I'm scared to death and....
- Thread starter Grady
- Start date
sjm said:
I have to disagree. I've been hearing about how drugs harm those around the user, but the only evidence I have seen shows that drug LAWS harm users and those around them.
A society with free access to all products, services and goods would be a free society, an ideal for many people.
pooltchr said:
It takes two parties to have a collision. There is nothing safe about driving on the roads. You could be hit by a drunk driver, or an eating driver, or a driver on a cell phone, or a driver having a seizure, etc. If one is not willing to accept the risks of driving, one should stay off the roads.
I'm not trying to say it is okay to drink and drive, or even okay to talk on the phone and drive (which I believe to be more dangerous). But, the fact is we all no that there are going to be drunk drivers on the road. We all know that some drivers are going to be on their cell phones.
Somehow our society has adopted an "always someone else's fault" mentality whenever something "bad" happens. There is no sense of self responsibility. If it is not fun or pleasant, we don't want to be bothered with it. We want someone else to make life safer for us.
Chris said:
Well put.
I dont' know how much money was robbed from Danny, but let's say it was $5,000 and it was to taken for buying illegal drugs. Let's say that these drugs, currently illegal, were instead legal so the price might be 1/5 of the current price---maybe even less than that what with open competiton and all.
Let's now look at it from the robbers' view point if there was no drug war: He'd need only obtain $1,000 for the same high so his options on obtaining the money have broadened greatly to include more than just robbery. Even if he still decides to rob, in a drug-war-free world (even with the same number of bad guys), Danny would have been 5 times LESS likely to have been robbed for drug money.
Jeff Livingston
I can't believe how fast drugs came into this thread. Drug users and dealers are not the only ones committing crimes. There were crimes being committed way before there were even drugs and druggies. My personal opinion is that there is no way to stop crime or to keep bad things from happening. I believe in the law of duality in our existence. We can't have night without day, we can't have good without bad, and we can't have pool players that don't get robbed without pool players that do get robbed. I agree with an opinion that was stated earlier, we need to get involved as a community to stop crime in our communities. As I have gotten older I have noticed that people care less and less about each other. More and more people live their lives with little or no interaction with others in their community. Everyone is too busy to take the time to get to know the people they live with. (I'm using generalizations here.) If anyone has ever lived in a small town, <1000 people, they would know what I'm talking about. You can't be a criminal and get away with it in a small town, because everyone knows what everyone else is doing. Sure, there are going to be a couple of dope smokers and a few alcoholics that drive drunk, but everyone knows who they are. They aren't going to be armed robbing the corner grocery store. If someone in the community gets in trouble, has something bad happen, or needs help with some major medical issue, the whole community (or a large portion) pitches in and helps out. We used to help each other paint houses or reroof. In the big city, we count on our elected officials to take care of everything. It just seems like a lot of people have the attitude, "screw everyone else as long as I get mine". We should all know by now that the world/society is never going to change for the better as long as we keep going down the path we are following. Whether it's recycling, using turn signals, or the Jeffrey Dahmer living next door, until people start caring about each other and the planet we all live on, things is just gonna keep getting worse. Statistically, more people are killed in the name of organized religion than for any other reason (which is in direct opposition to our greatest religious teachers' teachings). I say let's ban organized religion! After all, Danny was probably robbed so that the robber would have enough money to put some in the plate on Sunday.
chefjeff said:
I think I understand a little more about what you and Colin are talking about now. Sounds like I'm going to need to read some more. I have a feeling that we might not be as far apart as I once thought. I am definitely opposed to the illegalization of prostitution, drugs and anything else that two or more consenting adults want to do as long as they don't infringe on someone else's rights.
How a country is run is still something that I need to look at. I'll take a look at the link that Colin offered and let you know what I think. I am always open to new ideas but I will develop my own opinion. I'm definitely not a charter member of groupthink.org.
Rickw said:
Therein lies the rub - allowing individuals to do what they want, but preventing those individuals' actions from affecting other individuals.
If some guy wants to get loaded on his own time, that's great - fine by me. But if that guy then gets behind the wheel of a car and smashes into a school bus, killing a bunch of kids... then what? Where's the happy medium between freedom to do what we want vs. freedom to keep other people from doing unwanted things to us?
It's tricky. I don't know that there *is* a solution. One would think, if there was, *someone* would have come up with it by now.
Not on the debate of what to do about it.. but a little side story to Vegas.
I spend quite a bit of time in vegas for various functions. I'll admit the occasional game of pool, but usually if I'm out there I'm in the casinos or conventions etc.. Last time I went I was in a huge hurry and didn't have a chance to get a hair cut before I left, to say the least I was a bit "scruffy" and was going to a convention so that wasn't going to fly. A little after hours I couldn't get a hair cut in any of the casinos so I took a cab off the strip and into the "real vegas" to get one done. Take my advice, don't go off the strip come hell or high water. Got to the haircut place, and the cab guy practically lit the tires up as I was handing him the money he was out of their so fast. Now I'm not sure if y'all have been following the Hurricane Katrina deal in New Orleans, but everyone of the people they interview mind as well be from another planet. They are very "tough" and very "ghetto" to say the least. This lady that was cutting my hair spoke (trying to keep it PC hear) about like that, and was basically screaming at me the entire time I was getting a haircut. I'm pretty sure a white guy hadn't been in there for quite sometime. Asked her to call a cab, was told "I ain't no secretary there's a pay phone outside." (Cell phone battery died and left it at the hotel) Went outside no payphone.. LOL Walked a bit, and I swear it was like some **** out of a movie. What looked to be newspapers gently blowing across the street, couple of homeless guys walking, the guy wearing all the gold standing on a street corner (wonder what he's doing). I became evidently clear of the situation in a matter of seconds. Called a couple cab companies, nobody wants to stray that far off the strip.. I looked and I'm only about 5 miles, so I start hoofing it for the strip, and it's getting dark in a hurry. Finally a bus stop, asked an older guy if the bus ran to the strip and no B.S. this guy looks at me for a second, gives me the once over and replies "I don't talk to the police sir."
Tried explaining I just want to know if the bus goes to the strip, no love.. By this time a couple other people are staring at me and a couple of young guys are giving me the look so I said "F" it and just kept walking (briskly I might add) towards the strip. Got about 2 miles and luckily got a cab that happened to be dropping somebody off. I told him about my experience, and he told me he was really surprised that a cabby would drop me off in that area of town, ya know.. me being an out of towner and all. I'm missing alot of the subtle nuances here becuase I'm typing and it's getting long.. but shiat, I'll tell you don't stray from the strip.
DJ
I spend quite a bit of time in vegas for various functions. I'll admit the occasional game of pool, but usually if I'm out there I'm in the casinos or conventions etc.. Last time I went I was in a huge hurry and didn't have a chance to get a hair cut before I left, to say the least I was a bit "scruffy" and was going to a convention so that wasn't going to fly. A little after hours I couldn't get a hair cut in any of the casinos so I took a cab off the strip and into the "real vegas" to get one done. Take my advice, don't go off the strip come hell or high water. Got to the haircut place, and the cab guy practically lit the tires up as I was handing him the money he was out of their so fast. Now I'm not sure if y'all have been following the Hurricane Katrina deal in New Orleans, but everyone of the people they interview mind as well be from another planet. They are very "tough" and very "ghetto" to say the least. This lady that was cutting my hair spoke (trying to keep it PC hear) about like that, and was basically screaming at me the entire time I was getting a haircut. I'm pretty sure a white guy hadn't been in there for quite sometime. Asked her to call a cab, was told "I ain't no secretary there's a pay phone outside." (Cell phone battery died and left it at the hotel) Went outside no payphone.. LOL Walked a bit, and I swear it was like some **** out of a movie. What looked to be newspapers gently blowing across the street, couple of homeless guys walking, the guy wearing all the gold standing on a street corner (wonder what he's doing). I became evidently clear of the situation in a matter of seconds. Called a couple cab companies, nobody wants to stray that far off the strip.. I looked and I'm only about 5 miles, so I start hoofing it for the strip, and it's getting dark in a hurry. Finally a bus stop, asked an older guy if the bus ran to the strip and no B.S. this guy looks at me for a second, gives me the once over and replies "I don't talk to the police sir."
Tried explaining I just want to know if the bus goes to the strip, no love.. By this time a couple other people are staring at me and a couple of young guys are giving me the look so I said "F" it and just kept walking (briskly I might add) towards the strip. Got about 2 miles and luckily got a cab that happened to be dropping somebody off. I told him about my experience, and he told me he was really surprised that a cabby would drop me off in that area of town, ya know.. me being an out of towner and all. I'm missing alot of the subtle nuances here becuase I'm typing and it's getting long.. but shiat, I'll tell you don't stray from the strip.
DJ
a lot more to LV I suspect
I suspect there is a lot more to LV than the strip and the "quarter". If you selected the barber shop I suspect the cabby thought you weren't going there to get a haircut. If the cabby selected it, you owe him one. He was playing games and putting your butt on the line for his entertainment.
I live just outside of New Orleans and the quite common narrow view of New Orleans, even black New Orleans, would be entertaining if it wasn't so sad. New Orleans is like any other middle sized city, mostly good productive people making an honest dollar and not minding working for it. Then there are some happily sucking the government tit, and some more who prey on the weak, the stupid, the naive, and the careless. I have traveled a fairly large section of the US and have never found a city of any substantial size that was any different.
Hu
I suspect there is a lot more to LV than the strip and the "quarter". If you selected the barber shop I suspect the cabby thought you weren't going there to get a haircut. If the cabby selected it, you owe him one. He was playing games and putting your butt on the line for his entertainment.
I live just outside of New Orleans and the quite common narrow view of New Orleans, even black New Orleans, would be entertaining if it wasn't so sad. New Orleans is like any other middle sized city, mostly good productive people making an honest dollar and not minding working for it. Then there are some happily sucking the government tit, and some more who prey on the weak, the stupid, the naive, and the careless. I have traveled a fairly large section of the US and have never found a city of any substantial size that was any different.
Hu
PlynSets said:
ScottW said:
This is where accountability comes into play.......I am responsible for my own actions and should be held accountable if I cause harm to someone else......REGARDLESS OF THE CAUSE......be it legal ....... Killing someone while tuning the car radio .....or illegal Killing someone while driving drunk/drugged....
In my opinion both of these cases deserve the same level of accountability
Just like Murder is Murder......It generally involves some level of hatred......Why should a skin head get additional time for a "Hate" crime for killing a minority than the guy who kills someone who is of the same race?????
It is the governments job to rule with the consent of the governed.....I see no end to this process of creating new criminals with legislation until it goes too far....By then it may be too late
McCue Banger McCue
It's starting in a California City.......An All out smoking ban outdoors in public spaces as well as inside....Pretty soon they're going to tatoo your forearm with a number......
I shouldn't have to register my hand gun, my drugs, my dog or my pool cue (except for the warranty...
)
Cars and boats things of that sort should be registered for use on public road/water ways......not so the gov't knows I have them but to ensure they are safe for use......
The gov't has no business in our personal business
McCue Banger McCue
I shouldn't have to register my hand gun, my drugs, my dog or my pool cue (except for the warranty...
)Cars and boats things of that sort should be registered for use on public road/water ways......not so the gov't knows I have them but to ensure they are safe for use......
The gov't has no business in our personal business
McCue Banger McCue
So....
I edited this message for content.
I edited this message for content.
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ILuvChickens said:
Hmm.. maybe I should ask the people who robbed me of my cues and $$$ a block from MLK blvd. Good point!
Rickw said:
Register them? With whom? Why? What good would "registration" do? What harm would it stop? How would it stop any harm, especially how would registration prohibit drugged driving? Isn't your idea just a milder form of the drug war, but still control over a suppossedly free people?
Btw, driving is NOT a privilege anymore than farting is. It is something that directly involves other people, so the same rule applies: don't intiate force against someone else. The "privilege" argument is made by whom? Those who control you and your movements, that's who. So....?
Why can't people move about freely, without paying for permission from a bureaucrat?
Jeff Livingston
DelaWho??? said:It's starting in a California City.......An All out smoking ban outdoors in public spaces as well as inside....Pretty soon they're going to tatoo your forearm with a number......
I shouldn't have to register my hand gun, my drugs, my dog or my pool cue (except for the warranty...
Cars and boats things of that sort should be registered for use on public road/water ways......not so the gov't knows I have them but to ensure they are safe for use......
The gov't has no business in our personal business
McCue Banger McCue
DelaWho???, I love your thinking about drugs and liberty, but I don't understand why cars and boats, etc. should be registered. Why should they? How does registration ensure they are safe for use? Are you saying there's fewer dangerous cars out there now because they're registered? I don't see any connection between registration and safety. Enlighten me if you can.
I don't even know why cars require license plates. To me, they're just another tax. My wife said, "Well, if someone robs a bank, witnesses can see the license plate and report it." "So," I replied, "With that logic, why don't they require every person to wear a license plate of sorts, so if someone robs a Quick Trip, the witnesses can see his plate and report him?" Her face said it all. See how stupid the whole registration b/s is? It is just another form of control disguised as necessary for safety. And now, personal driver licenses are being used as a de facto national identification system. Now you can't even travel by air without one, even though there's no law that says that. (!!!) Really, no law, just unelected idiots forming TSA policy, taking away your rights...and for what value to a free people?
To me, all of these resources being pissed down the drain make the likelihood of being robbed that much greater, as the real crooks are less likely to get caught, what with the cops focused on these unconstitutional non-problems vs. real crime that actually has victim(s).
Jeff Livingston
