the labor involved in designing the cue, installing all the inlays, as well as buying exotic woods and curing them. The inlay themselves are costly...ivory, silver, etc. etc.
It is also piece of art that I admire. I don't care if anyone else likes my cue or my car, I buy what I like and what I can afford. And in most cases the value will go up, not down. Picked up my Spain 33 years ago, and don't regret the "big dollars" I spent back then...$100.......
Again, like buying a car with hubcaps, no power windows and a 4 cyl engine....you could spend more to get the chrome rims, power everything and a V8,,but the car still takes you from point A to point B...But some like finer things and some don't... everybody has a weakness for stuff..i'm just glad mine is billiards and cars...because drugs and hookers are just too expensive!!!!
Dee Adkins just won the Brickyard this weekend. He was playing with a $20 or $30 cue it had tape on the butt almost to the joint. His kids had drawn on it. I bet that cue hit good cause i watched him play lights out with it. The feild was pretty strong and I think Dee went undefeated. Dee is a a heck of an indian who can play with any bow, this game is definitely about the indian however, when the indian wants a fancy bow there are plenty of choices available.
So what is up with the cost of a high end cue first the high end makers use good I mean real good materials. They are picky to the extreme and they do not cut corners. The best ones inlay with no glue lines, hand cut out the corners so they are very sharp. There points all line up, this means they maintain control of the center line throughout the entire series of events to build that cue. Etc and etc. This is the first part of a high dollar cue, the next step is not overloading the market with excess product. So more and more people want it and they cannot get it, so they offer more money and the price goes up. Supply and demand.
So what is up with the cost of a high end cue first the high end makers use good I mean real good materials. They are picky to the extreme and they do not cut corners. The best ones inlay with no glue lines, hand cut out the corners so they are very sharp. There points all line up, this means they maintain control of the center line throughout the entire series of events to build that cue. Etc and etc. This is the first part of a high dollar cue, the next step is not overloading the market with excess product. So more and more people want it and they cannot get it, so they offer more money and the price goes up. Supply and demand.
b/c cue making is an art form......art is not free
you base a cues price off of tangibles alone, just playability......customs are one of a kind works from an artist that paints with wood......
why's a picasso worth tens of thousands and your stick figures aint worth a penny?
B/c he gained his peers and the publics respect for his art....so they pay for it.
Thats like saying why would anyone buy an original 1964 shelby cobra instead of just buying the new mustang GT, or a ferrari that runs for 300k instead of an 65K$ viper......NO CONTEST NOT THE SAME CATEGORY
Its run of the mill compared to custom tailored.
Why do you spend $150 on some Nikes instead of the $10 sneakers at wally world..........
-Grey Ghost-
you base a cues price off of tangibles alone, just playability......customs are one of a kind works from an artist that paints with wood......
why's a picasso worth tens of thousands and your stick figures aint worth a penny?
B/c he gained his peers and the publics respect for his art....so they pay for it.
Thats like saying why would anyone buy an original 1964 shelby cobra instead of just buying the new mustang GT, or a ferrari that runs for 300k instead of an 65K$ viper......NO CONTEST NOT THE SAME CATEGORY
Its run of the mill compared to custom tailored.
Why do you spend $150 on some Nikes instead of the $10 sneakers at wally world..........
-Grey Ghost-
No I don't take my highend cues to bars or even not so great pool halls.....they go where I'm sure they will be safe, if its questionable then they go no where near the place.
In a bar some goof is liable to walk up and fall an break your cue or something.....in pool halls the patrons usually have a little more act right in them.
I have a nice straight older brunswick cue that I use in those places.
-Grey Ghost-
Slim Limpy
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I play with everyone of my cues. I may not play with everyone every day, but they all get played. And, I've played with everyone of my cue in bars and pool halls. Now, I don't own a $5,000 cue, yet. I honestly don't know if I would play with a $5,000 cue at a bar, but I would definitly play with the cue. I would not buy a cue I wouldn't or couldn't play with. In my opinion, cues were designed and built to be played. This make custom pool cue a unique type of art. I believe a piece of art was create to be enjoyed, and I can't think of any better way to enjoy a fine pool cue than to play with it.
Steven
I play with a custom cue that is as plain and simple looking as they get. The maker will not make any two completely identical cues so it qualifies as 1 of 1, but at around $500 including a normal shaft and a predator shaft it's far from really expensive. This guy sells cues up to the few thousand dollar range. Same shooting quality, but much more detailed work, much more labor involved, different inlays (I actually have no inlays at all). He thoroughly tests every cue and if something is off or he just doesn't like the feel of how it plays he doesn't sell it. He does have options for materials, joint types, and obviously shafts, but after selecting all that the difference between one of his $500 cues (which he is making fewer and fewer of) and one of his $3000 cues is entirely "artwork" differences.