How much of a difference does a cue make?

Every professional golfer that has changed equipment (brand) has struggled immediately thereafter the next season & often persists much longer before they can regain their game......Every single golfer including Tiger Woods, Jack Nicklaus, Phil Mickelson, Nick Price, Justin Rose, McElroy....everyone has become affected adversely and sometimes they switch back to what they were formerly playing or another brand.

However, when they get the clubs tweaked the way they want.....example: one more degree upright on the toe with two degrees strong......their game gets dialed in......and the ones that master that change in equipment went on to become greats. Well, owning a pool cue isn't that far off although I admit it is different. Here's the similarity.....it will take you trial and error to figure out what you like. Unless you actually embark on a comparison of cues with different features, you will never really know what you like the best. Anyone that thinks it doesn't matter is somewhat cavalier about their game and needlessly impose ceilings on how good of a player they can become.......those are the folks that still don't know "what they don't know"...different cue weights, use of bolts, balance, cue joint type & thread, , joints, ferrules, shaft sizes....shaft weight (>20%)....taper, tips, etc.

It takes awhile to figure that out and most folks just stop experimenting and just settle on something. How many people play with a 5/16x14 piloted steel joint just because that's the only cue joint they ever played? How many people know how much their cue butt and shaft weigh to comprise the actual playing weight? Do they even think that matters? Would they prefer a shaft with a different taper and if so, how would they change the taper of their current shaft....or size...or ferrule....how many folks have played with ivory ferrules.........when these folks try someone else's cue, do ask what tip is on yur cue and hardness? Duh.............so their cue weighs 19.2 ozs....what is the shaft weight ratio.......the butt weighs 15.7 ozs (so the shafts weigh 3.5 ozs. but that includes the brass receiver) but is there a weight bolt and how heavy is that hunk of metal......< 1 oz....> 1oz....? This cue could indeed weigh 19.2 ozs but the answers to the aforementioned determine how it feels when you play with that cue.

I happen to have a vert fastidious approach to my pool cues which Bob Owen and Jerry R. will readily attest. All my ivory joint cues have symmetrical cue specs and obviously, that was always my intention. It's the reason I do not own a Hercek pool cue....yet......I eventually will......it took me a long time to ultimately determine what works best for me and I rigidly adhere to these specs. However, as I earlier alluded to, for some players, the specs on the cue they play with may not be of any consequence whatsoever. I happen to think there could be another gear for them if they settled upon a cue standard and stuck with those specifications. Just keep in mind that trial and error goes a long way towards helping decide what works best for you.
 
Ok...I've read on here that Black Boar charges close to 1000 dollars for a shaft. Now, bearing in mind that opinions may vary, the Predator 314 hits like a pile of puke IMO. It performs ok, but the hit is terrible. Try to compare the hit to a Mezz or a proper custom shaft, and it's not even in the same league. I'd expect the hit of the Black Boar to run circles around the Predator, otherwise you should get your money back! Especially since the Predator is made from wood that was rejected at the matchstick factory and Black Boar uses wood that has been blessed by angels (I'm guessing, based on the price).
. Buy a Predator, no wait, don't. Buy a Mezz. You won't be sorry.........

See, this is a perfect example. I love my Predator and the fact is I just don't play as well
with anything else. Now I know I can go and get a Black Boar, or a Southwest, or
something along those lines, but I don't know that cue, it hasn't grown to be a part of my
hand, an extention of my arm. I know the taper of my 314, I know the tip. If someone took
my cue and gave me a BB or something like that, after a while I'd be used to It and playing
well with it. Yes the cue makes a difference, as long as it's your cue. Try to change to any
other cue and I would bet your game will suffer some for a while
 
I went from a production cue to a high-end custom in the last year. At first I hated it and it took me about a month before the custom stopped feeling weird in my hands.

For me weight distribution as well as overall weight between the shaft and the butt make all the difference. I also keep up with tip maintenance constantly as I feel a good tip (read: correct radius/how tall the tip is/not mushroomed) is the single most important part of a cue.

Now I cannot for the life of me use my old production cue. I guess what I'm saying is that you may see a difference when switching to a high end custom over a production but only if it has exactly the same measurements as the previous cue. Otherwise you won't really be able to tell as you would have to go through an adjustment period.

I'm the end the shaft and tip matter more than anything but here's a secret...

A great player can play with any old cue because they know how to make those little adjustments needed to bring their game back in line. It's subconscious and not something that really requires all that much effort. That player may not be all that comfortable with a house cue but it doesn't mean they can't use one. This game is all about body kinesthetics and if you can understand how your body moves you can make the adjustments needed.
 
Any good player can adjust to any cue...somewhat... BUT that doesnt mean they'll play as consistent. That said to get to a high level of play you must have talent #1, and a good, solid, consistent hitting cue to comfortable specs with a good tip that you play with on a regular basis. Many can fill that order....

So YES, the cue does matter..
 
Your Cue

There are only 4 important parts of a Cue to consider in buying a cue. 1. The Tip!!, 2. The Weight, 3. the Shaft (how straight & smooth it is), & 4. The Joint (Steel, Wood to Wood, or Phenolic)

It is important to find the right combination of these 4 elements that you are comfortable with and then stay with it. It will be the same feel in your hands every time you play, no matter where, whom, or what table you're playing. That is what leads to consistency!!

There is a certain Pride in ownership that comes from having a high dollar custom cue, but there are very few Pool Rooms that I would feel comfortable taking a $1,000+ custom cue into to play with, at least not without an armed guard!! All of those fancy inlays and designs are just decoration anyway and don't improve the playability of the Cue.

If you do walk into a Pool Room with a $1,000+ custom cue in an expensive fancy Leather Cue Case, you had better be able to play pool like Darren Appleton or Shane Van Boening, otherwise it's like hanging a Neon sign over your head that says "Hey, I'm an Idiot and I've got Money, come and get it" The Hustlers with their Sneaky Petes will be all over you!!

I may get ripped for this, but -- before I came to the forum tonight I was on the Predator website looking at all of their offerings and I was thinking I would love to be in a Pool Room and see some Idiot come walking in all geared up with Predator everything. Most of their stuff is simply a Marketing gimmick! If you can't shoot to begin with, it ain't gonna help!! That being said, my everyday player is a Predator Sneaky Pete, my second Favorite cue is my Schon Sneaky Pete Original Black Widow, both are set up identical in Tips, Joints, and Weight, only difference is the shafts. Both cost under $500 each.
 

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A great cue won't make you a great player....

....but a bad cue will make you worse.
 
I worked in a pool hall as a kid and all the way through high school. I played with almost every cue in the house...every length, every weight, every taper, etc. Some of them were new and some were probably decades old.

I also learned to repair the cues and experimented with different tips and ferrules. We used an old hand-cranked tenon cutter and had ferrules of different materials, lengths, thickness, etc. I would pick out a cue I liked and experiment until I got something that played the way I wanted it to play. If it didn't meet my expectations, I'd try something different and start all over again.

I've played as good with house cues as I have with custom cues. It is just a matter of getting something you like and getting used to it. I think the biggest concern is being able to "trust" the tip. If you have a good tip, you can do just about the same thing with any cue.

To me, balance is one of the key factors. I have several cues, with different weights, materials, joints, etc., but they are almost all balanced at around 18-19 inches.

Getting a custom cue made without knowing what you prefer is a waste of money, if you ask me.
 
Cutshot neglected to mention there's a 4th cue joint version and obviously, you can figure out what that is
from my signature.......and I happen to think it's the best cue joint to play with, or at least that's what I found.
 
Agree 100%, you just try playing without one



but on a serious note....
I think it's probably better to play with "your own cue".
That doesn't necessarily mean a $10,000 custom, but a cue that you know. The tip you're familiar with, each little nick in the shaft,
the spot on the butt you always grip that is the girth you know. It feels right.
Customs are nice, and they're cool for everyone to look at, but how much do you notice it when you are playing. Besides that, all
the ornamental ivory in the world isn't gonna make you a better player. Find the cue you like, the one that fits you, whether it's a
custom job, or a Players, learn to love it and it'll never let you down

Well said! I play with a Josey. Did I need a cue made by a respected custom cue maker to enjoy pool? Nope. Could I shoot as well with a good production cue? Probably, once I got used to it. Should I buy any cue just because a pro uses that brand? Probably not...but his or her sponsors hope I will.
 
Every professional golfer that has changed equipment (brand) has struggled immediately thereafter the next season & often persists much longer before they can regain their game......Every single golfer including Tiger Woods, Jack Nicklaus, Phil Mickelson, Nick Price, Justin Rose, McElroy....everyone has become affected adversely and sometimes they switch back to what they were formerly playing or another brand.

However, when they get the clubs tweaked the way they want.....example: one more degree upright on the toe with two degrees strong......their game gets dialed in......and the ones that master that change in equipment went on to become greats. Well, owning a pool cue isn't that far off although I admit it is different. Here's the similarity.....it will take you trial and error to figure out what you like. Unless you actually embark on a comparison of cues with different features, you will never really know what you like the best. Anyone that thinks it doesn't matter is somewhat cavalier about their game and needlessly impose ceilings on how good of a player they can become.......those are the folks that still don't know "what they don't know"...different cue weights, use of bolts, balance, cue joint type & thread, , joints, ferrules, shaft sizes....shaft weight (>20%)....taper, tips, etc.

It takes awhile to figure that out and most folks just stop experimenting and just settle on something. How many people play with a 5/16x14 piloted steel joint just because that's the only cue joint they ever played? How many people know how much their cue butt and shaft weigh to comprise the actual playing weight? Do they even think that matters? Would they prefer a shaft with a different taper and if so, how would they change the taper of their current shaft....or size...or ferrule....how many folks have played with ivory ferrules.........when these folks try someone else's cue, do ask what tip is on yur cue and hardness? Duh.............so their cue weighs 19.2 ozs....what is the shaft weight ratio.......the butt weighs 15.7 ozs (so the shafts weigh 3.5 ozs. but that includes the brass receiver) but is there a weight bolt and how heavy is that hunk of metal......< 1 oz....> 1oz....? This cue could indeed weigh 19.2 ozs but the answers to the aforementioned determine how it feels when you play with that cue.

I happen to have a vert fastidious approach to my pool cues which Bob Owen and Jerry R. will readily attest. All my ivory joint cues have symmetrical cue specs and obviously, that was always my intention. It's the reason I do not own a Hercek pool cue....yet......I eventually will......it took me a long time to ultimately determine what works best for me and I rigidly adhere to these specs. However, as I earlier alluded to, for some players, the specs on the cue they play with may not be of any consequence whatsoever. I happen to think there could be another gear for them if they settled upon a cue standard and stuck with those specifications. Just keep in mind that trial and error goes a long way towards helping decide what works best for you.

Lol. Mickelson actually rose in the rankings his first year with Callaway. Same with Sergio Garcia. And they don't struggle. The pros don't magically gain 5 strokes per round because they went to a different brand of club. Tiger went from Titleist to Nike. And he still stayed #1.

Great specs on the cues. You're still an APA 5, right? :)
 
So my conclusion is that Its nice to have good arrows but in the end It will always be the Indian not the arrow. 5% Cue 95% Player Skill....Thus you can Play just as well with a Jacoby as a Black Boar
 
So my conclusion is that Its nice to have good arrows but in the end It will always be the Indian not the arrow. 5% Cue 95% Player Skill....Thus you can Play just as well with a Jacoby as a Black Boar

I ride motorcycles as a pastime. I ride track days. There are a lot of guys that track ride that show up with 1000cc superbikes.....and they can't ride them to 60% of their full potential. Then there are guys out there on 600s, and even 300s that can absolutely destroy the track. You watch the guys on the big bikes pass on the straightaways, but in the twists, they get left behind. It's the rider, not the bike.

This same thing holds true in pool. You'll find the best players in most of your rooms playing with production cues. There may be the odd custom stick, but the vast majority will be playing with Schon, Predator, Mezz, etc.. A production cue with a good tip will play infinitely better than a custom cue with a bad tip. And you have availability and repeatability in a production cue that you don't with a custom. Let's say you have a problem with your custom stick. You crack a ferrule. Or some other issue. How do you get your hands on something that plays like your custom? With a Predator - you just borrow a teammate's Predator shaft from their cue. And it plays the same as yours. Or....you call Seyberts, and you have a new shaft tomorrow....not next year. Let's say you're at the Vegas tournament. Your 314-3 bites the big one. You run to the trade show floor, and you have another shaft in minutes. Airline loses my luggage? Shit, my cue was in there. Ok...off to the trade show to grab another Predator. Or, I could just borrow my friend's cue with the Predator shaft. You get my point. I didn't have that flexibility when I played with a Thomas Wayne.
 
I know this is going to sound rather cryptic, but, more and less than you might think. How a cue plays is all in how it feels in the hands of the person playing with it. Price and looks really are not all that important. Feel is what counts.
 
I know this is going to sound rather cryptic, but, more and less than you might think. How a cue plays is all in how it feels in the hands of the person playing with it. Price and looks really are not all that important. Feel is what counts.

"Feel" is overrated. I'd rather play with a dead hitting cue that plays lights out, than a great feeling cue that I can't do anything with. Any of the soft ferruled cues lack feel vs a harder ferrule. But they also play better. And I can change the feel of a cue by changing the tip. As long as it's reasonably straight, with a decent tip, it has the potential to run balls. It will all depend on the guy holding the cue.

Any "boost" in playing ability that comes from a new cue is a placebo effect I call "cuephoria". Ever put a cue away for awhile because you weren't sure you liked it, and then broke it out 9 months later and played well with it? The cue didn't change. Yet somehow...you have forgotten what you didn't like about it. Again...feel is subjective, is temperamental, and is vastly overrated.
 
Well, owning a pool cue isn't that far off although I admit it is different. Here's the similarity.....it will take you trial and error to figure out what you like. Unless you actually embark on a comparison of cues with different features, you will never really know what you like the best. Anyone that thinks it doesn't matter is somewhat cavalier about their game and needlessly impose ceilings on how good of a player they can become.......those are the folks that still don't know "what they don't know"...different cue weights, use of bolts, balance, cue joint type & thread, , joints, ferrules, shaft sizes....shaft weight (>20%)....taper, tips, etc.

It takes awhile to figure that out and most folks just stop experimenting and just settle on something. How many people play with a 5/16x14 piloted steel joint just because that's the only cue joint they ever played? How many people know how much their cue butt and shaft weigh to comprise the actual playing weight? Do they even think that matters? Would they prefer a shaft with a different taper and if so, how would they change the taper of their current shaft....or size...or ferrule....how many folks have played with ivory ferrules.........when these folks try someone else's cue, do ask what tip is on yur cue and hardness? Duh.............so their cue weighs 19.2 ozs....what is the shaft weight ratio.......the butt weighs 15.7 ozs (so the shafts weigh 3.5 ozs. but that includes the brass receiver) but is there a weight bolt and how heavy is that hunk of metal......< 1 oz....> 1oz....? This cue could indeed weigh 19.2 ozs but the answers to the aforementioned determine how it feels when you play with that cue.

I'm just not convinced that the average player, myself included, can detect slight variations in cues. Does a tenth of an ounce feel different? Can a player distinguish one joint from another in a blind test? Does a small change in balance really make a difference?
I do think the tip and the shaft taper matter and differences are easily detectable. And I think we have preferences, but they typically are very general.
I own a lot of cues and have owned many, many more. I like trying new-to-me cues and there's no shortage of cue makers.
I have several cues that I play well with. I'm amazed at how different the cues are: Libra, Vollmer (SS joint), Barnhart, McWorter, and a Bluegrass sneaky. I just purchased a Nitti and it played well for me right out of the package. So, I can switch cues with little detriment to my game. I'm no world beater, but I'm not a 5 either.
What's the answer? All I know is that I recommend custom cues to me friends. But I have plenty of friends that play great with production cues. They think I'm the crazy one.
 
Cutshot neglected to mention there's a 4th cue joint version and obviously, you can figure out what that is
from my signature.......and I happen to think it's the best cue joint to play with, or at least that's what I found.

And that's all completely in your head. There is no advantage to any particular joint material over another, when it comes to the performance of a cue. Anything you might say is purely subjective. And...again...what's your APA ranking? You seem to know a ton about the balance and specs on your cues. Does that translate to any real world performance numbers? Or are you still a 5?
 
I'm just not convinced that the average player, myself included, can detect slight variations in cues. Does a tenth of an ounce feel different? Can a player distinguish one joint from another in a blind test? Does a small change in balance really make a difference?
I do think the tip and the shaft taper matter and differences are easily detectable. And I think we have preferences, but they typically are very general.
I own a lot of cues and have owned many, many more. I like trying new-to-me cues and there's no shortage of cue makers.
I have several cues that I play well with. I'm amazed at how different the cues are: Libra, Vollmer (SS joint), Barnhart, McWorter, and a Bluegrass sneaky. I just purchased a Nitti and it played well for me right out of the package. So, I can switch cues with little detriment to my game. I'm no world beater, but I'm not a 5 either.
What's the answer? All I know is that I recommend custom cues to me friends. But I have plenty of friends that play great with production cues. They think I'm the crazy one.

A good cue is a good cue. Customs play well. So do production cues. If it's straight-ish, and it works for you, I could care less if it's a Sugartree or a Schon. It's all wood cut in half with a piece of leather on the end.
 
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