How Rich is Kevin Trudeau?

[Purdman]

I'm With Ya There JLW

Maybe he's changed. Who knows? For the players' sake, I hope he has. They deserve to be treated like the champions they are. So good luck to all of you on the tour. I'm rooting for you guys.

I personally would like to see the top 100 players in the world make between $75,000 and up to $100,000,000 just to start with. There is a lot of room between poverty level and $74,999. That would be a wonderful begining.

Colin, I hope you are very sucessful and live a wonderful comfortable life. I do. I honestly hope you make a few million and enjoy the hell out of your life. And continue to contribute here and help others enjoy our great sport/game. Do I hope you bankroll 50 million, hell no buddy. JMHO
Purdman

 

[Colin Colenso]

Colin-
I've said many times before that I am really hoping the IPT works out. I think the players and fans deserve to have pool back in the media spotlight. So I'm not against the IPT tour or pros getting some good paydays. But, let's all be honest about who Kevin Trudeau is and what he's done to unsuspecting consumers throughout the years. Here's a link to a good recap of KT's business ventures in the capitalist market system:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Trudeau

That doesn't sound to me like someone who has behaved in an ethical manner. Maybe he's changed. Who knows? For the players' sake, I hope he has. They deserve to be treated like the champions they are. So good luck to all of you on the tour. I'm rooting for you guys.

For the larceny convictions which were early on, there is little argument about this. I believe KT did what he did in order to deal with cash flow problems to keep his business afloat. I'm not defending this action, but it may not have been a deliberate attempt to steal.

For the convictions by the FTC, I have reservations as to their credibility or worthiness. The mainstream media tells lies everyday on the prime time news. The FTC is not a reliable watchdog, it has vested and political interests.

Big selling requires hype and the ability to manipulate. This is true for all brands, all advertising, all successful sports to a degree. If people want pool to be sold to the masses, it is part of the formula. Everyday Joes who just happen to love whacking balls around and are quite nifty at it, must appear as magical super heroes or exagerated character.

For the game to succeed in the big time of sports marketing it needs people to hype it up and make it appear larger than life.

The puritarians banned the wearing of ribbons or silk, saying that any attemptt to beautify or appeal to base desires was unethical. It was considered unethical to pursue pleasure from games or dancing. Where do we draw the line.

If we were to live in the image of god, perhaps we should not even hope for a trivial game to be celebrated. But we are fallen are pursue thrills and foolish entertainments and instant satisfaction and through this we learn.

Should we blame the candy manufacturers, the beer manucturers, the advertisers and the media that exists through their contributions? We ought to look in the mirror at our own sins or where we would give in to temptations if the price be right.

What is right or ethical may be easier to determine than to actually do, and we may not like the results of waving a magical wand that would convert the world instantly to what we might consider to be an ethical one.

Just some food for thought on a complex issue.

Colin

 

[Colin Colenso]

Maybe he's changed. Who knows? For the players' sake, I hope he has. They deserve to be treated like the champions they are. So good luck to all of you on the tour. I'm rooting for you guys.

I personally would like to see the top 100 players in the world make between $75,000 and up to $100,000,000 just to start with. There is a lot of room between poverty level and $74,999. That would be a wonderful begining.

Colin, I hope you are very sucessful and live a wonderful comfortable life. I do. I honestly hope you make a few million and enjoy the hell out of your life. And continue to contribute here and help others enjoy our great sport/game. Do I hope you bankroll 50 million, hell no buddy. JMHO
Purdman

Cheers Blud and JLW and other who wish me success on the tour and provide friendly advice and opinions on all matters.

Heck, if we agreed with friends on all matters life would be pretty boring. We can learn a lot more from a friendly debate than by fighting with enemies.

I happen to have a great deal of respect for KT for his intelligence and capacity for hard work, and fearlessness to try new things and entrepreneureal spirit.

Like any human he no doubt has flaws and has made mistakes and I'm sure I'd find subjects on which our opinion would differ.

I don't feel I'm a lackey, though to some I may appear so, and I don't feel those who raise criticisms are necessarily evil or stupid.

We do share the hope of seeing more quality pool and seeing pool players with a chance to do well out of the sport and for the general community to have a chance to share our appreciation of this game and its challenges.

 

[Gabber]

I'm not defending this action, but it may not have been a deliberate attempt to steal.

I admire your loyalty but this is too much.

G

During the early 1990s, according to a report in the Wall Street Journal, Trudeau served nearly two years in prison. In 1990, he pled guilty to larceny in a Cambridge, Massachusetts, state court in connection with $80,000 in worthless checks he had deposited at a bank. The sentencing memorandum said that he had posed as a doctor to increase his credibility with bank officials. In 1991, he pled guilty to credit-card fraud in Boston federal district court. Among his misdeeds in the federal case, he misappropriated for his own use the credit-card numbers of customers of the memory-improvement courses that he offered at the time [18].

 

[Colin Colenso]

I admire your loyalty but this is too much.

G

Gabba,
What I mean, is to contrast the thief who plots to steal your wallet versus your a businessman who lies about a truck getting a flat tire or the check getting lost in the mail so that he can escape a tight cashflow situation.

I don't support the second sort of behavior, but it is an entirely different intention. I find it in over 90% of people doing business to different degrees.

It is hardly smart business to withdraw from credit cards. It would seem to be it was done out of desperation to keep the business going, which would requiring repaying customers. Just my guess.

 

[jjinfla]

I really haven't read most of these posts but the question asks, "How rich is Kevin Trudeau?"

But I figure he must be very, very rich because all through the Orlando tournament he had a man walking behind him all the time. I figured he was there to pick up the $100 bills that would occasionally fall out of his pockets.

 

[macguy]

Gabba,
What I mean, is to contrast the thief who plots to steal your wallet versus your a businessman who lies about a truck getting a flat tire or the check getting lost in the mail so that he can escape a tight cashflow situation.

I don't support the second sort of behavior, but it is an entirely different intention. I find it in over 90% of people doing business to different degrees.

It is hardly smart business to withdraw from credit cards. It would seem to be it was done out of desperation to keep the business going, which would requiring repaying customers. Just my guess.

I am actually of the opposite opinion as far as who is the worst. Of course a killer is certainly worse then guy who skipped out on a hotel bill without paying but for crimes that are equitable the person who just robs your house may not be as bad as the person who takes advantage or your trust or friendship to rob you. All you have in this world is trust. Trust when you pay for a service it will be done right. Trust you are not being lied to when you are given important information. Trust when you let a friend in your house they won't fill their pockets with you possessions, Trust when you give someone your credit card like we do everyday, they won't misuse the information. I could go on but you know what I mean we can't function without being able to trust.

Taking advantage of someones trust and then deceiving them, someone who thought you were their friend may be one of the worst kinds of crimes. It undermines all we are as a people, I would like to think my neighbor who has a key to my house isn't stealing when I am gone. There are no locks that can protect you from people like, and they are completely different and worse then the common thief in my opinion, they steal not only what they came after but your trust in all human beings. The term "Con man" comes from "confidence man", someone who gains your confidence and then uses your trust of them to deceive you, it is a horrendous crime.

I, like many on this board I am sure, have had both happen to me. I was pissed when I found my house broken into once but got over it pretty quick, they just stole some crap that I can easily replace. I was very hurt though when I found a good friend had stolen from me and sold my possessions when I was on my honeymoon, a person who I let live in my house. That was 25 years ago and just sitting here writing this brings up the feelings I had when it happened. It's a worse crime by far then the common thief in the night. I have to add this little story because it comes to mind as I am sitting here. The day my mother died she was taken to the hospital by ambulance and died shortly after. When we went in to see her, her wedding ring was gone. it was not a common ring but a ring that would get the attention of a thief, she wore it for over forty years. When I asked about it they said they didn't know anything about it. it had been stolen either in the ambulance or by one of the people in the hospital. I raised a big stink but was told it may have been taken by anyone maybe just a visitor. She had no visitors she died almost as soon as she got there. My mother had arthritis and her hands were so swollen it would have to have been cut off. You are supposed to trust these people with your life and you can't even trust them not to steal from you.

 

[chefjeff]

Colin-
I've said many times before that I am really hoping the IPT works out. I think the players and fans deserve to have pool back in the media spotlight. So I'm not against the IPT tour or pros getting some good paydays. But, let's all be honest about who Kevin Trudeau is and what he's done to unsuspecting consumers throughout the years. Here's a link to a good recap of KT's business ventures in the capitalist market system:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Trudeau

That doesn't sound to me like someone who has behaved in an ethical manner. Maybe he's changed. Who knows? For the players' sake, I hope he has. They deserve to be treated like the champions they are. So good luck to all of you on the tour. I'm rooting for you guys.

Thanks for the link...

Since we're talking about buyer beware, it should be noted that Wikipedia is NOT an "encyclopedia" in the classical sense, but is actually built by various individuals posting their information. That information is NOT run through the 5-10 editors that real encyclodpedia companies use, therefore, the information isn't necessarily accurate in an objective sense. Sometimes Wikipedia is correct, but they don't have the filtering processes necessary to fully trust every article. More work is required by the reader, imho.

fyi,

Jeff Livingston

 

[Colin Colenso]

I am actually of the opposite opinion as far as who is the worst.

There is a big difference between a con man who gains your trust so that they can steal from you and a businessman who tells you his computer crashed, or the accountant is sick in order to delay a payment because he doesn't want his customers to know he has a cash flow problem.

Yes they are both breaches of confidence, but differ in intent to harm others, or to the degree of harm intended.

I've had business partners, some successful tell me I was too honest, but I believe that is the best way. Still, sometimes that can mean that you just tell your customers / clients too much. We all play roles and attempt to portray ourselves as something more or better than we actually are...do some degree.

I think we need to look at any particular action and the thinking behind it to access its relative wrongness, or indication of faulty character.

Let he who is without sin cast the first pool ball!

 

[macguy]

There is a big difference between a con man who gains your trust so that they can steal from you and a businessman who tells you his computer crashed, or the accountant is sick in order to delay a payment because he doesn't want his customers to know he has a cash flow problem.

Yes they are both breaches of confidence, but differ in intent to harm others, or to the degree of harm intended.

I've had business partners, some successful tell me I was too honest, but I believe that is the best way. Still, sometimes that can mean that you just tell your customers / clients too much. We all play roles and attempt to portray ourselves as something more or better than we actually are...do some degree.

I think we need to look at any particular action and the thinking behind it to access its relative wrongness, or indication of faulty character.

Let he who is without sin cast the first pool ball!

From the court document regarding Kevin
------------------------------------------------------------
defendant herein, pursuant to a common and continuing scheme and plan, knowingly and with intent to defraud, did use unauthorized access devices to obtain things of value aggregating more than $1,000 during a one-year period, in that KEVIN TRUDEAU fraudulently used the following credit cards:

American Express No. 3728-389563-23003
American Express No. 3782-077975-41005
American Express No. 3719-033229-13019
American Express Nos. B=3719-033229-12003, 3782-005450-51012
American Express Nos. B=3782-055450-51004, 3783-639201-31006

thereby defrauding and obtaining from American Express, $122,735.68, more or less, and
affecting interstate and foreign commerce.

----------------------
There is no mistake here as to his intent. These are not the actions you like to portray as innocent fibs. I won't pursue this any more, I would like to believe you are smarter then this. Your defense of the man is just a farce that I can't for the life of me understand. Is there no honesty in anyone once they become involved with this group? Are you all afraid of him or afraid you will lose your spot. If that is the case then say nothing rather then spinning lies for him, it is beneath you all, I would like to think so anyway. Were you all this dishonest in your former lives before the IPT? I really don't know what else to say any more other then he seems to wield a corrupting influence over all of you. I hope when this is over, most of you will still have at least the shell of what was your former integrity and honesty and can get back to your lives what ever they were.

 

[Colin Colenso]

From the court document regarding Kevin
------------------------------------------------------------
defendant herein, pursuant to a common and continuing scheme and plan, knowingly and with intent to defraud, did use unauthorized access devices to obtain things of value aggregating more than $1,000 during a one-year period, in that KEVIN TRUDEAU fraudulently used the following credit cards:

American Express No. 3728-389563-23003
American Express No. 3782-077975-41005
American Express No. 3719-033229-13019
American Express Nos. B=3719-033229-12003, 3782-005450-51012
American Express Nos. B=3782-055450-51004, 3783-639201-31006

thereby defrauding and obtaining from American Express, $122,735.68, more or less, and
affecting interstate and foreign commerce.

----------------------
There is no mistake here as to his intent. These are not the actions you like to portray as innocent fibs. I won't pursue this any more, I would like to believe you are smarter then this. Your defense of the man is just a farce that I can't for the life of me understand. Is there no honesty in anyone once they become involved with this group? Are you all afraid of him or afraid you will lose your spot. If that is the case then say nothing rather then spinning lies for him, it is beneath you all, I would like to think so anyway. Were you all this dishonest in your former lives before the IPT? I really don't know what else to say any more other then he seems to wield a corrupting influence over all of you. I hope when this is over, most of you will still have at least the shell of what was your former integrity and honesty and can get back to your lives what ever they were.

I never once defended his action in that case was right, and neither did KT.

What you posted does not give means to conclude intent.

You compare this action to a murderer or house breaking thief. I defended that comparison, and with good reason that I think appeals to anyone of clear reasoning.

I don't feel you are representing my position or considering my points objectively, nor have you shedded any light on the topic by merely rehashing what is already known, albeit, with your own prejudice added for sour taste.

I don't say this out of a wish to attack you, but out of respect for fellow readers who would benefit from a reasonable examination of the facts.

You suggested that I am spinning lies. I suggest you back this up by quoting one???

 

[Rude Dog]

From the court document regarding Kevin
------------------------------------------------------------
defendant herein, pursuant to a common and continuing scheme and plan, knowingly and with intent to defraud, did use unauthorized access devices to obtain things of value aggregating more than $1,000 during a one-year period, in that KEVIN TRUDEAU fraudulently used the following credit cards:

American Express No. 3728-389563-23003
American Express No. 3782-077975-41005
American Express No. 3719-033229-13019
American Express Nos. B=3719-033229-12003, 3782-005450-51012
American Express Nos. B=3782-055450-51004, 3783-639201-31006

thereby defrauding and obtaining from American Express, $122,735.68, more or less, and
affecting interstate and foreign commerce.

----------------------

I'm pondering another thought here, are these cards still active?

 

[jjinfla]

From the court document regarding Kevin
------------------------------------------------------------
Your defense of the man is just a farce that I can't for the life of me understand. Is there no honesty in anyone once they become involved with this group? Are you all afraid of him or afraid you will lose your spot. If that is the case then say nothing rather then spinning lies for him, it is beneath you all, I would like to think so anyway. Were you all this dishonest in your former lives before the IPT? I really don't know what else to say any more other then he seems to wield a corrupting influence over all of you. I hope when this is over, most of you will still have at least the shell of what was your former integrity and honesty and can get back to your lives what ever they were.

Man oh Man Macguy you are the master! I thought I was good at laying out a guilt trip on people but I bow to your superiority. You are goooood.

I hope no one falls for it.

The only part you left out is for them to pray to Jesus and hope he has mercy on their souls.

LOL

Jake

 

[uwate]

Pool has gotten the biggest lucky roll in its history by landing KT's backing.

KT has already paid out over a million to the pool players and people are still griping. It's mind boggling.

 

[rackmsuckr]

Perhaps financially but he is bankrupt in the ethics department! This is for all you YES men out there who can't see past a few dollar signs.
Purdman

This is also to MacGuy - We have all done things that were morally or ethically wrong, that we're not proud of. I myself lived with my 2 husbands before marriage (not at the same time!) which goes against my moral training. I have made California stops at stop signs which is illegal and even done some speeding.

I also think that you can change if it becomes a life-altering experience. He hurt people. He realizes that now. When that experience humbles you and makes you become accountable, it can become an epiphany. He is not the only one that has sat in a jail cell and said I have truly hit bottom and I am going to make it again, maybe dedicate myself to enriching others in the process. I truly believe Kevin wants to help people lead long productive lives through his book. Of course he is great at hawking the book, but kudos to him for having the chutzpah and knowledge on how to get on tv.

How long will he need to atone for his very public sins to satisfy all of you? He does not try to hide his deeds and as far as I know, since then he has gone out of his way to make them public and acknowledge them and do good things with his money. Let's move past that and see what he is focusing on for pool's future.

As in the EBS scandal that is occurring right now, my antennae are raised when someone misrepresents themselves, and KT is no exception. I don't feel he has misrepresented himself anywhere to us. If he had, my views (and Colin's) would be very different. At some point, yes, we are going to have to give out our SSN's for tax purposes and I am freely going to give it. KT has done nothing but give for pool and is not asking for anything exorbitant from any of the players.

 

[2wld4u]

all I can say is Im not paying 2G to enter. KT can sponcer me for all the nice things Ive said about him...


2wld4u

 

[macguy]

This is also to MacGuy - We have all done things that were morally or ethically wrong, that we're not proud of. I myself lived with my 2 husbands before marriage (not at the same time!) which goes against my moral training. I have made California stops at stop signs which is illegal and even done some speeding.

I also think that you can change if it becomes a life-altering experience. He hurt people. He realizes that now. When that experience humbles you and makes you become accountable, it can become an epiphany. He is not the only one that has sat in a jail cell and said I have truly hit bottom and I am going to make it again, maybe dedicate myself to enriching others in the process. I truly believe Kevin wants to help people lead long productive lives through his book. Of course he is great at hawking the book, but kudos to him for having the chutzpah and knowledge on how to get on tv.

How long will he need to atone for his very public sins to satisfy all of you? He does not try to hide his deeds and as far as I know, since then he has gone out of his way to make them public and acknowledge them and do good things with his money. Let's move past that and see what he is focusing on for pool's future.

As in the EBS scandal that is occurring right now, my antennae are raised when someone misrepresents themselves, and KT is no exception. I don't feel he has misrepresented himself anywhere to us. If he had, my views (and Colin's) would be very different. At some point, yes, we are going to have to give out our SSN's for tax purposes and I am freely going to give it. KT has done nothing but give for pool and is not asking for anything exorbitant from any of the players.

I am only answering this because you addressed it to me. I am afraid he has not atoned for anything, he has just gotten better at what he does. We are not talking about past deeds it is a never ending pattern of behavior. Read a recent warning from the New York Consumer Protection Board about him.

http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/pressreleases/2005/october272005.htm

I guess they are all lying and everybody is just out to get poor Kevin, especially those whose money he has only recently stolen from their credit cards. Linda, Linda, Linda, you have picked the wrong guy to defend. Save your sympathies for his current victims. This is not nay saying about the IPT as I am sure I will be accused of, it is about Kevin which is the title of this thread that you started. It has nothing to do with the tour. At some point Linda even you are going to have to call a spade a spade.

Be sure to check this out as well
http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/pressreleases/2005/trudeauscan.htm

 

[rackmsuckr]

I am only answering this because you addressed it to me. I am afraid he has not atoned for anything, he has just gotten better at what he does. We are not talking about past deeds it is a never ending pattern of behavior. Read a recent warning from the New York Consumer Protection Board about him.

http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/pressreleases/2005/october272005.htm

I guess they are all lying and everybody is just out to get poor Kevin, especially those whose money he has only recently stolen from their credit cards. Linda, Linda, Linda, you have picked the wrong guy to defend. Save your sympathies for his current victims. This is not nay saying about the IPT as I am sure I will be accused of, it is about Kevin which is the title of this thread that you started. It has nothing to do with the tour. At some point Linda even yuo are going to have to call a spade a spade.

I doubt Kevin himself is personally sitting in a booth processing everyone's credit cards and selling his mailing list. I have gotten tons of junk mail from other sources because I was on a list somewhere else. I get tons of spam from signing up for something somewhere else. It's pretty common practice for a M.O. company to sell their lists.

I have been charged extra times for extra things from other mail order companies. Eventually, we got it resolved. Out of the thousands of orders, could there be operator error in the way the charges are set up (as recurring, or the wrong dollar amount being entered?) in a few cases? Yes.

Is he culpable for the extra charges because it is his company? Absolutely. We don't know if he has taken steps to rectify what others in his organization may have mistakenly authorized to charge these customers either. I hope he has made that his policy. Being the marketing whiz he is, he surely knows that a couple bad experiences with customers can be exponentially negative. We don't know what the final outcomes of these stories are. And you are also forgetting the thousands that had successful transactions, and the ones that think he is doing a service to them with his book.

I don't know the background of every person who starts a tour, nor do I necessarily care. I just go to play. If the money comes through and promises are kept, then that is a success in my book.

 

[macguy]

I don't know the background of every person who starts a tour, nor do I necessarily care. I just go to play. If the money comes through and promises are kept, then that is a success in my book.

That is the bottom line, play on the tour but don't be anybodies fool. You and I both know the truth.

 

[JLW]

There is a big difference between a con man who gains your trust so that they can steal from you and a businessman who tells you his computer crashed, or the accountant is sick in order to delay a payment because he doesn't want his customers to know he has a cash flow problem.

Yes they are both breaches of confidence, but differ in intent to harm others, or to the degree of harm intended.

I've had business partners, some successful tell me I was too honest, but I believe that is the best way. Still, sometimes that can mean that you just tell your customers / clients too much. We all play roles and attempt to portray ourselves as something more or better than we actually are...do some degree.

I think we need to look at any particular action and the thinking behind it to access its relative wrongness, or indication of faulty character.

Let he who is without sin cast the first pool ball!

It's funny you should bring this up Colin, because this is exactly what I find most reprehensible about some of KT's actions. His misleading desperate people in order to get their money. He peddles fake cures.

As I stated earlier, my father died from lung cancer. I was with him as the disease progressed and he grew more frail, eventually dying (with my sister and me at his side). My father did not know who KT was. But, undoubtedly, many desperate people have looked to KT's Natural Cures in their darkest moments. Hoping for a cure for a disease they or a loved one had. What did they find? A scam. I'm sorry. I wish you guys all the success in the world, but someone who would do that is IMHO a piece of SH&T!

As far as what KT says now- You want to know who a person is? You don't listen to what they say, you look at what they do. What a person does defines who they are.

Peace.