Hitting center of the cue ball

[HawaiianEye]

The more you can play natural running English to achieve position the better your game will be.

What is your definition of "natural running"?

If you shoot an object ball at an angle using center ball, the cue ball will pick up "spin" from the impact with the object ball. When the cue ball then hits a rail, do you consider the "added" English from impact to be "natural" or "added"?

If you use TOI, the cue ball will come off the object ball "flat" and hit the rail with no "added" spin. It will only pick up the "natural" spin from the angle off the rails as it travels around the table. It won't have the "added" spin from the object ball impact.

For me, I like the ball hitting the first rail with no spin unless I'm attempting to put spin on the ball.

 

[jay helfert]

What is your definition of "natural running"?

If you shoot an object ball at an angle using center ball, the cue ball will pick up "spin" from the impact with the object ball. When the cue ball then hits a rail, do you consider the "added" English from impact to be "natural" or "added"?

If you use TOI, the cue ball will come off the object ball "flat" and hit the rail with no "added" spin. It will only pick up the "natural" spin from the angle off the rails as it travels around the table. It won't have the "added" spin from the object ball impact.

For me, I like the ball hitting the first rail with no spin unless I'm attempting to put spin on the ball.

I'll take door #1. :wink:

 

[ceebee]

BeiberLvr gave another good definition of rotating the stance (i.e., stepping forward or backward with either foot will give you a different address.

Good Luck

There is "One" thing I would like to add to this conversation. The use of Video & slow motion playback is invaluable to you, for making corrections. Plus you have a record for archival & playback when wanted or needed. You can even send your video to an instructor for analysis & evaluation.

What we seek is to become the player that can shoot straight, very close to perfection. Training is necessary for most of us, so when you train, do it right. Have a goal & have a process that you believe will get you on your way to success.

When you address the shot, set your aim, check your aim (similar to placing a rifle in holding fixture on a bench, sighting the rifle in, pulling the trigger & hitting the target correctly), stroke your aim, pause & pull the trigger.

Start off with attainable goals/ Up close is a starting point. When you have gained perfection of following the cue ball in after the object rolls in, stopping the cue ball at impact, in the stun shot & drawing the cue ball back at the side pockets, then move catty corner on the table & repeat the process. Give it a go.

If you can shoot straight, then aiming & control of Whitey are your next goals.

Good Luck

 

[fastone371]

Good Idea.

Now patent it, box it up and charge $29.99 on Seyberts.com as a training aid.

You could put 4 hole reinforcement rings in the box and still be slightly profitable I would guess.

The ring tab for finding center ball is a great idea !!!!

 

[slach]

If you're interested in a high-tech route, check out the QMD and the QMDLite (www.cue-md.com).

These devices are specifically designed to help you develop a straight, consistent stroke. Along with it's automatic stroke recording and graphic playback the QMD will show you where you're hitting the cue ball relative to where the tip's pointing when you start your stroke.

Both devices provide instant audible feedback while you're stroking to help you identify where your stroke is moving off line so you can adjust and be conditioned to the feel of a straight stroke.

 

[hang-the-9]

Correct in fact the opposite is true loosening the grip adds power

1

You can only do that so far on power shots before you lose the grip on the cue. You need to control the cue somewhat and for almost every player, when you shoot hard, you tense your grip and arm automatically.

 

[His Boy Elroy]

Going through the cue ball cleanly at center ball is one of the hardest things in the world to do. Very few people (players included) go through the cue ball perfectly straight. They learn to adjust to the way they hit the cue ball.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Buddy Hall made the best hit on the cue ball of any player I ever saw play. His shot had a distinctive sound that you rarely heard anywhere else, he made such a perfect hit on the ball. When he hit center ball you knew it, you could hear it. Maybe that's why his cue ball control was the best of his era as well.

Billy Johnson (Wade Crane) could also achieve a similar hit when he wanted to hit dead center on the cue ball. Those are the only two I can think of who could do that with regularity and consistency. Wu is probably the closest of the present day players to them and I haven't seen him enough to tell yet.

When a player can make a hit like Buddy did, he made the game look so effortless, the cue ball totally at his command. Mosconi had it too, even though I only saw him play in his 50's and 60's. He massaged the cue ball, more than just hitting it!

Could you clarify what you mean in your first paragraph? How exactly are they adjusting?

 

[His Boy Elroy]

Hey...Wrickyb! (post #5) Show some class when choosing avatars, would ya' ? Would you really want to bring home to mom any woman who shows up in a pool room with a top like that?

Also; she's sitting that way on purpose and she knows damn well what she's doing with the back of her cue! JEEEZE!

Take a glance at the woman in my avatar now. She's a wholesome school teacher and her kids love her as is in evidence with the 2 apples. She's wearing a modest blouse, and through no fault of her own was startled by an incident that could easily happen in any grade school classroom.

I chose that avatar for no other reason than demonstrate how difficult teaching can be. Our teachers in this nation are under appreciated and underpaid! My intention was to reveal the underside of the profession that is not glimpsed at enough. I hope, in a very small way, I opened the eyes of AZ readers to the pitfalls that sometimes strike those who teach our kids. I'm hoping some of you now look at the profession with a new appreciation......and yeah....my mom would think the world of her!

 

[jay helfert]

Could you clarify what you mean in your first paragraph? How exactly are they adjusting?

What I mean is that the way they stroke the cue determines how the tip contacts the cue ball. Once again very few players can or do go STRAIGHT through the cue ball on their stroke. Their tip is making contact coming from slightly left, slightly right or slightly up or down as it goes through the cue ball. The cue is not following a straight (or flat) plane as it goes through the final stroke.

This will have a minimal affect on a good player as they have long ago adapted to how they hit the cue ball. Remember that good pool takes a myriad of ways to contact the cue ball, so the good players develop the control they need, when making that contact, to execute the shot properly.

I didn't mean to imply that Buddy or anyone else played better than other top players. He just made a cleaner, straighter hit on the cue ball then most of them. I think it gave him an extra level of control that helped set him apart for so many years. This is only my theory and I have no proof to confirm it, unless you want to call Buddy's amazing career records as some sort of proof that he was doing something right.

One interesting exception was Keith McCready, who deliberately hit the cue ball at angles no one else was attempting. He came down on it from different positions and made the cue ball do some crazy things. Somehow he controlled these shots and his unique way of making contact with the cue ball. Better yet, he made it look easy. :grin:

 

[medallio]

I'm obsessed with Buddy stroke and tried to emulate it but it's his alone as it's not my natural timing and such. Worth a try though!

 

[His Boy Elroy]

What I mean is that the way they stroke the cue determines how the tip contacts the cue ball. Once again very few players can or do go STRAIGHT through the cue ball on their stroke. Their tip is making contact coming from slightly left, slightly right or slightly up or down as it goes through the cue ball. The cue is not following a straight (or flat) plane as it goes through the final stroke.

This will have a minimal affect on a good player as they have long ago adapted to how they hit the cue ball. Remember that good pool takes a myriad of ways to contact the cue ball, so the good players develop the control they need, when making that contact, to execute the shot properly.

I didn't mean to imply that Buddy or anyone else played better than other top players. He just made a cleaner, straighter hit on the cue ball then most of them. I think it gave him an extra level of control that helped set him apart for so many years. This is only my theory and I have no proof to confirm it, unless you want to call Buddy's amazing career records as some sort of proof that he was doing something right.

One interesting exception was Keith McCready, who deliberately hit the cue ball at angles no one else was attempting. He came down on it from different positions and made the cue ball do some crazy things. Somehow he controlled these shots and his unique way of making contact with the cue ball. Better yet, he made it look easy. :grin:

I also have a theory. I also have no proof to confirm this: I believe most top pro's are using T.O.I on the vast majority of their shots. I believe the rest are using T.O.O. I don't believe there's a single top pro in the world who shoots center ball other than when shooting straight in shots or maybe just a FEW other type shots.

You write, " Their tip is making contact coming from a slightly left, slightly right, or slightly up, or slightly up or down as it goes through the cue ball. The cue is not following a straight ( or flat ) plane as it goes through the final stroke."

OK...this means they are putting deflection on the cueball

You then go on to write, "This will have a minimal effect on a good player as they have long ago adapted to how they hit the cue ball. Remember that good pool takes a myriad of ways to contact the cue ball, so the good players develop the control they need, when making that contact, to execute the shot properly."

So if they're putting deflection on the CB and adapting to this occurrence, how can I not take this to mean that they're not adapting by deliberately putting deflection on the CB. I mean....If they're adapting, they're taking some kind of a deliberate measure to fix something. If what they're trying to fix is problems caused by unintentional deflection, which is the result of the cue not following a straight plane, how can the deliberate measure not be DELIBERATELY PUTTING DEFLECTION ON THE CUE BALL!.....This is T.O.I. In a nut shelll.

If the top pro's are only going a millimeter or 2 inside or outside of center, and the deviation from center is not detectable to the eye, that mere millimeter or 2 is quite enough when aiming at the side of the pocket and deflecting it into the center. That's the way I do it and I'm no pro. Just because it's not detectable to the eye doesn't mean that's not the way it's being done.

 

[JohnnyP]

Watch the cue ball when a pro shoots a straight in stop shot. No spin. Same thing when SVB breaks. No spin. A knuckle ball.

In my case I had a wobble in my stroke, causing me to swipe the cue ball at contact. It was really bad when I broke. Unintended left spin, making the cue ball run around the table. Yikes.

I finally fixed the problem after watching a short video by Thorsten and Mike Massey. In the video, Thorsten says the cue will show you how to turn your body:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPn3Wzp4NT8

This was the secret for me. I found the natural line of my stroking arm with respect to my body. Then all I had to do was get my dominant eye over the cue and to ignore the other eye.

It took me a lot of work but I was finally able to hit a hard shot with no unintended spin, firing knuckle balls.