Incardona Fisher challenge match

wincardona said:
Let's put this in prospective,i'm 64 years old and clearly not in the top 100 players( male and female ) in the world. Allison is going to outshoot me,play better under the cameras,and figures to out perform me with the conditions of the set.To me this is not a ego thing this is about a personal challenge with myself,and an interesting match that would be great for our game,and once again I believe she's the favorite. I have a tremendous amount of respect for Allison as a person and as a player and to a lot of people out there that believe there are a lot of male players that would beat her with the conditions that I proposed are wrong.
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PROPS to you for that post sir. I was wondering why you were woofing at her and your explanation was very informative and quite correct in every aspect IMHO.

I have been amazed at how much disrespect has been heaped upon her (not by you) by so many on this forum. This is about the 10th similar thread and the most recent one, several pages down, had over 140 posts...many of them demeaning to her.

I would understand that if she went prancing around bragging about how great she is but she never has and never will behave like that. She is a kind, generous and totally unassuming person as well as being a great champion and she deserves better than to be dumped on.

If I hear one more time that she lost a match to Johnny or anyone else, I think I'll yuke.

WHO CARES???? WHAT'S THE POINT???? She doesn't think she's better than Johnny so why all this commotion?

And after the former thread about how she would do at DCC with so many thinking that she couldn't even finish in the money, the same testosterone deficient loud mouths that took the position that her drubbing of Hopkins and Williams doesn't even count...because they don't spend full time playing pool....are back at it again.

What a shame that such a great champion has so much disrespect heaped upon her.

And congratulations to you for A) understanding what a great game she has and B) being man enough to offer the opinion that you are not the favorite in a match with her.

Of course, you can beat her in a given match and of course, as you acknowledge, she can beat you.

PROPS to you for being the stand up guy I have always respected you for being.

Regards,
Jim
 
bud green said:
I might be the minority but I might actually take Allison or Karen over Billy at this point. I know he is still used to playing one pocket for some high stakes but in nine ball, with the added pressure of losing to a lady, I think I still might take the ladies who are on tv 10 times a year.
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I will put Allison or Karen in a match with Billy for $5,000. I am not sure who will win, but I am willing to put up the money.

I hope it happens, I would love to see the match!
 
wincardona said:
Let's put this in prospective,i'm 64 years old and clearly not in the top 100 players( male and female ) in the world. .
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Billy you can still play someone hole but there is way more players that could beat you than allison...Rotation pool for you is over at this point of your skill level....I would hate to even estimate the number of players that would beat you playing rotation pool...

If allison doesn't play you I think she is crazy....Karen Corr would probably play but she will definitely hijack you for sure no contest..She is out of Allisons league on tough equipment...
 
hkwong said:
Billy you can still play someone hole but there is way more players that could beat you than allison...Rotation pool for you is over at this point of your skill level....I would hate to even estimate the number of players that would beat you playing rotation pool...

If allison doesn't play you I think she is crazy....Karen Corr would probably play but she will definitely hijack you for sure no contest..She is out of Allisons league on tough equipment...
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Really? "Out of her league"???...like Allision would be a severe underdog? What factual basis do you have for that statement...or are you just offering an unsubstantiated opinion...which of course, is your right.

But don't you think that snooker tables constitute pretty "tough equipment?"

Regards,
Jim
 
Johnnyt said:
It would be better for pool if it was the # in The WPBA. For a PPV or TV draw I think Jeanette Lee would get more watchers. Johnnyt
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you may be on to something ....maybe teams / doubles .....? girls v dudes .....?
 
HollyWood said:
I don't have to think about it much. Billy withstood the test of time. He should be able to give her the 8 and the breaks easy! Your boring me billy- But watching the freezer at 500 a rack didn't bore me billy. What are you doing trying to recover your derby expenses. Does Allison get to use the sardo rack and spot the nine on the head spot? I'd still bet on billy. There shouldn't be a woman alive that can hold the stick with you-especially one-hole. Hey billy that was good with the tee shirt (collar) tv table deal. You look good all dressed up mark
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Billy will LOSE playing Allison Fisher 9 ball.
 
Screw Incardona vs. Fisher... What I want to see is Jeanette Lee/LiquidWick vs. Allison Fisher/CueTech. There's Chess Boxing, where opponents box, and then play chess between rounds. Perhaps we can have the battle of cheap cues, and inbetween sets of 9 ball, there can be some mud wrestling or something. :)
 
Races to 5?!?!?!

stikapos said:
At some point, players have to do for the sport or it will die. Here's my pitch. Three sets, races to five. alternate break. No safeties. All push out. The general public doesn't want to see safeties. The want to see pro's shoot aggressively and use their talents. Kinda like a ring game, but better. 30 second shot clock. I would even employ a kissing bandit to disrupt the proceedings at random. Okay, just kidding about that last part.

tim
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Tim -

You must not get out much. Races to 5 is a joke.

Ken
 
Your kidding right?

sydbarret said:
not all the 50 states have the caliber of players of ohio and NC possibly... 500.. no way.
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:rolleyes:

Hell there are a ton of players that beat her.

AND THEY DONT ALL LIVE IN OHIO, I can give the Indiana and Missouri list and it is long.

I get so sick of hear the nit on TV say these are the best players in the world and I think they arent even the best in the state....

Ken
 
hkwong said:
Billy you can still play someone hole but there is way more players that could beat you than allison...Rotation pool for you is over at this point of your skill level....I would hate to even estimate the number of players that would beat you playing rotation pool...

If allison doesn't play you I think she is crazy....Karen Corr would probably play but she will definitely hijack you for sure no contest.
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Grady?? Is that you??

:D
 
Ken_4fun said:
:rolleyes:

Hell there are a ton of players that beat her.

AND THEY DONT ALL LIVE IN OHIO, I can give the Indiana and Missouri list and it is long.

I get so sick of hear the nit on TV say these are the best players in the world and I think they arent even the best in the state....

Ken
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Nah...you're WAY off. There are AT LEAST 25,000 who can beat her...maybe 50,000. And I know them all personally.

And Mosconi couldn't beat any of the top pros today...And Louis would have lost to Ali...And the 1927 Yankees were the greatest baseball team of all time.

Gimme some more time and I can come up with a lot more pointless and unprovable opinions.

(-:

(-:
 
hkwong said:
There are 500 in the USA alone that would beat her 10 ahead for sure not short tournament races but true 10 aheads on decently tough equipment......
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hkwong,
But in Bill's initial post, he spoke of "race to 50". Wherever this notion of "ahead sets" came in, I have no clue. I think several of the posters here perhaps mistakenly thought these proposed match ups with the county champions of Ohio or Wyoming or wherever were "50 ahead sets and man alive, no women can fade that, blah, blah, etc" We're talking a regular old fashioned and time honored race to....whatever the number.

Another thing....How many tournaments have EVER been "X amount ahead races"??? Never. Not one. Tournaments pool is always a race to....? And no one can argue that in THAT VENUE, Allison Fisher is a bonafide legend and an all time great! That's not even debatable.

Another thing...why not be just as confident in the "short tournament races" you alluded to??? If she can win in a race to 7 or a race to 9 or a race to 11, where does that prove that she loses the longer it goes? At what point in a champion's skill level does their game so dramatically drop off? After game 13? Or 18? Or 21? I don't see how or even why you brought up that comparision.

Another thing....Of these two, which do YOU think would be harder to win, for real and be truthful.
#1. Winning a single 10 ahead set vs one opponant.

or

#2. Entering a World Championship tournament that is filled with world class caliber players, all of whom have climbed thru the pro pecking order to compete in a World Championship tournament, and win match after match after match after match after match after match after match and then ultimately, win the title of World Champion? And to do this again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again on & on & on & on.

Which of those two scenarios would be the EASIER to do? And guess what? Allison Fisher has done # 2 over a hundred times so far. THAT makes her the dog against the Boise, Idaho VFW bar table 9 ball champ?
Or some of the other ridiculous single nicknames that have been tossed out here? That's laughable. It really is.

How come Karen and Monica & Jeanette and the like can go so deep on tours like Joss? Or win so many matches at the DCC? And if they can, Allison can't???

And lastly, please don't take any of this personal. This is not intended to bust your chops. I really enjoy reading these opinions, although none of us will agree with all of them. There's nothing wrong with spirited debate and good natured woofing. But people can't start to go Sci-Fi and say there are thousands in the APA who can run over her on a 50 ahead set on old cloth with damp rails and if the lights are dim or theres blues on the jukebox or if the play with Master's Chalk, etc. Some of these posts have been hard to take serious.
 
Terry Ardeno said:
hkwong,
But in Bill's initial post, he spoke of "race to 50". Wherever this notion of "ahead sets" came in, I have no clue. I think several of the posters here perhaps mistakenly thought these proposed match ups with the county champions of Ohio or Wyoming or wherever were "50 ahead sets and man alive, no women can fade that, blah, blah, etc" We're talking a regular old fashioned and time honored race to....whatever the number.

Another thing....How many tournaments have EVER been "X amount ahead races"??? Never. Not one. Tournaments pool is always a race to....? And no one can argue that in THAT VENUE, Allison Fisher is a bonafide legend and an all time great! That's not even debatable.

Another thing...why not be just as confident in the "short tournament races" you alluded to??? If she can win in a race to 7 or a race to 9 or a race to 11, where does that prove that she loses the longer it goes? At what point in a champion's skill level does their game so dramatically drop off? After game 13? Or 18? Or 21? I don't see how or even why you brought up that comparision.

Another thing....Of these two, which do YOU think would be harder to win, for real and be truthful.
#1. Winning a single 10 ahead set vs one opponant.

or

#2. Entering a World Championship tournament that is filled with world class caliber players, all of whom have climbed thru the pro pecking order to compete in a World Championship tournament, and win match after match after match after match after match after match after match and then ultimately, win the title of World Champion? And to do this again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again on & on & on & on.

Which of those two scenarios would be the EASIER to do? And guess what? Allison Fisher has done # 2 over a hundred times so far. THAT makes her the dog against the Boise, Idaho VFW bar table 9 ball champ?
Or some of the other ridiculous single nicknames that have been tossed out here? That's laughable. It really is.

How come Karen and Monica & Jeanette and the like can go so deep on tours like Joss? Or win so many matches at the DCC? And if they can, Allison can't???

And lastly, please don't take any of this personal. This is not intended to bust your chops. I really enjoy reading these opinions, although none of us will agree with all of them. There's nothing wrong with spirited debate and good natured woofing. But people can't start to go Sci-Fi and say there are thousands in the APA who can run over her on a 50 ahead set on old cloth with damp rails and if the lights are dim or theres blues on the jukebox or if the play with Master's Chalk, etc. Some of these posts have been hard to take serious.
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Well put sir!

It just seems that quite a few guys here suffer from real male dominance issues.


She beat Feijen at the IPT...whipped two champions at the DCC...ran 56 is Jewett's straight pool challange after not having played much 14.1 in years...and she still can't beat her dog in some people's minds.


And you know what? If she beat Billy...she STILL wouldn't get her proper respect from those same people.

TOO funny!
 
wincardona said:
Terry you're right on with your opinion,Allison feeds off of situations of this kind. Don't foget how competitive she was against Grady in the 90's when they toured with their challenge matches.And she is a better player today than she was then,picking up all that experience and confidence that goes along with it.She knows how to win and feeds off the cameras, believe me i'm certainly not the favorite but if i'm able to relax and hit a gear it could be interesting.And those of you that think differently are only fooling yourselves and setting yourselves up for dissapointment.Allison Fisher can flat out play and don't forget it.
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Thank you sir.

Just another point I neglected to add is this. Who of the current men's pro players is dominating the men's tournaments like Allison does the womens? I would venture that as of today, Allison is the sport's MOST DOMINATING CHAMPION, not the best player in the world, but the most likely to win an event she enters. SVB is the super stud on the men's side, and after him, it's a crapshoot who will win what major next, right? But we're just entering his second year where he is the big favorite. AF is still dominiating into her second DECADE!

If she were a man, can anyone imagine the superlatives that would be thrown her way?

Many of you may not remember previous great women's players, like Ruth McGinnis or Dorothy Wise. Probably most of the members here will remember Jean Balukas. Great as these players were, there was very little debate about how many men these great ladies could beat in pool.
What does that have to do with my point? The point is this...that there IS so much debate and there IS so much support for her chances should show the astute observer that this is not your grandpa's lady pool champ.
So many people who really do know this sport are starting to really see the oodles of talent she consistantly displays year after year in major after major. All these people can't be wrong.

Allison Fisher is a very elite champion who THRIVES on competition. That does not make her totally unbeatable. It DOES make her a very, very dangerous opponant for anyone.
 
Here we go another thread on this topic.... Hope BGP doesn't chime in here with more of his nonsense... :(

For all those nay sayers out there who are outright against Allison Fisher & any other woman.


Let's hypothetically say a miracle happens, and the top women players all of a sudden make a miraculous jump from their lowly amateur level of play to all of a sudden competitive level of play with the men. I know, I know, it's heresy to say, but we are dealing in a hypothetical here.

If the hypothetical miracle happened, how would you naysayers know?

Most every accomplishment made by women players which have disproved any of the previous myths, have only been followed up by moving the bar again and again. And then saying, now this new bar proves that the women can't play pool.

So, if all of a sudden these women learned how to stroke a cue and learned how to pocket a ball, and actually learned how to play the game the proper way. You know the way all of us pro and ball banger men have been doing for years. Is there any accomplishment that a woman player could make that would be noteworthy? How high would that bar have to go?

I wouldn't be surprised if 30-50 years ago, some had the mindset, that a female would never be able to even compete in a major city championship. Then when that happened, oh well that doesn't matter, cuz they'll never win a major city tournament with male players. Then when that happened, but can they actually win a state tournament....
OK OK... Well I'm sure there's no way that women could compete with or even beat any top level pro players.
OK OK... Well they can't beat any top 100 named professional men.
OK well that doesn't count, it had to be a fluke.. It must've been luck...


Funny how it seems, that the more and more some people practice and gain skill, the luckier and luckier they get.


So I repeat the question: If the hypothetical miracle happened and women could compete with the men, how would you naysayers know?
After all it's really kinda ironic that about all of the ones saying that women can't play pool, couldn't themselves stand a chance to compete with many of the top women players... But of course that's off limits to say...

No juvenile rants or tirades or name calling or any other form of flame wars please... There are plenty of other threads for that...
(Except BGP of course...) ;)
 
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FLICKit said:
Here we go another thread on this topic.... Hope BGP doesn't chime in here with more of his nonsense... :(


No juvenile rants or tirades or name calling or any other form of flame wars please... There are plenty of other threads for that...
(Except BGP of course...) ;)
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Hey Moron, GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!

YOU were wrong, YOU made a mistake! YOU took my statement and tried like hell to turn it into something that it is clearly not. Whether it is caused by your poor comprehension skills or just because you wanted to cause problems. Either way YOU are the one that was wrong

Admit it and move on
Stop talking trash over the internet.

I wasn't even posting in this thread and all it takes is an idiot like you to cause more trouble
 
BPG24 said:
Hey Moron, GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!

YOU were wrong, YOU made a mistake! YOU took my statement and tried like hell to turn it into something that it is clearly not. Whether it is caused by your poor comprehension skills or just because you wanted to cause problems. Either way YOU are the one that was wrong

Admit it and move on
Stop talking **** over the internet.

I wasn't even posting in this thread and all it takes is an idiot like you to cause more trouble
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You've proven my point brilliantly...
 
FLICKit said:
You've proven my point brilliantly...
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LOL

YOU ran your mouth off needlessly once again. I responded to you childishness.

Somehow you are delusional enough to believe that this makes it my fault...

How old are you, 12?
 
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Jeanette is more well known than Allison to your average joe, but keep in mind that the APA is massive, all over the USA. The majority of APA players think Allison is untouchable. I'm sure that a match like this would get alot of viewers on TV if it was marketed well.

I also want to add that Allison and Karen have won a bunch of regional tournaments that had a bunch of male pros and super strong shortstops. Anyone who thinks that they need the 6 out from the guys is wrong IMO. If the table is breaking well, they are going to string racks. It doesn't matter how good someone is if they can't get to the table....
 
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