How to stay motivated (and other questions)

[Aten]

Recently I've been putting in some work to try and get my terrible habits and mechanics fixed while I'm still fairly new to the game. There's a couple issues arising for me though; mainly, I'm noticing that some of the fixes make my playing feel very awkward and uncomfortable. While the changes sometimes produce results, it seems like I'm even more inconsistent than I used to be and I miss the very easiest of shots.

All that said, a more experienced player told me that in the earlier stages of attempts to fix mechanics, results don't always show immediately so I shouldn't get frustrated. I've tried to stay positive but the more I play the more these changes become taxing on my mentality.

My main question is... what can I do to keep myself motivated to keep working at my changed game despite not seeing any improvements? Additionally, I've also been told that I should just play the game as comfortably and naturally as possible, but honestly everything about my "natural and comfortable" fundamentals is just horrendous. My stance is unbalanced, my line of sight is never actually in line with my stroke, my elbow drop causes me to hit the cue ball in a different spot from where I am, and my stroke is more of an awkward jab than an actual stroke. I've obviously adapted a bit to subconsciously compensate, but my consistency is nowhere near where I want it to be and I just want to fix my flaws as early as possible.

Also, I seem to be alright whenever a more experienced player is beside me to watch me go through my motions and fix my errors, but when I'm practicing alone I become completely uncertain of myself ("what if the reason I'm missing everything is really that I'm not actually fixing everything properly?"). What can I do about this?

 

[scratchs]

Self awareness can kill...when in the pool hall look around,look for a few heavy hitters an watch them for awhile an see if you can answer some of your question on your own.seems you lack confindence in your ability as well..judgement will slow your rytjemdown..you say you feel better about yourself while playing with better players..there is your answer for now..pay for some lessons an explain this to your
Instuctor,he may be able to help you..theres nothing I can say that you probably don't know already..it all takes work,but the more people you play,how often you play,an your understanding of the game will depend on how soon you'll advance..sorry thats about all I got for you..
Enjoy your weekend

 

[JoeW]

Standard answer from psychology is that you should succeed 85 -90% of the time during practice. As your skills increase practice can be made to be more difficult.

 

[Pushout]

As you make changes in your game in any form, stance, address, {psr} aiming, stroke, follow through, noticeable improvement won't come right away all the time. As you continue to execute the changes in your mechanics, you will notice improvement over time. Things will probably feel very uncomfortable at first and for good reason. You'll be making changes in what you've done for some time and that will make you feel "off" until the changes become natural.
Stick with it and if the changes are right, you'll feel it.

 

[genomachino]

I'll help you, just call............

Recently I've been putting in some work to try and get my terrible habits and mechanics fixed while I'm still fairly new to the game. There's a couple issues arising for me though; mainly, I'm noticing that some of the fixes make my playing feel very awkward and uncomfortable. While the changes sometimes produce results, it seems like I'm even more inconsistent than I used to be and I miss the very easiest of shots.

All that said, a more experienced player told me that in the earlier stages of attempts to fix mechanics, results don't always show immediately so I shouldn't get frustrated. I've tried to stay positive but the more I play the more these changes become taxing on my mentality.

My main question is... what can I do to keep myself motivated to keep working at my changed game despite not seeing any improvements? Additionally, I've also been told that I should just play the game as comfortably and naturally as possible, but honestly everything about my "natural and comfortable" fundamentals is just horrendous. My stance is unbalanced, my line of sight is never actually in line with my stroke, my elbow drop causes me to hit the cue ball in a different spot from where I am, and my stroke is more of an awkward jab than an actual stroke. I've obviously adapted a bit to subconsciously compensate, but my consistency is nowhere near where I want it to be and I just want to fix my flaws as early as possible.

Also, I seem to be alright whenever a more experienced player is beside me to watch me go through my motions and fix my errors, but when I'm practicing alone I become completely uncertain of myself ("what if the reason I'm missing everything is really that I'm not actually fixing everything properly?"). What can I do about this?

Hi there Aten,

There is a reason for what is happening to you. it is happening to every player on the planet.

If you do not know exactly where the eyes need to be it is almost impossible to have them in the most perfect position on each shot. This is why you can get down on a shot and you think it looks good but you miss it by a mile.

The problem is the non dominant eye has taken over a little and gives you a false picture. Not knowing where the eyes absolutely need to be will allow this to happen over and over.

For example, if you were a hunter and shooting a gun at a running animal you would never be able to see which way you were missing because there is no way to check it. You would just keep missing. Fortuanately we can take the gun and shoot at a target and get it sighted in.

I will teach you how to find the sight on your pool shot. there is only one spot to be at. Once you learn where this is and how to find it you can reach your true potential.

I've been doing free phone lessons on here with Perfect aim while I've been healing up from an accident. I finally got back to work but if you call me some night after 8:00 PM I should be done working and i will teach you this amazing technique.

Just be by a pool table and I'll run you through it. It will take about 1/2 hour. I did 118 free phone lessons on here and I had no complaints. Everyone was pretty amazed at what they learned.

This will tell you what you are looking for. It is the solution. And it won't cost you a dime to call and learn this. Just glad to help.

Just give me a call. 715-563-8712 or 920-840-5296

Talk to you soon....... geno............

 

[mattb]

Motivation

Find other players you can practice and share with that bring out something in you. Preferrably someone at your skill level or above and hopefully someone that will help you when you are working on things instead of ridicule you.

Stay the heck away from leagues as these seem to bring out the worst in people (maybe just my experiences with it).

 

[Ghosst]

My main question is... what can I do to keep myself motivated to keep working at my changed game despite not seeing any improvements?

Ask yourself two questions:

1) Is there something else you'd rather be doing?
2) What level of player do you want to be?

Answer 1) If there was something else I wanted to do, I'd take my cue apart and go do it. This is a sport that requires very fine control if you want to excel at it.

Answer 2) If you want to be more than an average smash-em-up player it will take time. My focus is that I want more improvement so I put the time in.

Now how do you make that fun? The IPAT drills are fun for me, but not everyone has the patience or focus to do them. For me, it's a challenge to move from one drill to the next while attaining the best score possible. Even a simple stroke drill can be challenging. Small-area position play is fun and challenging and enforces more than just banging balls into random pockets without really learning much.

If you were learning the piano, you wouldn't start out with the notes and then move into Mozart. You might get a few of the strokes right, but without the ability to play it wouldn't be much fun or pleasant on the ears. It takes chopsticks. That song sucks. But it's where it starts.

I find pool to be addictive, a drug. The pursuit of excellence is challenging and difficult but getting there and seeing the results of the hard work is rewarding. It makes me go back for more drills. Because I caught a glimpse of what's at the end of it.

I think people get tired when they do the same drills over and over. If they master one drill, it's time to move up a notch. But if they just keep repeating the "L" (for example) it can get stale. It's also frustrating if you can't get past the bend. If that's the case it's time to change some things. I wonder if this is where you are: stuck and frustrated?

This is a simple drill I use at the start of a match to get myself in stroke. It looks deceptively easy, all you have to do is pot the 1 and get the CB to follow it into the pocket. If your aim or stroke is off it will show up right away.

CueTable Help

If I get through the whole ballset and then do it from the opposite side I play the same drill but instead of following my CB into the pocket I draw it straight back into the pocket I'm aiming over. Once that's done I'm ready to play.

If this is too challenging then move back to an up-and-down the table stroke test (Page 3). The key is to find some level where you can accomplish the goal but it's not so easy that you get bored.

When you change something fundamental it's brutal on your game. But it's no fun to lose if you're sitting there punishing yourself for missing an easy shot. The fun here isn't always the drill, it's knowing what will happen when you master them.

To put my long-windedness into context I began playing again last year after 7 years away from the table. It took me a while to get back into shape and when my game had almost come back I had some health concerns that made me stop playing. 6 months later I was back for the second time and now my game was horrid. I couldn't get anything to work and while I could pot some balls my position was just a disaster, or I missed easy shots, put too much power on others. I looked like a banger with an expensive stick and no knowledge of which end to point at the table. It was really frustrating because I had worked so long and so hard to get to where I was only to be sidelined.

I gave up pride and asked for some help here. I got whitewashed with, "fix this", "fix that", "you're doing this wrong", "this is bad". All of the things that were wrong were mechanics I thought I'd fixed. But I listened because I respect the instructors. As soon as I started to fix those fundamentals my game went even further down, but I had expected that. The drills were (and are) a slow road back to where the level I want to play at.

The fun and motivation comes from seeing my improvement.

 

[Sam Waltz]

Higher truth

I highly recommend seeking out a professional instructor in your area if available. Don't ignore the "experienced" players, but there is a far and vast difference between a great player and a great instructor and opening your mind to the correct choice can mean all the difference in the world.

One more thing...it takes 21 days, yeah 3 weeks, to make a conscious effort into a habitual action so please don't let your frustration make you digress back to your former playing style. When your new stroke starts to become part of you without thought, then you will begin reaping the benefits of your hard work. Best of luck! Ahhh-soooo, don't forget to breathe either...very important! :thumbup:

 

[Scott Lee]

Sage advice, once again...from none other than Pocket Point #66! Hi Pocket Point! Do you really even play pool?

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I will give you the answer to all your questions.............

When the time comes when you truly wish to improve, you will do so. You will achieve a level of focus that you just were never able to before. Everything will begin to fall into place. You don't need to be taught a specific way to stand and hit the ball.

You will naturally work your way towards the perfect fundamentals FOR YOU.

Someone cannot tell you where to place your head, because every person is different. Sure, they can tell you approximately what you should do, but only you can get yourself in perfect alignment.

And the only way you will achieve perfect alignment is with a supreme focus, which takes a great amount of dedication to achieve.

That is why the pros are pros. Pool is their life, and it is on their mind all the time. For the average person, pool only takes up a small percentage of their brain power. So they are not even capable of developing perfect fundamentals. They can get close to perfect through instruction and so forth, but they will never find that perfect stroke because it takes so much concentration.

I hope that makes sense. I will give off more advice as this thread develops.

 

[Scott Lee]

Sam Waltz...This is true...as an average. Some are shorter, some take longer. I have seen people make changes, and pick it up in a week (meaning they are able to implement the changes into their competitive game), and likewise I have seen people make changes, and not have them ingrained even 6 months later. Usually the failure has do to some improper training, an inconsistent approach, or unrealistic expectations. 21 days is a psychological model. Works for many, but everyone is different.

To the OP...There is no "quick fix". You have to understand what it is you want to change, what to do to change it, and have the desire and dedication to stick with it, until the change becomes a habit. You can't "fix" things while you play...different mindsets and different skill sets. You can't fix what you don't know about...you can't fix what you can't measure...and you can only fix one thing at a time!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

One more thing...it takes 21 days, yeah 3 weeks, to make a conscious effort into a habitual action so please don't let your frustration make you digress back to your former playing style. When your new stroke starts to become part of you without thought, then you will begin reaping the benefits of your hard work. ! :thumbup:

 

[Sam Waltz]

Correct sir!

You are absolutely correct about the timeline Scott. 21 days is a baseline, but it's different for every individual for sure. I think the most important part for the OP to understand is the true importance of high quality instruction. Sounds like he's on the right path though so I hope he sticks with it.

 

[Aten]

Ask yourself two questions:

1) Is there something else you'd rather be doing?
2) What level of player do you want to be?

1. Nope
2. I have some crazy dreams, but for now I just want to not stop improving. I'm not afraid to work hard and in the past I have often spent 10 hours+ at a time practicing. Maybe I'm just being particularly impatient not because I'm not improving, but because I can't even do simple things which used to be reflex to me.

I don't think I'm at a point where I'm "stuck" and getting frustrated because I'm not doing things that are pushing me (if that's what you meant). I am a very beginner player and that's not an exaggeration; a lot of my exasperation comes from missing even straight shots.

I think the biggest issue for me at the moment is definitely alignment. I know attempting to fix too much at a time can be counter-productive, but without a doubt if I had to pinpoint one problem I'd work on first personally would be the way I aim a shot.

I'm conscious of the fact that when I get down on a shot, my head is very even. I know for certain that I am left eye dominant, but I shoot right handed so whenever I attempt to place my left eye over my stroke, I feel as if my entire body is skewed.

@ Geno I will definitely try to give you a call next time I'm in the hall. I'm in Canada however, so I need to grab myself some long distance minutes first. Thanks for the offer!

@mattb What makes you say that? I just started league actually, and it's my first time playing pool in anything more competitive than just random games with friends. So far, it's been fairly challenging but I've already learned a thing or two.

@ Scott Lee thanks for the pointers! If I do a self-assessment of the one point in your list which I have trouble with, it's "what to do to fix it". For something like changing stroke length, it's easy to correct because you can see clearly how far your hand is from the CB. However, because my main trouble is alignment and its something that can be easily distorted, I'm not sure how I can measure how far I really am from the perfect line. On another note, would it be a good idea to get a measles ball, line the dot with the OB while standing up, and then stroke to get used to the "correct spot"?

 

[Scott Lee]

Aten...I think a striped ball, put with the stripe straight up would be better. Very tough to "see" a vertical axis line on a cueball...even the measle ball. At least with the stripe you can 'aim' at the center of the stripe, and then see the chalk mark. Of course the real proof is what the CB does after it hits a the rail (shooting up and down the centerline, for example).

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

@ Scott Lee thanks for the pointers! If I do a self-assessment of the one point in your list which I have trouble with, it's "what to do to fix it". For something like changing stroke length, it's easy to correct because you can see clearly how far your hand is from the CB. However, because my main trouble is alignment and its something that can be easily distorted, I'm not sure how I can measure how far I really am from the perfect line. On another note, would it be a good idea to get a measles ball, line the dot with the OB while standing up, and then stroke to get used to the "correct spot"?

 

[C.Milian]

If you are young its easy. If you aren't done with mechanics by I say 35, you should lose the motivation to train. At a stage in your pool development, and this is only the beginning, torture of the body stage, you will have to endure 6-8 hrs of intensity, only to wake up eating everything in sight. Then, gradually the training sessions lighten up in time, but recovery time takes longer. It's pretty demanding.

It will be worth it. Your body will be very strong.

 

[Ghosst]

I'm in Canada however

Where about in Canada?

 

[Aten]

Where about in Canada?

Ottawa area

 

[Island Drive]

Without seeing you play, I can make NO recommendaitions other than take your time and seek out a qualified instructor. Few players have the drive, the time and all thats needed to bang em around all day long for years and get better only getting there allot slower and creating bad habits. The love of the game grabs a few and won't let em go, to others will get frustrated and consider and do give up. Luckily there are instructors out there, years ago they wern't as prevalant. I had to go to Wisconsin as a young man to Sailors for my first lesson in the sixties, luckily he was somewhat close.
Good luck, dont' give up, its a Lifetime game.

One other thing, never expect too much with this game, each step is a giant baby step, and there are Allot of steps, and you can't learn it all.

 

[Ghosst]

Ottawa area

I haven't played out that way for years, and everyone I did know there who could play well has since moved away. You could try the "Canadian Pool" forum, there might be someone nearby.

 

[7forlife]

Hey is my $0.02..........and don't take anything said personal

back story
I have recently started back to play and going through the same problem as many (aim and mechanics) but fortunately I have the "right" people around (Holden Chin) and the best coach/friend one can ask for (Mark Gfeller) but after reading the posts I mainly get the impression that you and a so-to-say new player are very impatient. I LOVE this sport with all my heart and would love to share any input from my coaches and experience that I can and have people like Scott add support to it, along with some of the other fine people that have given their advice thus far.

I
All of the things pointed out I am sure are obvious to such as "it takes times" and "practice, practice, practice" but as a true knowledgeable person would tell you these things can work just a much against you when done improperly. Structuring you practice properly and putting in the right amount of time is what yields the most benefits, so here is what I have to say about that.

Aim comes with time as you get used to seeing the shot and becoming more familiar with it, (just think of how bad players make certain shots all the time and make it look easy even with their bad habits) so ease up on working on your AIM and focus on your Stance/Pre Shot Routine.

if you fail to get down on the ball/line the same way every time all of your "aim" will for the most part amount to nothing and this in my opinion is much harder to adapt and maintain than anything else as we tend to take certain shots for granted and not but the same focus and attention into the shots resulting in a miss on easy shots, frustration sets in and then there goes the set.

II
Shooting random balls in random pockets...as someone mentioned before is not a bad thing if used properly (this is i.e. set up simple cut shots that are for the most part very easy for you (of different lengths/distances) pocket these balls with no emphasis on anything other that pocketing the ball but paying close attention on what the CB does (with a center ball hit of corse) and how far it travels, weather hitting a rail or not. This will then let you know what your possible "natural" speed is hence your first lesson in Speed Control, Relaxing The Mind, Working on Stance/Pre Shot Routine and Center Ball Hit, all in one simple drill with zero frustration. If you do not know what the CB of yourself does naturally how can you expect to know what to do when playing position...that's my belief
NOTE: shoot with the CB and OB in the same spot and observe carefully the path that the CB takes, if it does not travel along the same line then you can instantly note that there was an error in you stroke or perception of center ball.

III
As you progress through your day or drills or what have you a good way to help you "see the shot" is to set up you Cut Shots with the number of the OB lined up as your contact point (i hope you get what i mean) and most importantly keep your eyes on the OB and "see the hit". what you want to do is see if the CB makes contact with the point that you were looking at i.e. the number on the OB. This simple drill will once again accomplish great and several things in a simple package. Such things as "training the eye" (know when u see the shot and don't think it looks right, so you know correct it only to miss the shot with the new correction) to see where to hit on the ball and if you actually contacted the OB on the spot that you were looking at, endless players can not tell you this when asked why the missed the shot.


Pointers
Put the time in, practice (properly), get advice (good ones and from good people, you would have to be the judge as to which is which), shooting racks for hours is not practice, carry pen and paper with you write down shots that come up and give you problem or you miss then practice them next time and try to understand why what happened,happened. Hope it works out and remember.................... you got the 7 ball for life


Scott, Ghost and Island please PM apart from your post reply to lend some feed back on mine, thanks in advance.