Is the Cue Market Down???....

[wild west]

Cues dont seem to be selling as quickly as they used to...
Unless its a Southwest, Buska, Szamboti, Mottey, etc...
Whats going on?? Even great cuemakers cues are barely bringing in the retail. Is the economy to blame? Doesn't anybody collect cues anymore?
Can anyone shed any light on this subject?

-West

 

[shag_fu]

Im thinkin summertime. Usually a downtime for pool in general as people move outside to play golf. It usually picks up in oct. Ive found when selling a cue, you have to pick your priorities, do you want top dollar, or do you really need the money. Ebay will always get a cue sold in a week if you have no reserve and start at a ridiculously low price. You might not get what you had hoped but it will sell. Whereas you can post the forums for free, but the market is much smaller and way pickier.

 

[SCCues]

Cue market?

Cues dont seem to be selling as quickly as they used to...
Unless its a Southwest, Buska, Szamboti, Mottey, etc...
Whats going on?? Even great cuemakers cues are barely bringing in the retail. Is the economy to blame? Doesn't anybody collect cues anymore?
Can anyone shed any light on this subject?

-West

I've noticed the same thing. If you are trying to sell a cue that's not one of the more sought after names you may be in for an unpleasant surprise. It wasn't too long ago that almost any cue could be sold with ease just by listing it for sale on ebay, but now it seems like buyers only want to buy if it's a steal of a deal or unless it's something special. The summer is a slow season for pool and maybe the market will pickup this fall when more people get back to playing pool. I think the economy certainly has hurt pool cue sales and scammers have found out they can make money on ebay with fake cue auctions which has made a lot of potential cue buyers more cautious.

 

[spktur]

It always slows in the summer.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I blame Duke and Shorty. LOL

 

[No Illusions]

I don't believe its down for everyone. Some makers cues still sell in a matter of minutes. Sugartree, Searing, Varney. I was recently at Kevin Varney's shop and he's more busy than ever. Looked like he was working on over 100 cues. He had his waiting list on a clipboard on the wall and it was several pages. So maybe the summer market is down for some but not everyone.

 

[cornerstone]

I don't believe its down for everyone. Some makers cues still sell in a matter of minutes. Sugartree, Searing, Varney. I was recently at Kevin Varney's shop and he's more busy than ever. Looked like he was working on over 100 cues. He had his waiting list on a clipboard on the wall and it was several pages. So maybe the summer market is down for some but not everyone.

things are still going great but every year during july is the slowest month of the year!

 

[cueaddicts]

Is the Cue Market Down???.... West

Yes. Certain segments of the market are still ok but for most cues, they are dead as a door nail. Summers are always tough, too. That adds to it.

 

[Fatboy]

every business except the funeral business has its ups and down, even oil. if the market is bad its time to buy, when its good its time to sell, i just unloaded some watches that market is too hot for to long now and iiI think its going to soften up on certain brands-same as cues, so i sold off a few and am going to move more watches, i have one set of 4 that i'm holding on to for a while longer. you never can get in at the absolute botton or sell at the top but if you get close to either then your fine.

The only thing thats disappointing is the cue dealers bad mouth other cue dealers sometimes,watch dealers dont bad mouth the other watch dealers, and in the cue business there is alot of bad blood between them, too bad everyone loses with conduct like that.

Also there has been this misconception that i'm new to buying cues and the stories i have heard from people on how they are going to protect me, they have my back are just rediclous, i flipped cues for years and years ago then I just took a break from it for a few years(the internet popped up while i was off the air so everyone thought i was new). While I appericate a salesmans tactics to attract a customer and keep them-this angle of protection is like a pimp talking to a ho, If I only heard it once I wouldnt have mentioned it, but I have heard it from about 4 or 5 guys(i guess they all read the same book), and let me say this i have been a life time career salesman and thats the weakest line ever, to try and win over and keep a real customer anyone dumb enough to buy into that BS is a ho, or too dumb to have much $$ unless they are a silver spoon, and i aint a ho or a silver spoon, save me from what? I dont hold it against anyone who said that to me, i feel bad for them-they need to sharpen their sales pitch a bit, i dont take it personal, I pitched on the phone everyday for years and did real good-it took along time learn the trade, if i didnt sell i didnt have any $$$, and i never promised anyone i would protect them from the competion-guys figure it out and work together. I dont have nay dislike for any cue dealer, I laugh at the prices i hear from time to time, but i dont hold it against them, again i feel bad for them-but not bad enough to let them rob me . I try to keep it friendly and nice with everyone life is easier that way, it takes too much work and energy to dislike/hate anyone.

 

[wild west]

Market...

I was considering parting with my collection sometime in the near future...but i am afraid that i would be very dissapointed with the final $ outcome. And to consider the thought of the $$$$ that i have invested, just to take a hit...well, i might just hang to my collection.
-West

 

[cueaddicts]

every business except the funeral business has its ups and down, even oil. if the market is bad its time to buy, when its good its time to sell, i just unloaded some watches that market is too hot for to long now and iiI think its going to soften up on certain brands-same as cues, so i sold off a few and am going to move more watches, i have one set of 4 that i'm holding on to for a while longer. you never can get in at the absolute botton or sell at the top but if you get close to either then your fine.

The only thing thats disappointing is the cue dealers bad mouth other cue dealers sometimes,watch dealers dont bad mouth the other watch dealers, and in the cue business there is alot of bad blood between them, too bad everyone loses with conduct like that.

Also there has been this misconception that i'm new to buying cues and the stories i have heard from people on how they are going to protect me, they have my back are just rediclous, i flipped cues for years and years ago then I just took a break from it for a few years(the internet popped up while i was off the air so everyone thought i was new). While I appericate a salesmans tactics to attract a customer and keep them-this angle of protection is like a pimp talking to a ho, If I only heard it once I wouldnt have mentioned it, but I have heard it from about 4 or 5 guys(i guess they all read the same book), and let me say this i have been a life time career salesman and thats the weakest line ever, to try and win over and keep a real customer anyone dumb enough to buy into that BS is a ho, or too dumb to have much $$ unless they are a silver spoon, and i aint a ho or a silver spoon, save me from what? I dont hold it against anyone who said that to me, i feel bad for them-they need to sharpen their sales pitch a bit, i dont take it personal, I pitched on the phone everyday for years and did real good-it took along time learn the trade, if i didnt sell i didnt have any $$$, and i never promised anyone i would protect them from the competion-guys figure it out and work together. I dont have nay dislike for any cue dealer, I laugh at the prices i hear from time to time, but i dont hold it against them, again i feel bad for them-but not bad enough to let them rob me . I try to keep it friendly and nice with everyone life is easier that way, it takes too much work and energy to dislike/hate anyone.

Fatboy, glad I haven't used that line on you. The slick sheister B.S. kind of gets old and stale, doesn't it ?? Well spoken on the other parts. Hopefully the cue market will come back for a lot of the cues that are down now. But I've talked with many, many about it as the slide has been happening....there's just much more (good) supply than demand these days [talking players cues $3k and down]. I'm not certain many cues will ever regain their allure they had 6-8 years ago. Not unless we see a resurgence in the sport that makes pool more mainstream.

 

[cueaddicts]

I was considering parting with my collection sometime in the near future...but i am afraid that i would be very dissapointed with the final $ outcome. And to consider the thought of the $$$$ that i have invested, just to take a hit...well, i might just hang to my collection.
-West

If you've been hanging onto a stash of Szambotis, Bushkas, Kersh's, SWs, Searings, Ginas, Herceks, Black Boars, Spains, or Showman cues for a while (possibly a few others), then you'll probably be pleasantly surprised. Aside from that, hanging onto them might be wise.

 

[Fatboy]

Fatboy, glad I haven't used that line on you. The slick sheister B.S. kind of gets old and stale, doesn't it ?? Well spoken on the other parts. Hopefully the cue market will come back for a lot of the cues that are down now. But I've talked with many, many about it as the slide has been happening....there's just much more (good) supply than demand these days [talking players cues $3k and down]. I'm not certain many cues will ever regain their allure they had 6-8 years ago. Not unless we see a resurgence in the sport that makes pool more mainstream.

i have been a pitch man for almost my whole life, I have worked in boiler rooms, scammed, and done legit business. The last 10 years I have been flying straight and wont ever go back to the scam stuff. I study infomercials, sales pitches, salemen in all businesses-the psychology of sales facinates me-cycling to the close repetedly and just at the right time is the trick to closing a deal, not talking past the close-is critical. In all honesty I could give the 5 and the pop to most of the sales people I do business with in all walks of life, i was blessed with the natural talent of being a salesman.


I dont worrie about anyone useing any line on me, its just like watching a banger try to play-I just am glad I have more skills in sales than the guy using the weak lines or worse the canned lined he memorized in some how to be a salesman book. Its like being a champion pool player either you have it or you struggle-and I aint no champion when it comes to pool, however in sales I was blessed times 100, so I show enough class to not embarass guys pitching me sometimes. I have also done business with some great guys in the pool world too, some are great pitch men aswell, takes one to know one kinda thing.

I just dont like to see anyone knock anyone in pool it hurts everyone at the end of the day. I let it go and try and find the good in everyone i talk to or do biz with.

 

[third_i]

The whole economy is going down. Sales across the board in many stores are down, there's really three things to blame.
1) It's summer. Numerous reasons here for slow sales.
2) The economy is down. People are trying to save money, the USD is heading south... The USD and CAN are almost dollar for dollar, when was the last time you saw that?
3) Gas prices. This can go hand and hand with #2. People are trying to conserve and save money.

Only 1 & 2 should effect the market of online cue sales but because of #3 factored with the others many potential buyers jobs are cutting back on overtime or if they are in sales the sales are dwindling. Things should get better in fall because if you take any of those factors out the market will go up pretty well, plus with the kids back in school it gives the parents a little extra money and/or extra time. Just my two cents.

 

[Travis Bickle]

Anybody whose living depends on the housing industry is probably not snapping up $2,000 cues right now. And a lot more folks are probably squeezed in some way by the drying up of home-equity loans. Not to mention the dark clouds hanging over Wall St. as we drift toward the usual stock-crash season ...

 

[cuesblues]

No issusions is exactly right, some cuebuilders sell no matter what, but even they are a little soft compared to a year ago. Now is the time to buy cues, I only hope the market improves, I can't beleive what cues are selling for. Another issue is people selling defective, warped, or not "as described" cues on AZB or eBay. I am personally about done buying cues on the secondary market. I think it is time to just start ordering cues new, directly from the cuemakers. So many sellers don't seem capable of accurately describing a cue.

 

[HighEndCues]

i have been a pitch man for almost my whole life, I have worked in boiler rooms, scammed, and done legit business. The last 10 years I have been flying straight and wont ever go back to the scam stuff. I study infomercials, sales pitches, salemen in all businesses-the psychology of sales facinates me-cycling to the close repetedly and just at the right time is the trick to closing a deal, not talking past the close-is critical. In all honesty I could give the 5 and the pop to most of the sales people I do business with in all walks of life, i was blessed with the natural talent of being a salesman.


I will confirm Fatboy's resume... He could sell snow to an Eskimo...
I'm sure he's heard all the pitch lines, including "I'll cover your back"... Believe me when I tell you.. Fatboy doesn't need any help in that department.. He has been around the block and knows cues, and has many resourses at hand to get it done.. A pleasure to do business with, and great hospitality..
Best,
Ken Kerner
Highendcues

 

[Fatboy]

i have been a pitch man for almost my whole life, I have worked in boiler rooms, scammed, and done legit business. The last 10 years I have been flying straight and wont ever go back to the scam stuff. I study infomercials, sales pitches, salemen in all businesses-the psychology of sales facinates me-cycling to the close repetedly and just at the right time is the trick to closing a deal, not talking past the close-is critical. In all honesty I could give the 5 and the pop to most of the sales people I do business with in all walks of life, i was blessed with the natural talent of being a salesman.


I will confirm Fatboy's resume... He could sell snow to an Eskimo...
I'm sure he's heard all the pitch lines, including "I'll cover your back"... Believe me when I tell you.. Fatboy doesn't need any help in that department.. He has been around the block and knows cues, and has many resourses at hand to get it done.. A pleasure to do business with, and great hospitality..
Best,
Ken Kerner
Highendcues

thanks buddy, pool isnt my game sales is.


I'm not knocking anying in the cue biz at all, I only want to see everyone do good, we all have the same interest. I just offer one piece of advice to all the cue dealers(i was a small time cue dealer compaired to Ken and other internet dealers) my piece of advice is dont knock the other guys in the biz, if ALL cue dealers did this everyone would do better. I'm not telling anyone how to run their business just offering a bit of good solid advice-dont knock the other dealers nobody wins.

I like everyone I have done biz with and the guys I havent done biz with, I keep it positive with everyone, I said one thing about one guy and was out of line, i was sleepy and got out of line on a PM, after realizing what I said was wrong I appologised to the gentalman and he accepted it, however i still feel bad.

I'm not trying to change the world but for me its easier to get along with people than to have bad feelings so I keep it positive, that philosophy has contributed to my success in life far beyond pool. I was a negitative person until I was about 27 years old I was pissed at the world for no reason, a friend pointed it out to me, it was a tough bone to swollow but he was right so I over a year or two had to rethink how I treated others and myself, and it worked life got happier and i like it.

Again this isnt a knock just a bit af advice from someone on the internet. Not to brag but compairing my sales skills to pool, i sell like Howard Vikory plays pool, I'm not the best but I'm up there and have been for along time, I get alot of good feelings helping others and my intent of the posts in this thread is to help anyone selling anything to become a better salesman, the trick is to keep your customers happy, not make a score(unless you buy right) then they will be good friends and if you cant make $$$ with your friends who are you gonna make $$$ from your enemys-that isnt as profitable, we all know the $$ is made when you buy, If I bought 25 Gus cues in 1982 I could make more on each cue than anyone else and give my customers a better deal than anyone-thats the way its done, like pool focus on your own game. I'll help anyone any time for free, I dont want anything.

have a good weekend guys,

 

[classiccues]

I don't know how the cuemarket can be down, because I have noticed probably 30-40 new cuemakers in the last few years. Over at RSB they had compiled somewhat of a list, of cuemakers. I bet if done today, that list would be that much longer.
Maybe the above statement is why the market is down. New cuemakers will always effect the mid range cue makers in a negative way. Guys who had worked themselves into the 1200 range will now be out priced by the 600 and below guys. This happens all the time. Factor in the "buzz" and bingo you have a new messiah. Over the last 10 or so years you can go down the line to see the "hot" cuemakers, and who they succumbed to. It doesn't take much to become the new Szamboti, of course when the fizzle is gone, back to the heap.
As far as pricing the masters, they are gone, you cannot get no more. What's out there is out there. So you cannot fault a guy for trying to get a maximum profit from his sale. You cannot get a new hemi cuda and now you pay accordingly, same with Szamboti's and Balabushkas. If there is any dealer, or anyone, that will say, well I paid 1500 for this Boti and ok.. I will take 2000 and be happy. Step forward, I want to meet you, and of course, buy the cue.

To Fatboy: I suggested a branch of the ACA or ICA to include a cue dealers section, or even to charter our own organization, but quite frankly having to wear Kevlar is a bit restrictive.

JV