Is the U.S. Open 9-Ball Tournament tougher today because of Worldwide competition?

arps

tirador (ng pansit)
Silver Member
Let's rephrase then.... Do any of those players play with the rest of the world anywhere else but Qatar, China and Japan? Meaning that the rest of the world has to come to them, but they don't leave their part of the world...

Shane, Appleton, Niels, Thosten, Orcullo... Those top guys play everywhere. Therefore, they are the standard.

There may very well be "monsters" that we never hear about, but whose fault is that? Not the guys I mentioned. They should very well be considered the best on the world, because they play everyone and everywhere in the world.

they do. if you remember recently, some of these "top guys" went to bangkok before the w9b (after china open) for a couple of money games with some of the asians that were mentioned. mika went to manila to challenge ignacio in a race to 25. morris, hohmann, morra, souquet, ko brothers, etc, were all in the Philippines last month for the MP 9-ball and 10-ball cup. a week before that souquet, morris and a chinese champion (forgot the name) were all in a tournament sponsored by bugsy. these things i mentioned are not even WPA sanctioned events.
if you want further info on where the mentioned players compete in official competitions, just find their names in the WPA ranking list, http://www.wpa-pool.com/web/rankings

(EDIT) also, let's not forget the game that Chinese Taipei brought when they went to the US a couple of months ago - how the Ko brothers dominated. remember the incident when Souquet had to go and was replaced by SVB...
 
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King T

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I agree!!!!

they do. if you remember recently, some of these "top guys" went to bangkok before the w9b (after china open) for a couple of money games with some of the asians that were mentioned. mika went to manila to challenge ignacio in a race to 25. morris, hohmann, morra, souquet, ko brothers, etc, were all in the Philippines last month for the MP 9-ball and 10-ball cup. a week before that souquet, morris and a chinese champion (forgot the name) were all in a tournament sponsored by bugsy. these things i mentioned are not even WPA sanctioned events.
if you want further info on where the mentioned players compete in official competitions, just find their names in the WPA ranking list, http://www.wpa-pool.com/web/rankings

(EDIT) also, let's not forget the game that Chinese Taipei brought when they went to the US a couple of months ago - how the Ko brothers dominated. remember the incident when Souquet had to go and was replaced by SVB...

SVB can play with anybody for sure and is head and shoulders above the players here, but the world is bigger than the US scene and he is among a group of great player in that regard, but not the proven best.
 

JB Cases

www.jbcases.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Yeah Dennis Orcullo is a short stop, Bustamante is a 5 APA, Alex Pagulyan, Kiamco, and Reyes are totally dead money in every tournament :thumbup:

Not to mention Appleton, Feijin, Immonen, Boyes, Peach, Wang Can, etc....

Of course the US Open is tougher now than at any time in the past. Which makes it even more remarkable when players win it multiple times.

Instead of the silly coin flip races to seven on ice bucket tables as contended in most of Asia this event starts out with a race to 10.

Gee do you think it's a slight advantage for Asians playing on the cloth over there in their familiar environment? Just as it is an advantage over here for Americans playing on equipment they are used to in a culture they are comfortable in.
 

JB Cases

www.jbcases.com
Gold Member
Silver Member
Until Shane starts winning the international events he will always have the monkey on his back that he can't win abroad. Clearly he has the ability to win but there are many factors that combine to derail any player's performance at any event. Comfort is a big one.

Johnny Archer has a string of high finishes before he started winning. People back then said he is a great player but he can't finish. Others said it's only a matter of time before he wins a major then it will get easier.

And it did. Johnny proved that once you break through then winning comes more often and he further inspired a generation of players abroad who determined to get as good or better.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Biado, De Luna, Ignacio, Gamez, bubwit chua,LVC..Ko brothers, yu lung Chang, Chang jun Lin...I never said the players you mentioned were dead money but fields abroad are typically much tougher....

I think that's fair, but the US Open had it's toughest ever field. The field is a little, not a lot, tougher and deeper at the top few WPA events, but as you saw, neither Feijen or Ouschan, who contested in the final of the WPA World 9-ball champipnship, came better than seventeenth this week and their four losses came to North American players who don't play the WPA circuit.

Max Eberle and Jason Klatt were the ones who beat Niels Feijen.

Mike Dechaine and Jeremy Soessei were the ones who beat Albin Ouschan.

So maybe, just maybe, there's more depth in North American pool than you realize.

Regarding the question that begins the thread, the answer is yes. The vast foreign presence makes the US Open much tougher.
 

markgw

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not to mention Appleton, Feijin, Immonen, Boyes, Peach, Wang Can, etc....

Of course the US Open is tougher now than at any time in the past. Which makes it even more remarkable when players win it multiple times.

Instead of the silly coin flip races to seven on ice bucket tables as contended in most of Asia this event starts out with a race to 10.

Gee do you think it's a slight advantage for Asians playing on the cloth over there in their familiar environment? Just as it is an advantage over here for Americans playing on equipment they are used to in a culture they are comfortable in.

My point was in regards to someone saying that Shane didn't play against the strongest field because some Asians were missing and the strongest Filipino's weren't there. Basically saying Shane was untested because he hasn't won with jet lag yet :grin:
 

molinatx4206

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think that's fair, but the US Open had it's toughest ever field. The field is a little, not a lot, tougher and deeper at the top few WPA events, but as you saw, neither Feijen or Ouschan, who contested in the final of the WPA World 9-ball champipnship, came better than seventeenth this week and their four losses came to North American players who don't play the WPA circuit.

Max Eberle and Jason Klatt were the ones who beat Niels Feijen.

Mike Dechaine and Jeremy Soessei were the ones who beat Albin Ouschan.

So maybe, just maybe, there's more depth in North American pool than you realize.

Regarding the question that begins the thread, the answer is yes. The vast foreign presence makes the US Open much tougher.

Just because it was the toughest domestic tournament doesn't mean its a little tougher than the ones overseas. Niels and albin have had a great year, this year so'maybe, just maybe, their performance at the open wasn't their strongest outing.
 

itsfroze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Did'nt Shane finnish in 5th place at the WPA World 9-Ball championships

HELLO, That means that only 4 players out of all the great names everyone is throwing around beat Shane, if only
four players beat Shane there what makes you think if all those players came here they would beat him here, LOL.
Shorter races easier to get beaten at WPA 9-ball, than U.S. Open 9-ball.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Just because it was the toughest domestic tournament doesn't mean its a little tougher than the ones overseas. Niels and albin have had a great year, this year so'maybe, just maybe, their performance at the open wasn't their strongest outing.

I think you misread my post. I stated that the WPA fields were tougher.
 

molinatx4206

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Did'nt Shane finnish in 5th place at the WPA World 9-Ball championships

HELLO, Thameans that only 4 players out of all the great names everyone is throwing around beat Shane, if only
four players beat Shane there what makes you think if all those players came here they would beat him here, LOL.
Shorter races easier to get beaten at WPA 9-ball, than U.S. Open 9-ball.

Albin finished second but would anyone make the argument that he is better than Shane??? I doubt it... and yu lung Chang(who won the China open against Ignacio) beat Shane in qatar...neither of those guys were there at the open
 

justadub

Rattling corners nightly
Silver Member
they do. if you remember recently, some of these "top guys" went to bangkok before the w9b (after china open) for a couple of money games with some of the asians that were mentioned. mika went to manila to challenge ignacio in a race to 25. morris, hohmann, morra, souquet, ko brothers, etc, were all in the Philippines last month for the MP 9-ball and 10-ball cup. a week before that souquet, morris and a chinese champion (forgot the name) were all in a tournament sponsored by bugsy. these things i mentioned are not even WPA sanctioned events.
if you want further info on where the mentioned players compete in official competitions, just find their names in the WPA ranking list, http://www.wpa-pool.com/web/rankings

(EDIT) also, let's not forget the game that Chinese Taipei brought when they went to the US a couple of months ago - how the Ko brothers dominated. remember the incident when Souquet had to go and was replaced by SVB...

What that list shows me is that the asian players only play in asia and qatar. (other than Wang Can)

It also shows me that SVB, Hohman, Soquet, Niels, etc all play in The China Open, but your list doesn't play in the US Open.

This US Open had a field that was on par with most of the biggest tournaments in the world. Even if the asians didn't want to come play.
 
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the Professor

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Would you absolutely place Shane Number One in American 9-Ball and 10-Ball,overall? I think that there are more Great Players coming from Europe and Asia. In One-Pocket ,8-Ball(not Bar Box),and Straight Pool,where do you rank Shane?

Yes.. Shane is probably the best 9 ball… 10 ball …. player on the planet. That doesn't mean that he will win every tournament or every match… But if you line the world up to play race to 100 for cash Shane is better than a coin flip against anyone from anywhere.

Plain and Simple!
 

donny mills

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
All I know is this. Take 15 guys who won world titles out of the USA, then see if Shane can't give 13 of them weight playing 9 or 10 ball and horse fu them. Bet!!!!!
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Can someone name 10-15 players who hold world titles?

Sticking to active players:

Feijen 9-ball and 14.1
Appleton 9-ball
Boyes 8-ball
Peach 9-ball
Strickland 9-ball
Hohmann 9-ball and 14.1
Wu 9-ball
Archer 8-ball and 9-ball
Orcullo 10-ball
Immonen 9-ball and 10-ball
Ortmann 9-ball and 14.1

and others
 

donny mills

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Sticking to active players:

Feijen 9-ball and 14.1
Appleton 9-ball
Boyes 8-ball
Peach 9-ball
Strickland 9-ball
Hohmann 9-ball and 14.1
Wu 9-ball
Archer 8-ball and 9-ball
Orcullo 10-ball
Immonen 9-ball and 10-ball
Ortmann 9-ball and 14.1

and others

I'd be willing to bet he can give weight to everyone on that list besides Orcollo playing 9 or 10ball in any format. I would even stake him. Anybody wanna stake one of them???
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
I'd be willing to bet he can give weight to everyone on that list besides Orcollo playing 9 or 10ball in any format. I would even stake him. Anybody wanna stake one of them???

Not sure what gambling has to do with any of this. Excellence is measured in titles, and titles alone are what get you into the hall of fame.

Arnold Palmer never won the PGA Championship, and he was, quite obviously, a better golfer than nearly everybody that ever did. Still, it's a missing piece on his competitive resume, and, in interviews, he has expressed regrets about having missed out on the career grand slam. The great ones want to win all the biggest titles, and I'm sure Shane is no different. He might just do it, too.

PS Shane has lost his last three ten ball battles with Ko Pin Yi, the reigning WPA Japan Open champion, once gambling, once in an exhibition race to 25, and once in the CSI 10-ball tournament.
 

the Professor

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not sure what gambling has to do with any of this. Excellence is measured in titles, and titles alone are what get you into the hall of fame.

Arnold Palmer never won the PGA Championship, and he was, quite obviously, a better golfer than nearly everybody that ever did. Still, it's a missing piece on his competitive resume, and, in interviews, he has expressed regrets about having missed out on the career grand slam. The great ones want to win all the biggest titles, and I'm sure Shane is no different. He might just do it, too.

PS Shane has lost his last three ten ball battles with Ko Pin Yi, the reigning WPA Japan Open champion, once gambling, once in an exhibition race to 25, and once in the CSI 10-ball tournament.

I think the question asked was "who is the #1 player in the world 9 and/or 10 bal"…. I don't think it was phrased asking who is the best tournament player etc….

There are so many variables in a tournament I think you really see who the better player is when individuals match up.
 
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