Agreed.
Runout pool is boring to watch. I appreciate the skill it takes, and recognize the players are amazing.
Still, I'm far more interested in a match when both players are battling for each rack. Seeing them face some adversity.
Japan Open pocket sizes, are they nuts?
- Thread starter hang-the-9
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Agreed.
Runout pool is boring to watch. I appreciate the skill it takes, and recognize the players are amazing.
Still, I'm far more interested in a match when both players are battling for each rack. Seeing them face some adversity.
In my opinion,pros face adversity aplenty playing on a standard diamond table. IMO, the average run out % on that equipment does not show me that it is too easy. Every now and then someone runs a nice package in a tourney (speaking only of rotation based games), but rather infrequently IMO. When they do, it is memorable.
All said, loosen the pocket up, tighten them, or just leave them the same. Just establish a standard and roll with it. Standards are needed to add legitimacy to pool.
Agreed one hundred percent.
I agree with that completely, but those standards should not be made 4.5 inch pockets or the game as a "Sport" will never have the respect of the viewing public. Part of what makes snooker amazing to the spectators is the fact that they know just how hard it is to perform successfully. Professional tables should be hard enough to play on that people know they cannot do what they are watching being done by the pros.
Let the peons keep playing league pool on bar boxes, let the professionals play on 5x10 diamonds with 4 1/8 or 4 1/4 inch pockets cut properly like the Fatboy rails were.
There are chip and putt golf courses, those are great for the noobs, but no one wants to watch Tiger, Phil, and Rory do battle on one and as long as pool keeps giving the viewing public that the only thing that will continue to happen is them deciding to tune out.
It's not just the width
Hi,
Before you decide that the table in the photograph plays tough, check the pocket shelf. It's difficult to judge how deep it is, but it is best seen on the lower right pocket. I estimate one inch or less.
Not a tough table.
Take care,
Nick
Hi,
Before you decide that the table in the photograph plays tough, check the pocket shelf. It's difficult to judge how deep it is, but it is best seen on the lower right pocket. I estimate one inch or less.
Not a tough table.
Take care,
Nick
Standards are like rules - they are there to be broken or changed.
Football (Soccer), Basketball, Tennis, Formula 1 - lots of sports change standards and regulations.
They are changed to make the sport either more exciting or more difficult
All said, loosen the pocket up, tighten them, or just leave them the same. Just establish a standard and roll with it. Standards are needed to add legitimacy to pool.[/QUOTE]
What he said... :thumbup:
What he said... :thumbup:
Tell that to the slew of woman who have come from snooker to 9 ball and dominated
If pool payed like snooker in the men's ranks more men would try but why ? Ronnie did try a little but never really dedicated anytime I'm sure if he had he would have been a top pool player also
1
Jimmy White was a beast of a pool player despite the limited time he played the game. He was very close to world class despite his very limited time playing the game and might very well have been a world champion had he competed regularly.
Marlon Manalo is/was a snooker player prior to moving over to pool as the story goes and he is world class at pool for sure.
Mechanically precise pool is probably the most closely represented by the Taiwanese and they seem to do ok on the world stage. I have to say, I disagree with Petros quite a lot. The reality is that the loose pockets are in fact the reason that people with questionable mechanics are able to still compete.
I don't watch match snooker but my hat is off to those guys for sure. I played for a couple of hours on a 6 X 12 snooker table in London several years ago. Really fun but super challenging. Part of what makes pool great to me are all of the banks, kicks, caroms etc. I suspect that as pockets approach 4 inches and less, one would see players shoot less of those types of shots. Could be wrong though. I would guess that I have watched about 3 hours of snooker in my life. I saw no bank shots in that time and the Kentuckian in me silently wept...
Banks happen in snooker, but only if a safety isn't on, or they're close to making a big break.I don't watch match snooker but my hat is off to those guys for sure. I played for a couple of hours on a 6 X 12 snooker table in London several years ago. Really fun but super challenging. Part of what makes pool great to me are all of the banks, kicks, caroms etc. I suspect that as pockets approach 4 inches and less, one would see players shoot less of those types of shots. Could be wrong though. I would guess that I have watched about 3 hours of snooker in my life. I saw no bank shots in that time and the Kentuckian in me silently wept...
You see it in english pool more. Basically a small snooker table. Sometimes its easier to bank a ball in english pool than it is to cut a ball down the rail.
I've seen maybe 3 length of table banks in my life playing snooker and only 1 3 rail bank. All were when the frame was over and they needed it to make a century or tournament high break. Fun to see but very difficult to do on a snooker table.
I think that I also played on one of those English pool tables. It was maybe 6 feet long or so and the balls were smaller than american pool balls. Played with conical tapered cues with very small diameter tips. I played on the table for an hour or two but there was no one in the bar to ask about the game. I did make some bank shots on it though ha ha.
Tables either come in 7x3.5 or 6x3 and pockets tend to vary in difficulty. Balls close to or touching the rails tend to rattle so you need to get the pocket speed down for different tables...which can kind of zap all the fun out of it since you get stuck with only one type of shot.
The balls are small, very small in comparison to the American game. OBs are 2" and the CB is 1 7/8". If you're used to playing on a 9ft table you think its a childs table, until you play on one that is. Accuracy is the key in this game and you won't see many balls hammered in.
If you ever get chance, watch the match on youtube between Selby and Appleton. They make it look effortless. Appleton was a great English 8 ball player, but Selby schooled him on how it should be played on that occasion. I think he missed 2 shots or something ridiculous all match.
In pool different games are played with different objectives. It is not like say golf or tennis. In respect to one pocket you don't really want a super tight table. The problem with one pocket is, when you play a safety there needs to be an element of danger for the incoming player. If the pockets are so tight you need a perfect shot for the ball to go in, the nature of the game dies.
All you need to play a safe then is put the guy up table and he is probably safe. Super tight pockets also make it very easy to take a ball out. I believe pool tables don't need anything smaller then 4 1/2" pockets to provide a good challenge as well as good offensive play to entertain the spectator.
Aww I remember when Daz had hair!
Yeah, except the China Open a few months ago, easily as prestigious as the Japan Open, was played on unusually loose equipment.
Sorry, but the blanket statement that Asia gets it is false.
Equally clear is that the China Open produced a final of Wu vs Van Cortezza, not the best breakers like Ko Pin Yi, JL Chang or Jeff DeLuna. The cream rises to the top whatever equipment you use.
Finally, if they are using 4" pockets, then they are, as the original poster suggests, nuts.
FWIW, my opinion is that whatever size the balls may be on any particular table (pool, snooker, English pool, etc.), two balls should never be able to go into the pocket jaws simultaneously. In other words, I think 4 1/4" pockets should be the standard (if there ever is one) for American pool.
I too have always thought the running out of rack after rack (packages) in professional pool to be boring. I like a well fought-out battle that requires some brainpower.
Ten foot tables for the "pros" are fine, as It doesn't appear that the extra foot is slowing down most of the upper tier pro players. I just don't think we are EVER going to see a pool hall with more than a few (at most) of them on premise because of the tables-per-square-foot factor.
Good thread!!!
Maniac
I too have always thought the running out of rack after rack (packages) in professional pool to be boring. I like a well fought-out battle that requires some brainpower.
Ten foot tables for the "pros" are fine, as It doesn't appear that the extra foot is slowing down most of the upper tier pro players. I just don't think we are EVER going to see a pool hall with more than a few (at most) of them on premise because of the tables-per-square-foot factor.
Good thread!!!
Maniac
I've seen that type of table in use in other tournaments and the pockets at least on the one they were streaming were a lot tighter. Unless I am seeing the size wrong, those are way too small to use on anything aside from a specially setup table for someone. It's basically the type of setup that a gambler would use when they make a game to play on "table 4 on 3pm during March 10th or I'm not playing you", meaning specially setup for someone to play good on but cause fits for most others.