I'll tell you what's wrong with Charlie Williams!!!

Grady said:
Look, instead of being mediocre and biased, why not open it up and have greatness?
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So if they make the event open and allow a bunch of players such as myself to join it's going to make the event great? You obviously haven't seen me play 14.1! How many sports can you name that have an open world championship? After viewing the field that has been selected I certainly can't complain about the field that will be competing. After reading your posts Grady, especially the title to this thread, it seems to me that your bitter about not being amongst the invitees (whether or not you should have been invited is a different topic).
 
JAM said:
I'll bet it's kind of difficult for a pool player to read a thread with their name in the title such as this. I would not wish that on my worst enemy. It hurts, especially when it comes from your peer group. :(

I am not on Charlie Williams' birthday cake list, I can assure you, but I gotta give credit where credit is due. The Korean Dragon, as he is fondly called, is not only a champion-caliber pool player, but he has the capability to make things happen. He doesn't initiate fist fights, and when he's in the pit, he is nothing but a professional gentleman. :)

How about celebrating the fact that he is one of several folks who are responsible for producing this event coming up in April. That's kind of cool for the 14.1 enthusiasts out there. :p

My personal pick to win the event? Mika's been hitting 'em pretty strong in recent times.

JAM
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Ever notice how JAM always has something positive to say. :)
 
Fast Lenny said:
Yes i do,that comes from being a big hearted lady,making the best of a bad situation.;)
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Amen, and that's why we love her...can't say that about all people here, but definitely her.

Shorty
 
Grady said:
There just isn't any excuse for hand picking players...Kevin is different because he's putting up millions.
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I nearly fell off my chair when I read this one!

Apparently, in your view, practices you see as both exclusionary and discriminatory are acceptable as long as the proprietor brings enough financial captial to the table.

Allow me to enlgihten you. The same business ethics apply to big business and small business alike.
 
Mr. Goldwater.....with all due respect. It is 9:44pm on monday night, january 23rd, 2006. After reading your comments i called Mike Zuglan (518-355-9811 his pool room number) to check and see if my information about him being invited was wrong. Mike Zuglan just informed me that as of this time and date he "has not" gotten an invitation to play in this prestigious 14.1 event. I do not want to flame this conversation any further, but i just had to set the facts straight as far as Mike goes...............................mike peabody
 
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Zuglan really is a wonderful player, and I was there that famous night in 1992 when Sigel ran 150 and out on him. Mike turned around and ran 148 on Ray Martin in his very next match. Mosconi, who had a front row seat next to fellow legend Jimmy Caras, said it was as much heart as he'd seen anyone display over a pool table.

Strangely enough, when I think of Mike Zuglan, I always seem to think of how Sigel likes to kid him about the fact that Zuglan still gets Accu-stats royalties on a match in which he only lagged and broke. And it's the all-time highest selling Accu-stats match, too.
 
Ouch!! Ooouch!! Ouch again!!

Barbara

sjm said:
Zuglan really is a wonderful player, and I was there that famous night in 1992 when Sigel ran 150 and out on him. Mike turned around and ran 148 on Ray Martin in his very next match. Mosconi, who had a front row seat next to fellow legend Jimmy Caras, said it was as much heart as he'd seen anyone display over a pool table.

Strangely enough, when I think of Mike Zuglan, I always seem to think of how Sigel likes to kid him about the fact that Zuglan still gets Accu-stats royalties on a match in which he only lagged and broke. And it's the all-time highest selling Accu-stats match, too.
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williams

Grady said:
Any 14.1 tournament, to be called a World Championship, has to be pretty much open, not 64 hand picked cronies.
I'll lay a big price that Charlie is in this. Has anybody ever ,,,,,,to know better.By the way, a founder of a men's org. has zero business doing even one tournament. It is a big conflict of interest.
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,,,,,,is making money and you're not.

the old way of doing things(that's your way) has had its chance for decades, and pool has
nothing to show for it. i prefer exclusivity. the idea that anyone can buy into an open professional tournament debases the game.

what is it,,,,you weren't picked?
 
bruin70 said:
,,,,,,is making money and you're not.

the old way of doing things(that's your way) has had its chance for decades, and pool has
nothing to show for it. i prefer exclusivity. the idea that anyone can buy into an open professional tournament debases the game.

what is it,,,,you weren't picked?
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I generally agree with you on lessons from the past, and an open buy in is obviously wrong but if it's going to be "The World Championship" of anything I think it should be open to all professionals who meet some qualification standards. "Me and my friends" (no matter how good the friends) does not qualify as a qualification criteria (IMHO). Renaming the event to "Invitational" would also work. But it is Charlies promotion the same as the IPT World 8-Ball Championship is KT's and they set the rules and name for their events. I'm just sick of this topic since I realized the tournament doesn't start till May 31 and goes to the 4th. From now till then we have to look at Charlie is a____ or Grady is a____.JEEEZSH

Terry< is a not gonna read these posts anymore!:rolleyes:
 
SJM....Gotta love ya man... Have we ever met? i have attended a few Open 14.1's in the past. I was there when Tony made that high run in the last OPEN. I was there when Sigel broke his cue also. Always right on with your information and it is always correct. I just talked to Mike Zuglan again tonight (yes we are long time friends, maybe friends is to strong a word) and he verified what you said is true. In fact he is waiting for last years royalties check to come. I think it was posted somewhere before that Mike receives a couple of bucks for every tape sold.
 
cueball1950 said:
SJM....Gotta love ya man... Have we ever met? i have attended a few Open 14.1's in the past. I was there when Tony made that high run in the last OPEN. I was there when Sigel broke his cue also. Always right on with your information and it is always correct. I just talked to Mike Zuglan again tonight (yes we are long time friends, maybe friends is to strong a word) and he verified what you said is true. In fact he is waiting for last years royalties check to come. I think it was posted somewhere before that Mike receives a couple of bucks for every tape sold.
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Thanks for the kind words.

It's highly likely we've met if you're a serious fan of straight pool. I attended the PPPA World Open 14.1 Championship in 1976, 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1983 and 1986. I also attended the US Open 14.1 championship in 1992, 1993 and 2000.

I always make an effort to meet other serious fans of the game when I attend events, so perhaps we do know each other.
 
sjm said:
I nearly fell off my chair when I read this one!

Apparently, in your view, practices you see as both exclusionary and discriminatory are acceptable as long as the proprietor brings enough financial captial to the table.

Allow me to enlgihten you. The same business ethics apply to big business and small business alike.
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I have to agree, as much as I dislike invitational events (esp those called World Championships which I do think is an important point) how can you not feel the same way about the IPT if you truly share these views?

The only difference to me is that you have been invited to one but not the other! :confused:
 
Shorty said:
Amen, and that's why we love her...can't say that about all people here, but definitely her.

Shorty
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C'mon shorty, you know you love me. Even if you do think I'm a "Chump".
 
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sjm said:
Zuglan really is a wonderful player, and I was there that famous night in 1992 when Sigel ran 150 and out on him. Mike turned around and ran 148 on Ray Martin in his very next match. Mosconi, who had a front row seat next to fellow legend Jimmy Caras, said it was as much heart as he'd seen anyone display over a pool table.

Strangely enough, when I think of Mike Zuglan, I always seem to think of how Sigel likes to kid him about the fact that Zuglan still gets Accu-stats royalties on a match in which he only lagged and broke. And it's the all-time highest selling Accu-stats match, too.
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I was sitting in the balcony level, directly above the table, for both those matches at the Roosevelt in 1992. It really was amazing what Zuglan did after Sigel hit him with a 150 and out. The funny thing is, Zuglan only lost the lag to Sigel by an eyelash. And his opening break was not bad. Sigel made a long tough shot while jacked up on the rail to begin that run.

When Zuglan finally did get to shoot again, against Ray Martin, he was primed to play pool! I'm only sorry he tried that ill advised combination that prevented him from duplicating Sigel's feat. Nontheless, it was an amazing performance.
 
Tbeaux said:
...I generally agree with you on lessons from the past, and an open buy in is obviously wrong but if it's going to be "The World Championship" of anything I think it should be open to all professionals who meet some qualification standards. "Me and my friends" (no matter how good the friends) does not qualify as a qualification criteria (IMHO). Renaming the event to "Invitational" would also work. But it is Charlies promotion the same as the IPT World 8-Ball Championship is KT's and they set the rules and name for their events...
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14.1 surprisingly has a history of "world championships" which have really been invitationals. I suppose it's peculiar to pool, although there is the "World Series" in baseball, which is at best a North American contest. The "World Pocket Billiards Championship" tournaments were held in L.A. from '69-'72. These were invitational fields, and quite small-- I think under 30 players. Of course they were played round-robin, so the winner really played better than did anyone else.

Doc
 
gulfportdoc said:
14.1 surprisingly has a history of "world championships" which have really been invitationals. I suppose it's peculiar to pool, although there is the "World Series" in baseball, which is at best a North American contest. The "World Pocket Billiards Championship" tournaments were held in L.A. from '69-'72. These were invitational fields, and quite small-- I think under 30 players. Of course they were played round-robin, so the winner really played better than did anyone else.

Doc
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I've travelled a bit in my time and I have to say there is a running joke in many places about how certain sports are called "world series" or "World Champs" etc in the US. Don't shout the messenger but it's a shame that these are used so loosely in pool too.

Really shouldn't the world governing body have some kind of right to these. I mean it seems that anyone can simply create an invite and slap world title to it! It is shameful though that after all these years each billiard discipline doesn't have its own annual WC. :mad:
 
TheOne said:
I've travelled a bit in my time and I have to say there is a running joke in many places about how certain sports are called "world series" or "World Champs" etc in the US. Don't shout the messenger but it's a shame that these are used so loosely in pool too.

Really shouldn't the world governing body have some kind of right to these. I mean it seems that anyone can simply create an invite and slap world title to it! It is shameful though that after all these years each billiard discipline doesn't have its own annual WC. :mad:
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Have you ever checked out how many "titles" and belts there are in boxing? This has been an ongoing dilemma with the sport of boxing for some time, not having a legitimate governing body or boxing discipline, if I may borrow your terms! World championships are happening all the time in boxing. :p

Coming back to pool, who IS the governing authority? Here in the States, it seems the BCA has been deemed the source to grant governing bodies authority. In some circles, the WPA is the source to grant governing bodies authority. The Asian-Pacific Islanders seem to have their own governing bodies which dictate where they compete.

JAM
 
JAM said:
Have you ever checked out how many "titles" and belts there are in boxing? This has been an ongoing dilemma with the sport of boxing for some time, not having a legitimate governing body or boxing discipline, if I may borrow your terms! World championships are happening all the time in boxing. :p

Coming back to pool, who IS the governing authority? Here in the States, it seems the BCA has been deemed the source to grant governing bodies authority. In some circles, the WPA is the source to grant governing bodies authority. The Asian-Pacific Islanders seem to have their own governing bodies which dictate where they compete.

JAM
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I agree boxing is also a mess, sadly most of these so called World Titles are orgs that are formed in the US also for the sole purpose of making a fast buck to the detriment of the sport :(

There is a clearly defined structure of governing bodies in pool, the BCA fits within that but the WPA is of course top of the tree, these are the guys who should be organising world titles NOT individual country orgs such as the BCA and def not individual promoters!

http://www.wpa-pool.com/index.asp?content=member
 
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