IS THE GOAL TO NOT SLOW DOWN AT CONTACT

[BC21]

thanks... ...and just so you know it's merely coincidence that I happened to post the 7-0 win...lol

Again, in terms of my fundamentals / PSR / stroke mechanics. I really don't make a concerned effort to follow them unless I'm grinding or trying to get in gear. However you do almost always see the traditional snooker stance, steady elbow, and my chin on the cue.

I did forget that that particular vid had the voice over though. It was motovated in response to some thinking that I'm relying on shot making and don't really pay attention to pattern play.

I'm always willing to listen to critiques of my game, so if any have anything they'd be willing to comment on I'm more than willing to read them here.

I thought your pattern play was smart. Not even SVB gets the exact position he envisions on every shot, but he adapts. And you adapt very well when you happen to get out of line.

When an old friend of mine (known by most of the great pro players from the 1980's and 90's) gets out of line, he says it's no big deal, just has to be "fixed". Playing scotch doubles with him one time I ended up leaving him upside down on a shot. All he had was a bank or a safety. He fired the bank in and brought the cb around the world and left me perfect for the next shot. He said, "I fixed it."

 

[tableroll]

you always hear to "accelerate" thru the cueball
but would maintaining constant speed be ok too?
i understand you do not want to de-accelarate approaching the cueball
i understand finishing past the the area that was occupied by the cue ball ie "following thru" is important
but does the cue stick have to going faster and faster (accelerate) as it approaches the cueball?
its been slow on the forum so i thought i would ask a question to get you thinking and look forward to your answers
personally i think the answer is yes

IS THE GOAL TO NOT SLOW DOWN AT CONTACT?​

I have been taught that acceleration through the cue ball is not going from zero to sixty. It is going from zero to thirty to sixty. A smooth and gradual acceleration. It occurs in a split second and has to be practiced and refined.

 

[evergruven]

in the accu-stats vid chohan vs. busty, mark wilson just said busty decelerates through the cb, tho that's not recommended
come to think of it, doesn't shane kind of do that, too? seems like his stroke often slows down as he gets through the cb

 

[The_JV]

in the accu-stats vid chohan vs. busty, mark wilson just said busty decelerates through the cb, tho that's not recommended
come to think of it, doesn't shane kind of do that, too? seems like his stroke often slows down as he gets through the cb

The reality is, it doesn't matter what you do, IF you can do so consistently. Stroke, stance, aim, running start....

Endless examples of horrific mechanics by the very best all over youtube.

 

[evergruven]

The reality is, it doesn't matter what you do, IF you can do so consistently. Stroke, stance, aim, running start....

Endless examples of horrific mechanics by the very best all over youtube.

hey no skin off my tip, I just found it interesting.

 

[FranCrimi]

Intentionally slowing down the stroke just before impact is an important tool in cue ball control. It's the essence of the kill stroke where maximum stroke speed comes earlier than with a normal stroke.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Intentionally slowing down the stroke just before impact is an important tool in cue ball control. It's the essence of the kill stroke where maximum stroke speed comes earlier than with a normal stroke.

I think the essence of a kill stroke is simply that it has less speed at impact. For us mortals with less than Fran’s talent it’s probably better to just accelerate less but still smoothly.

pj
chgo

 

[The_JV]

hey no skin off my tip, I just found it interesting.

It is interesting... Just wanted to add a general statement that kinda sums up everything.

There's a ton of goofy-ness out there when we consider what the very best do compared to what we're told is the 'right way' to play the game.

It's the beauty in HAMB. Do something enough, and you'll figure it out eventually...lol

 

[FranCrimi]

I think the essence of a kill stroke is simply that it has less speed at impact. For us mortals with less than Fran’s talent it’s probably better to just accelerate less but still smoothly.

pj
chgo

You may be right. I don't know. When I work with players, I try to explain how something feels so they can grab on to that feel. It's the only way, really. What does it feel like to be in balance at the table? What does it feel like when you're out of balance? What does it feel like when you shoot a power topspin shot? Etc....When I explain what it feels like to shoot a kill shot to a player who's learning the shot, I explain it as a feeling of suddenly slowing down the stroke right at the end. They usually get it.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

wow.... we agree on something

I appreciate that we agree. Yet the measure I use isn't whether I agree with conventional or unconventional teaching methods. Students can read (most) pool books to see what is conventionally taught.

Here's what I care about--(prompt) student improvement. I've learned if I have a non-standard thought about a pool technique, it might be what the doctor ordered--or it might not--but testing comes next.

 

[ShootingArts]

Here you go:

I won't call my stroke out of the ordinary. In fact it's pretty much carbon copy of a technical snooker stroke.

I've posted a few videos on ABZ of either Dr.Dave challenges, ghost sets, or 14.1. I wouldn't say the fewing angle is the best to comment on stroke dynamics. I will also fore warn you that I do not completely adhere to my rigid mechnics when I'm feeling good, so don't be surprised if you notice some deviations.

A couple years or so late but I just noticed I never thanked you for posting the video. It was much appreciated but I dawdled thinking I would watch more of the long video before posting I believe. Can't be sure just why now but I neglected thanking you after you went to some effort to post what I asked for.

A nice stroke as illustrated by your success! It does seem like you often hit the cue ball what I would consider late in the stroke, your forearm and upper arm are past a right angle compared to each other. Not a problem and I think it may "homogenize" your strokes a little making speed more consistent.

The stroke is interesting to discuss because there are so many strokes and techniques that can work well. "Best stroke" is mostly to tease instructors. I think best stroke for an individual is the one that controls the tip for about four inches or less. Anything before or after that short length either helps us get what we need there or is purely window dressing. Talking to one of the top instructors in the country I illustrated a pretty tough table length cut and followed through to the joint. He asked me what the exaggerated follow-through did for me. "It didn't add to the stroke. What it did do is prevent any of the things that might have derailed the shot."

My theory on technique is ultimately whatever gets you through the night. I have been scuffed up by many an old timer that wasn't nearly as knowledgeable as I was!

Thank you for posting the video. Your voice over was great too.

Hu

 

[Tennesseejoe]

Something to keep in mind is that your stick weight is 3 or 4 times more than the weight of the cue ball. When the cue ball is struck the cue stick will stop for an instant and then continue it's forward motion until the cue naturally slows down or you purposely stop it's forward motion.
I never think about accelerating thru the cue ball, I just let the cue do it's thing.

John

The cue stick will stop for an instant????

 

[Patrick Johnson]

The cue ball will stop for an instant????

Pretty sure he meant cue stick, which is correct (although I don't think it stops completely). The cue ball stops when it hits the OB squarely, before draw or follow takes effect.

pj
chgo

 

[Tennesseejoe]

Pretty sure he meant cue stick, which is correct (although I don't think it stops completely). The cue ball stops when it hits the OB squarely, before draw or follow takes effect.

pj
chgo

My error...I meant the cue STICK will stop for an instant....I don't think the cue stick stops at all.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

My error...I meant the cue STICK will stop for an instant....I don't think the cue stick stops at all.

I don't think it stops completely on contact (since it's heavier than the CB), but it does slow down dramatically enough to seem like it stops for an instant.

pj
chgo

 

[Patrick Johnson]

If you can somehow determine and control a constant rate of velocity through the CB, then have at it.

You can only do that to the CB (not through it).

pj
chgo

 

[The_JV]

You can only do that to the CB (not through it).

pj
chgo

Quoted a 2yrs old post...

Not engaging...lol

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Quoted a 2yrs old post...

Not engaging...lol

My nitpicky response doesn’t deserve to be engaged.

pj
chgo

 

[bbb]

Quoted a 2yrs old post...

Not engaging...lol

My nitpicky response doesn’t deserve to be engaged.

how can we plan a wedding if you dont get engaged?.......

 

[Bob Jewett]

I don't think it stops completely on contact (since it's heavier than the CB), but it does slow down dramatically enough to seem like it stops for an instant. ...

In response 25 is a plot of the stick speed-versus-time curve. I think it shows relatively clearly that the speed of the cue stick drops by half during tip-ball contact. That's what's predicted by physics (by a fairly simple formula) and what has been observed with high-speed cameras.