John Schmidt's and Corey Deuel's comments on aiming systems

[Welder84]

Yep, CTE users have different "shot pictures".... Correct ones. I feel bad for you that you will likely never experience it. I think you don't even like pool really.

How would you ever know what shots any given person has seen anyway? Sometimes you need to think a little deeper Joey and understand that it's extremely unlikely that any amateur has shot any particular shot hundreds much less thousands of times. And you have no idea what anyone's make percentage is on the breadth of shots they have taken.

CTE literally allows the user to get in the correct shot line for shots they have never taken. It can't be explained to you how this feels. When you don't know you really don't know.

You argue against CTE from an abstract perspective based on your imagination and cte users argue from experience. The joy a cte user feels making sick shots that they were previously scared of or wouldn't have even tried is pretty much forever out of your reach.

You might make one occasionally but it's doubtful you can repeat it consistently whereas a cte user can repeat it consistently. I really wish that you could experience it but I am pretty sure that you have invested so much of your life trying to knock it that you couldn't ever bring yourself to learn cte.

So while you knock, cte aimers rock. We are out making shots and enjoying pool while you spend time knocking something you really don't understand. And to be clear, you don't understand it, at all.

(Yes Pat I know you are going to chirp with your go-to claim that cte users don't understand what they are doing either, but we most certainly do and more importantly we enjoy pool much more by being able to precisely aim.)

So I respect all the CTE people for putting in the work and R&D involved with their system. Aiming is tied to your pre-shot routine and alignment.

. So as long as a player has the correct alignment and pre-shot routine they can be consistent.

.

So an aiming system might be something an advanced player could add to their (gender neutral) arsenal, but why would a beginner take on the extra burden. Aiming systems are technical and life is short. Great pool has been played for decades by consistently doing the same alignment and pre-shot routine. We know this is the preferred method of most past champions.

0.02 cents

 

[JB Cases]

Prove.

Smooth.

So I respect all the CTE people for putting in the work and R&D involved with their system. Aiming is tied to your pre-shot routine and alignment.

. So as long as a player has the correct alignment and pre-shot routine they can be consistent.

.

So an aiming system might be something an advanced player could add to their (gender neutral) arsenal, but why would a beginner take on the extra burden. Aiming systems are technical and life is short. Great pool has been played for decades by consistently doing the same alignment and pre-shot routine. We know this is the preferred method of most past champions.

0.02 cents

Because a beginner armed with an accurate and objective aiming system starts out with an excellent tool to build with.

My daughter is starting to show interest in pool and she wants to wing it with little success. The other night I asked her if she would be interested in learning to aim better and she sighed and said she already knows the ghost ball thing I showed her before (which she doesn't use). I said well I have a better way if you want. She said ok and I taught her basic 90/90. I demonstrated it very slowly and she goes, "I see what you did there". Then she tried a few shots and her eyes lit up and she was excited when she pocketed the balls.

At the core pool is about intention and control. The joy comes in making the cue ball do what you intended it to do. So I gave her a small introduction to an aiming method that compliments her intention to pocket the ball. Immediately, despite a terrible stroke and a wobbly bridge she began making more shots.

I see no valid reason why beginners can't benefit from learning to aim objectively. I see a lot of downsides to not learning to aim objectively.

 

[straightline]

You mean sinking the ball? What's that prove?

 

[Welder84]

Smooth.

Because a beginner armed with an accurate and objective aiming system starts out with an excellent tool to build with.

My daughter is starting to show interest in pool and she wants to wing it with little success. The other night I asked her if she would be interested in learning to aim better and she sighed and said she already knows the ghost ball thing I showed her before (which she doesn't use). I said well I have a better way if you want. She said ok and I taught her basic 90/90. I demonstrated it very slowly and she goes, "I see what you did there". Then she tried a few shots and her eyes lit up and she was excited when she pocketed the balls.

At the core pool is about intention and control. The joy comes in making the cue ball do what you intended it to do. So I gave her a small introduction to an aiming method that compliments her intention to pocket the ball. Immediately, despite a terrible stroke and a wobbly bridge she began making more shots.

I see no valid reason why beginners can't benefit from learning to aim objectively. I see a lot of downsides to not learning to aim objectively.

So I can take your daughter and teach her to step into a shot line get down, close her eyes and make the shot.

I am not saying CTE is bad (it looks well though out). I am just saying it's not needed to play well. Why make pool more complicated for beginners?

Lee Brett will explain it's simple...

.

 

[JoeyInCali]

So I respect all the CTE people for putting in the work and R&D involved with their system. Aiming is tied to your pre-shot routine and alignment.

. So as long as a player has the correct alignment and pre-shot routine they can be consistent.

.

So an aiming system might be something an advanced player could add to their (gender neutral) arsenal, but why would a beginner take on the extra burden. Aiming systems are technical and life is short. Great pool has been played for decades by consistently doing the same alignment and pre-shot routine. We know this is the preferred method of most past champions.

0.02 cents

They shouldn't.
Learning to send the cue ball consistently to the spot you intend to send it to is the number one priority .

These aiming system junkees are whacked.

 

[Welder84]

They shouldn't.
Learning to send the cue ball consistently to the spot you intend to send it to is the number one priority .

These aiming system junkees are whacked.

I agree with the cue ball consistency. I am not name calling (whacked). Aiming systems can work, but why make things more complicated.

Besides shot alignment, extending the bridge arm and locking the shooters head makes straight shots automatic. Adding English, power and speed control then add more variables that have to be learned with practice.

There are no short cuts to practicing these skills and they can never be completely mastered (that is because the human body is always changing). One reason older players switch to one pocket often as the speed is removed from their break shot (to many Birthday syndrome).

As players age trying to learn how to aim would be a total waste of time. Older players are better served with exercise.

My 0.02 cents

 

[cookie man]

These aiming system junkees are whacked.

You are the freaking whack job, coming on here talking about things you have no knowledge of or interest in using.
No one is going to stop using an aiming system of any kind because of some stupid shit Joey posted on AZ.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I agree with the cue ball consistency. I am not name calling (whacked). Aiming systems can work, but why make things more complicated.

Besides shot alignment, extending the bridge arm and locking the shooters head makes straight shots automatic. Adding English, power and speed control then add more variables that have to be learned with practice.

There are no short cuts to practicing these skills and they can never be completely mastered (that is because the human body is always changing). One reason older players switch to one pocket often as the speed is removed from their break shot (to many Birthday syndrome).

As players age trying to learn how to aim would be a total waste of time. Older players are better served with exercise.

My 0.02 cents

When a beginner and actually most intermediate players can't even consistently stroke straight and you start teaching them some pivoting/twitching system, you are whacked .
They even teach this pivoting thingy on a straight-in shot .
Then they claim pros disguise their pivoting .
Thank God there are still no-gimmick instructors like Tor Lowry, Mark Wilson and Niels Feijen .

 

[cookie man]

When a beginner and actually most intermediate players can't even consistently stroke straight and you start teaching them some pivoting/twitching system, you are whacked .
They even teach this pivoting thingy on a straight-in shot .
Then they claim pros disguise their pivoting .
Thank God there are still no-gimmick instructors like Tor Lowry, Mark Wilson and Niels Feijen .

When TOP amateurs and good Pro players decide to learn an aiming system I pay attention to them.
I'd rather learn what they are learning then pay attention to some nobody whack job on AZ.

PS one of those good amateurs played on Mark Wilson's college team. Funny thing is, Mark never objected to an aiming system being used.

 

[Welder84]

When TOP amateurs and good Pro players decide to learn an aiming system I pay attention to them.
I'd rather learn what they are learning then pay attention to some nobody whack job on AZ.

PS one of those good amateurs played on Mark Wilson's college team. Funny thing is, Mark never objected to an aiming system being used.

Aiming system....

 

[JoeyInCali]

I believe Niels Feijen and Tor Lowry over magic pill franchisees .

 

[iusedtoberich]

Damn this thread is still going strong 10 years later? I remember watching the TAR interview live and cracking up when Schmidt made the ball with the side of the stick while talking about aiming systems.

 

[JoeyInCali]

That is incredible.
And fidgeting after going down is a no-no for them.

 

[JB Cases]

So I can take your daughter and teach her to step into a shot line get down, close her eyes and make the shot.

I am not saying CTE is bad (it looks well though out). I am just saying it's not needed to play well. Why make pool more complicated for beginners?

Lee Brett will explain it's simple...

.

You can't teach my daughter to aim better than I can. We can bet real high on that.

We can take any two non pool players and you can let Brett coach yours and I will let Hunter coach mine and every month for six months they match up for ten thousand.

I will bet my 15,000 to your 10,000 each month that my player beats yours.

Each month's loser pays all of the associated costs for coaching hours, lodging etc....

I know the value of what I am speaking about. I know what benefit a player gets from learning to aim accurately from the beginning. What you see as complicated is just laying down a solid foundation to build a solid game on.

The reason, in my opinion, that some folks don't see this is because they think aiming is a by product of stroking straight. You can teach a blind person to stroke straight. You can teach a blind person to have a perfect looking pre-shot routine.

All else being equal though the player with better aiming skill will prevail more often over an opponent whose aiming accuracy is even a few percent less.

This manifests over many games where the aiming errors cause missed shots at critical times. Doesn't take that many to lose a match.

I get the romantic gunslinger vibe where people think that pool is all about grit and heart and table time. I used to think exactly that. I thought aiming was just something that came with brute force repetition.

Thanks to many people who have worked on this part of the game though aiming is gaining traction and being recognized as a part of the game that is a deep subject and deserving of a complete rethinking about how we approach it.

Aiming can be a far more objective skill and done with a way higher degree of precision thanks to the various systems available now. But adoption of those systems will always be met with derision from those who think that pool excellence is only obtained through a million ball's worth of table time.

I know players who are in the pool room every day for hours and they have not improved in four years. I try to learn something new every time I spend an hour by myself on a table.

What cte does for me is eliminate the need to have practiced all possible shots at least 200 times to be able to make them consistently. With an objective and accurate system I can aim any shot that will go directly into a pocket, even if I have never taken that shot before, and have a really good chance to make it.

That's very strong and immediately recognizable for the value to any player at any level once they get a real good taste of it on the table. Discussing it here is just words on a screen.

Typing a million words telling you how great cte is is worth less than you experiencing it for yourself for one hour.

 

[JB Cases]

I believe Niels Feijen and Tor Lowry over magic pill franchisees .

There are no magic pill franchises. Your preferences are really meaningless anyway. You're a low level player who has not improved at all in the past decade from what mutual aquaintenences have told me.

Maybe you just like to talk about playing pool more than you like actually playing pool.

What I see though is a person who knocks those who are teaching and improving those who do want to get better. I see a person who spends a lot of time trying to prevent others from exploring aiming methods and one who has a particular vendetta against one particular system.

Because I haven't seen you knocking any other method directly nor directly calling out any other instructors who teach aiming systems. You're just really fixated on one.

Do you know that you're unknown? That's right, your name means literally nothing to the majority of players. But with a view count in the millions there are millions who know about cte and other aiming systems. They get introduced to those systems by people who care enough to make thoughtful videos and blog entries on the subject. In contrast you simply troll this forum and add your opinion to the cacophony of opinion with the result being that your opinion makes less of a impact than a pebble thrown into the ocean.

But keep going. You now have Niels as your current guiding light so use whatever you can do repeat your opinion as long as you want to spend your time doing so. Others, like me, will continue to explore and enjoy them journey and get joy from the results.

 

[JB Cases]

Damn this thread is still going strong 10 years later? I remember watching the TAR interview live and cracking up when Schmidt made the ball with the side of the stick while talking about aiming systems.

And..... John was wrong and later recanted what he said.

 

[JB Cases]

JBNC , you are like a fly buzzing around explaining why shit is better than honey to whoever..no offense but your shit is old

Sorry but you can't tell the difference between shit and Shinola.

 

[JB Cases]

This is retarded.

Is it? Well then explain how cte needs contact points?

 

[JB Cases]

JBNC , you are like a fly buzzing around explaining why shit is better than honey to whoever..no offense but your shit is old

Flies don't bother with old shit, they prefer the good shit. And to a fly good shit is worth far more than honey.

Of course you meant to give offense. It's ok your comments are as valuable to this topic as an annoying gnat on a pretty summer night. Meaning just a minor bug that won't change the expanse of majesty being enjoyed.

 

[JB Cases]

I agree with the cue ball consistency. I am not name calling (whacked). Aiming systems can work, but why make things more complicated.

Besides shot alignment, extending the bridge arm and locking the shooters head makes straight shots automatic. Adding English, power and speed control then add more variables that have to be learned with practice.

There are no short cuts to practicing these skills and they can never be completely mastered (that is because the human body is always changing). One reason older players switch to one pocket often as the speed is removed from their break shot (to many Birthday syndrome).

As players age trying to learn how to aim would be a total waste of time. Older players are better served with exercise.

My 0.02 cents

No one who teaches aiming systems has ever claimed that learning to aim is a shortcut to building all of the other skills. It is a foundation to build those skills on.

Also you are so incorrect about the benefit to older players. I have had so many older players say that learning to aim accurately has revived their love of pool and kept them playing.

You can find such testimonials on this forum as a matter of fact.