It was my fault, but........

Maniac

Maniac

2manyQ's
Silver Member
.....I still think a lack of decency and/or sportsmanship was displayed by my opponent.

The "APA call at cities" thread by NJ_Qball prompted me to post this.

I had sat out the last APA sessions in both 8 and 9-ball simply because I was tired of the same 'ol BS (I continued to play in a BCA league). So now this session I'm back. It's my first night back (two weeks ago) in APA 8-ball. They put up a SL5, I get put up against him (I'm a SL6). He wins the lag. He breaks and runs the first rack and his body language is saying "no big deal". He breaks dry the next rack. I run down to my last object ball and I miss a tough shot. He runs to the eight-ball but scratches on his last object ball (damn, this guy is shooting good for a 5 :wink:). BIH, I have the easy seven-ball in the side and the eight-ball is literally hanging on the lip of the corner pocket nearest the side pocket I am going to shoot the seven into, slightly off-center. I cannot possibly touch it without it falling in. I shoot the seven in the side, come off the rail for the easy shot on the eight. Guess what? Yep, I forgot to mark my pocket and I sink the eight. I go to my table to retrieve two quarters, turn and hand them to my opponent, and he says "tough loss, you didn't mark your pocket". Yes he did, he TOOK that win. I know that there is no one to blame but myself, but in the spirit of the rule, what other pocket could I have possibly made THAT particular eight-ball in? It pi$$ed me off that he took that as a win and to pour salt on the wound, a rack later when I handed him my quarters for him to rack I told him that my teammates were supposed to "have my back" in that situation and he said "I was going to say something, but you were already down on the shot". ALREADY DOWN ON THE SHOT???? That would have been the exact time to say something in that scenario. So already I'm shooting a guy that shoots as good as me or better and I'm spotting HIM a game, and he has already shown some "iffy" sportsmanship.
Then in the very next rack, I break and run down to the eight-ball and miss a tough bank on it. He has all of his balls on the table neatly spread, basically a "road map". What does he do? He starts missing balls (geez, he hasn't missed balls all night thus far, why now:confused:) but leaving me "hooked" behind one of his balls every time he misses. This went on for four innings (I instructed my scorekeeper to mark them as defensive shots). By now I was so steamed at this guy that all I wanted to do was get the match over with. At the end of the night, the opponents scorekeeper hadn't marked a single defensive shot for him.
Already in my first match back I have witnessed sandbagging, poor sportsmanship, and handicap manipulation. I ain't gonna make it through the season :sorry:.

FWIW, I would not (no matter what ANYONE thinks) take a win from someone who failed to mark their pocket in the above posted scenario. And for sure, if I had seen that my opponent had failed to mark the pocket, I would certainly tell them BEFORE they shot (I have actually done this). I want to win on the table, not by some goofy rule or technicality.

I'd probably pull my hair out if I had any :grin:!!!

Maniac
 
Absolutely unbelievable. :scratchhead:

I just made a resolution to myself. No more commenting on APA threads for me. The system works nicely here, and we have very little crap going on, we all seem to play nice with each other, and get along pretty well with each other.

All these examples of cheating and poor sportsmanship just annoy the crap out of me. It doesn't have to be that way. How some people can look at themselves in the mirror is beyond me....

That really stinks, Maniac. Just beat the crap out of them next time around, and smile the whole time. (And let us know about it!)
 
I had a similar, if not worse situation.

I played in a league years ago that used a cardboard coaster to mark the 8-ball pocket. In my case, I looked my opponent square in the eyes and called the pocket. Pointed to it with my cue, tapped it with my hand, etc. After I made the ball in the pocket he claimed the win because, even though I called the pocket, I didn't use the cardboard marker. Yep, I was wrong. And yep, that guy lost any and all respect from me that day.

I only played in league for a couple years and then stopped. Not because of the above incident. I didn't enjoy playing 5 games over a 3 hour period. Too much waiting.
 
Yeah, I hate to wait to play pool too. That's why I bought a table for the house and quit the league thing.
 
well put...

DoubleD said:
Notice how we never hear a 5 talk about beating a 6 or a 7 who was overrated? You just don't hear 'I beat a guy rated two above me, but is way worse than me.' You either hear 'that five should be a seven and that is why I lost' or 'I was playing sooo great that I beat a six and I'm only a four'. Odd, huh?

I could never find fault with sportsmanship for calling a rule that I knew or should have known. He might be a liar for claiming that he was going to tell you, but it is not poor sportsmanship.

Hell, the only poor sportsmanship that I have heard in this is about you getting pissed, accusing a guy of sandbagging because a subjective rule wasn't marked as liberally as you wanted and complaining about a league that you willingly joined for a second time.

Sorry, no sympathy here. I'm tired of everybody blaming somebody else.
Click to expand...

It's refreshing to occassionally find someone that responds to the many rants in a subjective manner. Your views are absolutely correct. Many people seem to find blame everywhere but where it truely lies.
 
Maniac the guy needed a kick in the privates, period. That would never wash with me. Can't take a win that cheap. That just cheezes me off too.

Anyway last week we had team members show up late. We shot the 2 other players we had. My turn (I'm currently ranked a 2 due to some mechanics issues in my game I have since rectified) he's a solid 5. I took him to the wall. Hill-Hill 1 game for all the marbles. Got down to 2 of mine and a bad lie for him. He kicks 3 rails and drops the 8 I lost. But it took him 36 innings and 6 games and 1 1/2 hours to beat me. I'm still feelin good about that loss. I played nearly flawless. Any mistake he made I made him pay for it. That's one loss I'll take.

Hope ya stick with it.because ya get to play that team later in the session. Remember this, PAYBACKS ARE A *****. Make him pay for it next time.

Mark Shuman
 
But on the flip side, even though I wouldn't have blamed the opponent for taking the win although my team has always reminded the other team to mark their pocket if it seemed they were not going to (After all its all in fun), the player who failed to mark the pocket should have insisted on giving the game to the opponent anyway. This happened to an opposing team of ours. Their player won the match and we were all starting to figure out who the next players were going to be when he approached both team captains and said he forget to mark the pocket and insisted on giving us the game. We said it was okay and to forget about it, but he insisted. Both player then continued the match and it ended up our player won. We could have been at a stale mate both insisting each other take the win, but the player who made the mistake insisted it was the right thing to do. He gained a lot of respect from our team.

All in all though, IMHO none of this petty stuff should bother anyone. It's just an APA match. Nothing too serious and nothing to get worked up about. As long as you play your best game that should be all that matters. Never worry about what other people are doing. Just worry about what you can control. I personally wouldn't get upset any anyone calling a chicken shit call on me, I'd just feel sorry for that person that he feels he needs to make such a call.
 
I'm all better now. I've slept a quite a few times since the night mentioned from my original post. The sun is shining, there's dew on the ground, the smell of fresh-cut grass hangs in the air. It's all good. Life goes on, you just gotta learn to navigate the bumps!!!

Maniac
 
The "APA call at cities" thread by NJ_Qball prompted me to post this.

He wins the lag. He breaks and runs the first rack and his body language is saying "no big deal".

What did you expect him to do? Jump up and down and cheer with excessive celebration :happydance:

He breaks dry the next rack. I run down to my last object ball and I miss a tough shot. He runs to the eight-ball but scratches on his last object ball (damn, this guy is shooting good for a 5 :wink:). BIH, I have the easy seven-ball in the side and the eight-ball is literally hanging on the lip of the corner pocket nearest the side pocket I am going to shoot the seven into, slightly off-center. I cannot possibly touch it without it falling in. I shoot the seven in the side, come off the rail for the easy shot on the eight. Guess what? Yep, I forgot to mark my pocket and I sink the eight. I go to my table to retrieve two quarters, turn and hand them to my opponent, and he says "tough loss, you didn't mark your pocket". Yes he did, he TOOK that win. I know that there is no one to blame but myself, but in the spirit of the rule, what other pocket could I have possibly made THAT particular eight-ball in?

I seen a championship match on TV where Efren didn't mark or call the pocket and the opponent called him on it for loss of that game. It is part of the rules and it is your responsibility to know them. The same thing happened to a team mate, SL4, last night playing a SL6. Our guy was shooting and was left with a hanger on the 8. Before anyone had a chance to warn him he shot the 8 and was called on it for the loss. He argued that it was obvious. Everyone on our team agreed with the loss. It was only one game and of the set and in the end it rattled the other player more than our team mate so we ended up with the set. :yeah:

It pi$$ed me off that he took that as a win and to pour salt on the wound, a rack later when I handed him my quarters for him to rack I told him that my teammates were supposed to "have my back" in that situation and he said "I was going to say something, but you were already down on the shot". ALREADY DOWN ON THE SHOT???? That would have been the exact time to say something in that scenario. So already I'm shooting a guy that shoots as good as me or better and I'm spotting HIM a game, and he has already shown some "iffy" sportsmanship.

If your team mates don't "have your back" why do you expect your opponent to?:shrug:

Then in the very next rack, I break and run down to the eight-ball and miss a tough bank on it. He has all of his balls on the table neatly spread, basically a "road map". What does he do? He starts missing balls (geez, he hasn't missed balls all night thus far, why now:confused:) but leaving me "hooked" behind one of his balls every time he misses. This went on for four innings (I instructed my scorekeeper to mark them as defensive shots). By now I was so steamed at this guy that all I wanted to do was get the match over with. At the end of the night, the opponents scorekeeper hadn't marked a single defensive shot for him.

You had a tough bank on the 8 and you missed. You should have played or safe or being a 6 be able to play better position. Just because you think the other player has a easy run he apparently started to play at his true ability. I have seen many good players run out a rack and then the next one miss simple shots. The other is that is why they call it the one ball from hell because when the other player has a lot of balls just thru bad play it is easy to be hooked. This is one of the cardinal sins in pool. Running down all the balls and not making the last one. You should have never gotten yourself in that situation.
:banghead:

Already in my first match back I have witnessed sandbagging, poor sportsmanship, and handicap manipulation. I ain't gonna make it through the season :sorry:.

FWIW, I would not (no matter what ANYONE thinks) take a win from someone who failed to mark their pocket in the above posted scenario. And for sure, if I had seen that my opponent had failed to mark the pocket, I would certainly tell them BEFORE they shot (I have actually done this). I want to win on the table, not by some goofy rule or technicality.

I do the same. I don't need a win that bad. You will find that not everyone has the same idea of sportsmanship and it will change according to alcohol content.
:winknudge:

I'd probably pull my hair out if I had any :grin:!!!

You are the same as I am. You probably already pulled it out from other situations.

Just continue to play the game and enjoy it. Try not to get upset and if you do then continue to rant here on AZ. You will then get more upset or pacified from the responses. Remember that sandbagging is a art that is learned in the APA.:outtahere:




***************************************************************
 
my first reply to an APA thread, congratulations to me hey?

After playing for a little over a year I've finally made it to an SL5 in my area, and I'm proud of this. I'm a very social person and enjoy the carrying-ons that go with a "beer league" (so kill me when you see me) so the waiting doesn't bother me much at all.

On my way to being a 5, when I was a 3, right before I moved to a 4 I heard the usual "you're way to good to be a three", and just recently before I moved to a 5 I heard the same. I even once confronted a guy (who I now consider a friend) that claim that had "a lot of sand in my pockets" during our match.

Before I comment any more on this thread, I have to point out that I would never, ever, claim a win on a technicality such as not marking/calling the pocket. (During my matches I have no issue with my opponent calling his/her shot but I always mark my pocket. No big deal to me.)

The Sandbagging comments from the higher level players do, sometimes get to me and make me want to play them just that much harder. Yes I miss shots from time to time, even "dogging" the bunnies. I'm working on that and I suspect that as soon as I take care of that issue I will move to a six. When I was a three I quickly learned that to beat a 5 or a 6, that I needed to realize that I couldn't get out and that I should be learning to play safe and therefore got pretty good a putting the cue ball in a jail cell somewhere on the table.

So what am I saying? I don't know for sure, except that I understand that the majority of the posters on this board are better players than I am and you all have information that I can use. However, if I am playing you and am as y'all say "in stroke" please take in the entire picture before you start crying foul about my abilities. And please, after our match, I would love to hear your constructive critisism about my game.

have a great day.

gdc.
 
CK6Speed said:
Their player won the match and we were all starting to figure out who the next players were going to be when he approached both team captains and said he forget to mark the pocket and insisted on giving us the game. We said it was okay and to forget about it, but he insisted. Both player then continued the match and it ended up our player won. We could have been at a stale mate both insisting each other take the win, but the player who made the mistake insisted it was the right thing to do. He gained a lot of respect from our team.
Click to expand...

Recently I had a similiar situation happen to me. I was watching the guy run out and he finally fires the 8 in. I go to drop the balls and he says, "You won that game.", I thought he was just saying how I was suppose to get out and didn't. I told him, "No I didn't, you dropped the 8 so you won.". And he says again, "No, you won... I double hit the cue ball.". I looked at him and said I didn't see it. And he insists that he double hit the cue ball and I had the win. I look at my team mates like, "What the hell do i do?". I finally said, "Let's let fate decide, call it." And I flipped a coin. He lost.
 
Our APA league has gotten a bit *too* much into sportsmanship lately. Besides the obvious "failure to call the 8", we also have to warn a player *before* he/she commits a double-hit, and advise them how they can avoid double-hitting.

I'm actually advocating the opposite. If the rulebooks says you have to mark the pocket, then mark the pocket! Make it illegal for the other team to concede a game if the opposing player didn't mark the pocket. After losing a game that way once, a player is likely to do so again. Either that, or change the rules to state that obvious pockets don't have to be marked. This dual set of rules is, frankly, bullshit...
 
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