Is "pattern" racking cheating in 9 ball?

Shortside K said:
...Rule 5.2 of the BCA World Standardized Rules...the other balls in RANDOM order, racked as tightly as possible."

Definition of "random" (from "web definitions"):

1. "lacking any definite plan or order or purpose",
2. "lack of predictability, without any systematic pattern",
3. "having no plan, seemingly haphazard",
4. "having no discernible structure or repetition",

...I welcome all responses with the hope that if I am wrong in my interpretation of the rule, clarification and correction can be made.
Click to expand...

Is it a possibility that 'random', in the context above, means 'not defined here'. I think so and will not share my secreto
 
Meaning of Random

I agree with black-balled. I think you're misinterpreting the word "random." In this case, I think it simply means the other balls can be placed anywhere. Realistically, we couldn't place the balls in truly random order unless we were blindfolded. Then we'd have to pull the blindfolds off then put the 1 and 9 in place. And what if a guy had three or four different patterns he used. It would be hard to catch him if he kept switching them up.
 
Last edited:
I would like to meet anyone that says they can tell you exactly where each ball is gonna end up every time they break. They can get some good odds on it. As long as the 1 and the 9 are in the right place (assuming there are no other money balls) you can put the others in a "random" or "non random" order....it really doesnt matter.

Southpaw
 
acedotcom said:
And what if a guy had three or four different patterns he used. It would be hard to catch him if he kept switching them up.
Click to expand...

Three or four, huh? I'm sure the thinkers out there could come up with multiple variations that would suit their needs.
 
sjm said:
I don't like pattern racking. It reduces the number of possible layouts, and adds a little predictability to the position of the balls after the break, thereby simplifying the game.
Click to expand...

There are ways to break the balls big and still bury the cue ball near the top rail while the one ball is at the other end of the table. It's a safety break that doesn't look like one. Most of the time when this happens, and no ball drops, I've seen the opposing player come to the table muttering under his breath. No matter what pattern the balls are racked with this sort of break often creates clusters making a runout more difficult. Plus this break is totally legal. Have I used it before?? Does the term "art form" mean anything? :D

Flex
 
Donovan said:
Is it? :confused: Hmmm, I've read too many articles...For some reason I guess I thought it was from Joe T? :eek: Like everyone else says, I have no idea if it makes a difference or not, it just kind of a dumb habbit now.
Click to expand...

Joe's rack looks like this. Close as I can get it!


1
3 6
8 9 5
2 4
7
 
I would be glad to create a random racking pattern generating program.

With this a tournament director could issue each player a rack sheet. When they check in for a match they would be given a sheet with 7, 10, 11 patterns whatever is needed for the next match. Then as the games are played the racker could mark the games off of his random sheet.

I think for simple tournament with sub A players pattern racking is not as critical to the outcome.

I think all bets are off on these rules on patterns when players are gambling.

If some one is giving weight they should do what they want this is because giving weight is not mentioned in BCA rules
 
I usually put either 6-7.....6-8.....or 7-8...right after the 1-ball..to avoid early 'something+9' combo
 
I pattern my racks, and no one has ever noticed. I did notice someone doing it to me. Its an acceptable part of the game.
 
No ...

Pattern racking is not cheating. I always put a few balls in the same place everytime.

1
34
897
52
6

HOWEVER, I do think that for the Semi and Final pro matches (TV matches),
that one consistent way of racking should be done for COMPLETE fairness
to both players.
 
It aint a part of cheating nor can it be considered as cheating. you are just either trying to improve your chances on getting an easy run-out or decrease your opponent's chances of the same outcome. though it seems the position of the OBs are pretty laid out nicely, it still depends on what OBs you had pocketed during the break, which OBs you needed to pocket in succession and where the CB is. Obviously, there ain't much of a problem here if you are the one who's racking the balls when it is your opponent turn to break. certain rules had been modified inorder to avoid such issue to arise. like "no soft-breaking or 4 balls hitting the rails on the break". by doing so, the advantage of fixing the balls are then eliminated.

However, regardless of how you pattern the balls, a loose rack,foul ball, bad play and a dry break would render it useless.
 
I pattern rack in "rack your own"

When playing rack you own, I always rack this way.

.....1
...5..2
9...7...8
...3..4
.....6

You would not believe how many nits make an issue out of this.
 
I find it hard to believe people are arguing about how to interpret the word "random." I now understand why we have so many frivolous lawsuits in this country - people trying to find loopholes to gain an advantage when there's no loophole.

Pattern racking is cheating, plain and simple. The letter and spirit of the law (the rulebook) both make it clear that pattern racking for 9-ball is illegal. Clearly, pattern racking gives an advantage to one of the players or it wouldn't be done. This alone should make the intent of the rule clear.

I hadn't read this thread because I thought it was fairly self-evident that pattern racking is illegal, but apparently it isn't self-evident. Somebody earlier mentioned that it was "nitty" for a player to complain about a certain pattern. Sorry, but I think it's nitty for a player to pattern rack. Clearly, the racker is trying to gain an advantage in a cheap way - that's nitty.

For the people who pattern rack - what do you think about rack mechanics?

-djb
 
mthornto said:
When playing rack you own, I always rack this way.

.....1
...5..2
9...7...8
...3..4
.....6

You would not believe how many nits make an issue out of this.
Click to expand...

I may or may not be a nit, but the 9 as a wing ball. Give me a break.

Steve
 
sde said:
I may or may not be a nit, but the 9 as a wing ball. Give me a break.

Steve
Click to expand...

I would have to agree with you here, I would take issue with that rack!!
 
Pattern racking is in no way cheating....you are just using your knowledge to increase the percentages of the balls to go in certain directions. It in no way changes the probability of making a ball on the break. If your a good player then it doesnt matter where the balls lay...RUN THEM OUT. If you don't make a ball on the break, the same layout is seen for your opponent....How can this be cheating...both players are dealing with the same ball layout! My advice, stop whining and play pool.

The rules were probably written without the thought that somebody would literally break down every definition just to challenge them. The rules probably do not change because most players understand this definition to mean that 1 at the top, 9 in the middle and the rest doesnt matter.

My 2 cents,

Phillip
 
pip9ball said:
Pattern racking is in no way cheating....you are just using your knowledge to increase the percentages of the balls to go in certain directions. It in no way changes the probability of making a ball on the break. If your a good player then it doesnt matter where the balls lay...RUN THEM OUT. If you don't make a ball on the break, the same layout is seen for your opponent....How can this be cheating...both players are dealing with the same ball layout! My advice, stop whining and play pool.

The rules were probably written without the thought that somebody would literally break down every definition just to challenge them. The rules probably do not change because most players understand this definition to mean that 1 at the top, 9 in the middle and the rest doesnt matter.

My 2 cents,

Phillip
Click to expand...

Well, it does have some effect. especially if you're using a super slow precision soft break. I had watched and played some matches that racking some balls in that order does give you an advantage. that's why some tourneys don't allow soft breaks. however, it is not illegal as it isn't indicated on how you should rack the remaining 7 balls (whether advantageous or not).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top