It’s a Billiard not a Carom!!!

dquarasr

Registered
In conversation among pool enthusiasts it might be strict but in general conversation they are interchangeable. Per Mirriam-Webster (read the full description):


Maybe it depends on whether one is playing billiards or pool?
 

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I always describe a billiard as CB deflected off an object ball to make another OB ....and...
A carom is an OB deflected off another object ball to go into the pocket...
and a kiss was during a break when an object ball altered the path of cue ball or an OB. Like when the cue ball gets kissed and scratched.
 

Pin

Registered
I (think I) remember in Hendricks' that carom comes from the Spanish carombola fruit, and I had the idea that it was red and round, resembling the old red billiard ball.

But on checking now, a carombola is a star fruit, which is the wrong color and wouldn't even roll. So what were they thinking?
 

Jaden

"no buds chill"
Silver Member
S



Count me as “guilty” in using carom, billiard, and kiss interchangeably in American pool. I don’t consider the term “kiss” different other than distance. And even that’s a bit vague for me. Same with ticky. There’s some undefined distance off the cushion that it’s no longer a ticky for me.
Well maybe a couple of you should read those definitions a little more closely, because carom and billiard CAN be used interchangeably. Kiss would be a little different.

OP was complaining about using carom and billiard interchangeably, yet they are defined as basically the same thing where the CB is deflected off of one OB into another.

Jaden
 

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Gold Member
Silver Member
Well maybe a couple of you should read those definitions a little more closely, because carom and billiard CAN be used interchangeably. Kiss would be a little different.

OP was complaining about using carom and billiard interchangeably, yet they are defined as basically the same thing where the CB is deflected off of one OB into another.

Jaden
Totally aligned with you. That’s why I put “guilty” in quotes. I’m not guilty. I’m consistent with the interchangeability.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Language evolves with usage in pool and in every other facet of life.

People refer to shots involving caroms as carom shots, billiard shots, and kiss shots. It's best to just embrace such usage as a normal occurrence. There's no ambiguity here, so what damage is being done?

I recall in another thread, somebody complained that calling a straight pool match a race to 150 (rather than a match to 150 points) was, similarly, in error. In fact, however, this generation of pros, which was raised on nine ball, usually calls a straight pool match a race, and given the evolution of pool terminology, calling a straight pool match a race is fine and completely unambiguous.

While I understand that the most traditional terminology may be what many are most comfortable with, there is no reason to block or reject the continuing evolution of terminology in our game.
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
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Silver Member
... I recall in another thread, somebody complained that calling a straight pool match a race to 150 (rather than a match to 150 points) was, similarly, in error. ...
Note that a match in straight pool could involve several games, such as best 2 out of 3 games or best 3 out of 5 games. Then it would be proper to say the match is a race to 3 games to, say, 75 points each. [While we don't see such matches, I like the idea. And, then, races of races wouldn't be too good.]
 

CRJ

New member
In billiards, the shot you describe would be referred to as a cannon. That is the terminology I use when describing the cue ball cannoning off of one object ball and into another (or when breaking out a cluster). Or more specifically when playing Pocket Billiards, off your opponents cue ball and into the red (or vise versa).

However, I am in the minority and the term “English” bothers me when discussing spin. As a snooker supporter, I have always used running side, check side, draw, follow and stun to describe cue ball manipulation… so take what I say on the topic with a grain of salt!
 

pt109

WO double hemlock
Gold Member
Silver Member
In billiards, the shot you describe would be referred to as a cannon. That is the terminology I use when describing the cue ball cannoning off of one object ball and into another (or when breaking out a cluster). Or more specifically when playing Pocket Billiards, off your opponents cue ball and into the red (or vise versa).

However, I am in the minority and the term “English” bothers me when discussing spin. As a snooker supporter, I have always used running side, check side, draw, follow and stun to describe cue ball manipulation… so take what I say on the topic with a grain of salt!
StarTed with snooker in Canada.....we tend to call it ‘siding’...but I also call it ‘english‘ a lot.
Been to the UK often...so I’m familiar with ‘side’.....more often, in all three countries, I like calling it ‘spin’....
...and using the clock system.

I must confess, the term ‘cannon’ irks’ me...I feel it’s the roll of the ‘R’ in the French ‘carom’ striking uneducated English ears.....and I got Yorkshire roots so I’m kinda hip to how we torture foreign languages.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Note that a match in straight pool could involve several games, such as best 2 out of 3 games or best 3 out of 5 games. Then it would be proper to say the match is a race to 3 games to, say, 75 points each. [While we don't see such matches, I like the idea. And, then, races of races wouldn't be too good.]
Must admit that I've never seen a straight match like this, but if there were, I'd call it best of five races to 150.
 

Cornerman

Cue Author...Sometimes
Gold Member
Silver Member
Must admit that I've never seen a straight match like this, but if there were, I'd call it best of five races to 150.
Steve Davis and Steve Mizerak did such a straight pool match. 2 out of 3, in the first Snooker/Pool Shootout. Davis won one of the frames, running 70+.

To the best of my groggy memory
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Steve Davis and Steve Mizerak did such a straight pool match. 2 out of 3, in the first Snooker/Pool Shootout. Davis won one of the frames, running 70+.

To the best of my groggy memory
Hey yeah. I remember that match, although I thought Davis' run was 58. Good find!
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
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Hey yeah. I remember that match, although I thought Davis' run was 58. Good find!
Stu, what do you think of the format I mentioned -- for a professional 14.1 tournament. Instead of a match being a single game to 150 or 200 points, have it be best 2 out of 3 games to 75 points or best 3 out of 5 to 50 points, alternating the opening break for each game. Of course some people wouldn't like eliminating the possibility of real long runs, and some wouldn't like it just because it is not traditional. But I like it for the prospect of both players really getting to play.
 
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sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Stu, what do you think of the format I mentioned -- for a professional14.1 tournament. Instead of a match being a single game to 150 or 200 points, have it be best 2 out of 3 games to 75 points or best 3 out of 5 to 50 points, alternating the opening break for each game. Of course some people wouldn't like eliminating the possibility of real long runs, and some wouldn't like it just because it is not traditional. But I like it for the prospect of both players really getting to play.
I think I'd enjoy it. Competitive straight pool is about winning, not about high runs, and while the two are obviously related, they are not the same. Runs that end with a miss are not the same as runs that close out a game, and the latter is the greater measure of a champion. I guess the one question I'd raise is whether this approach really does much to ensure that both players get to play. I'm not absolutely sure of it.

Long straight pool races really put me to sleep. I recall attending both the semifinals of the Dragon 14.1 event one year and when I learned that the final would be a race to 300, I decided not to even show up for the final the next day.
 
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